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Secondaries in LIM make no sense...

Pudmunkie said:
Unless you're doing Auto-x with 110 mile sweepers you will be better served by a more robust power curve (3 liter). You will also enjoy the daily drive-ability of the 3 liter manifolds.

Port matched swaps are so antiquated and hodge podge I can't believe people still do them. Then again there are quite a few retards in the world.
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So tell me friend, just how retarded would you feel when you take your car for a smog check and they fail it for illegal equipment? How would you feel when you learn that you need to return it to stock or you can't register it?

You are far more likely to pass if when they open the hood it looks like stock.
 
Mine def doesn't fall off after 5700 rpm. Mine feels like it pulls all the way up to 6500 or so. Although my dyno sheet suggest 58 5900 rpms or so. Idk why some people say there's fall flat after 5800 or so. I guess there tune sucks. And you are going to need a tune if you aren't using the imrc no more.
 
Big Jim said:
So tell me friend, just how retarded would you feel when you take your car for a smog check and they fail it for illegal equipment? How would you feel when you learn that you need to return it to stock or you can't register it?

You are far more likely to pass if when they open the hood it looks like stock.
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Michigan doesn't have smog, man.
 
Big Jim said:
So tell me friend, just how retarded would you feel when you take your car for a smog check and they fail it for illegal equipment? How would you feel when you learn that you need to return it to stock or you can't register it?

You are far more likely to pass if when they open the hood it looks like stock.
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Wouldn't happen. No smog in MI.

BTW, you're actually talking about a couple of different things.

Smog - oval port swap will pass with cats; I'd venture to say with better numbers then the port match. Most states that smog don't do visuals, or care what is there when they do.

Full referee - (like in California) I see no reason why you can't fully register, smog, pass visuals on an oval port 3 liter providing you have full emissions equipment. There are provisions for getting swapped vehicles through, especially when you consider you're putting in a new motor.

Otherwise you can just do what thousands already do and find a shady ref.

BAD SVT said:
:laugh: brokendown, meet pudmunkie. pud, brokendown. lol. dont let him get to u bro. thats pud for ya. i'll give him this much... he's always looking for sumthn better. when splitports were the talk of the town(ceg), he was on that bandwagon as well. quite faithful to it i might add. now he's seen the "light":laugh:
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I'll admit to being a fan of the split port back in the day... This was because certain ppl I talked to made the oval port swap out to require tons of additional work... Which is just not the case.

An oval port swap will always be easier, faster, better.
 
Pudmunkie said:
Wouldn't happen. No smog in MI.

BTW, you're actually talking about a couple of different things.

Smog - oval port swap will pass with cats; I'd venture to say with better numbers then the port match. Most states that smog don't do visuals, or care what is there when they do.

Full referee - (like in California) I see no reason why you can't fully register, smog, pass visuals on an oval port 3 liter providing you have full emissions equipment. There are provisions for getting swapped vehicles through, especially when you consider you're putting in a new motor.

Otherwise you can just do what thousands already do and find a shady ref.



I'll admit to being a fan of the split port back in the day... This was because certain ppl I talked to made the oval port swap out to require tons of additional work... Which is just not the case.

An oval port swap will always be easier, faster, better.
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I respect your right to your opinions, but I don't agree with them.

On getting a car through smog checks. When you have a modified car, you are at risk. The level of risk may be very small in some places, and very high in others. Finding a shady smog inspector has its risks too. When found during state sting operations, those guys can loose their smog license and/or pay huge fines.

As far as an oval port swap always being "easier, faster, better" again it depends on what you are trying to accomplish. A full oval port swap requires a tune to turn off the IMRC and accommodate other things. Although a tune might still be the most desired, it would not be required if you do a hybrid or a "ported" swap. And then the big thing, if you do a full oval port swap the "easy way" you are stuck with the low performance cams. If your goal is horsepower, you are leaving out one of the most important elements, the SVT cams.

It is not stupid to consider the options. It is stupid to say that oval port is always the best option.
 
Low performance cams? hardly. Aarons old beast of a motor with svt cams put ZERO ground on my old car. on top of that I had a larger more manageable power curve. (and apprntly a more reliable swap). Full 3 liter will always be a better swap.
 
Jim, let me know when you've built and owned both types (afaik you have neither). Until then I just don't think your opinion has any value.
 
Big Jim said:
And then the big thing, if you do a full oval port swap the "easy way" you are stuck with the low performance cams. If your goal is horsepower, you are leaving out one of the most important elements, the SVT cams.
.
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You normally do get higher hp numbers out of the svt cams but the 3.0L cams normally make up for that in torque.
 
This talk of oval or split ports will be argued and discussed forever. It's more about how it looks than how it performs, though I will always see that it is about $500 more for a full 3L because of deleting secondaries and needing a tune. My $.02.
 
Has anyone here used the Nautilus LIM. ? Seems like it would be a good compromise between the two different setups, if it makes decent power. A bit of extra money ,but almost no modding required other than the tune.
 
enduro said:
Has anyone here used the Nautilus LIM. ? Seems like it would be a good compromise between the two different setups, if it makes decent power. A bit of extra money ,but almost no modding required other than the tune.
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Burrita (nautilus) did a huge write up about the use of intake manifolds on a 3L. He used his performance LIM he sells in a dyno run with a svt UIM and 3L cams. At which he tuned it ever slightly to let the 3L work properly without the Secondaries...allowing it to run equal to the other 3.0L's AFR's. For aback to back comparison.

At which he dyno'd 181whp and 180 wtq.
 
Harrry said:
Burrita (nautilus) did a huge write up about the use of intake manifolds on a 3L. He used his performance LIM he sells in a dyno run with a svt UIM and 3L cams. At which he tuned it ever slightly to let the 3L work properly without the Secondaries...allowing it to run equal to the other 3.0L's AFR's. For aback to back comparison.

At which he dyno'd 181whp and 180 wtq.
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That's horrendous.
 
Harrry said:
At which he dyno'd 181whp and 180 wtq.
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Yah, that's pretty low. I was hoping for 180 but also knowing that I am way under fueled and I still have the SE LIM. 190/193 for mine untuned, 17# injectors, SE LIM.
 
blu_fuz said:
Yah, that's pretty low. I was hoping for 180 but also knowing that I am way under fueled and I still have the SE LIM. 190/193 for mine untuned, 17# injectors, SE LIM.
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Yeah you have a LOT of power still waiting to happen on your engine. Several small mods and a tune and you should be set!
 
blu_fuz said:
Yah, that's pretty low. I was hoping for 180 but also knowing that I am way under fueled and I still have the SE LIM. 190/193 for mine untuned, 17# injectors, SE LIM.
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You will most likely be gaining once you add the svt lim (1mm larger for each port). Then 19 lb injectors with a correct tune. I def think you would be hitting the 200 whp mark with 200wtq with ease.

So get on this already old man :laugh:
 
elraido said:
He didn't tune it to run at the highest HP possible. Just enough to let it run. Why someone would do that, especially if they are getting a tune anyways, I don't know
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Because...he didn't want to give it an advantage over the other 3.0L dyno runs.

It was a comparison between the svt uim. 3l uim and mazda6 uim.
To see which car put down the best numbers at the same AFR. Which is the only way to do a proper comparison.
 
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