torsen spec 2 clutch noise?

[99 svt]

If we need to post credentials, I an AAS in automotive repair and repaired trucks for the Marines for 6 years... Most of the possibilities have been mentioned already, and I just wanted to take a far shot at something that happened to me.
Jeff, I don't think your comment was directed at me and I'm not trying to come across as defencive. Everyone knows how to pick out the common sense from the rants and arguing that pop up now and then. A lot of guys who do this on the weekends know a whole lot more than I do, and anyone who knows something that could help is welcome.
Its hard, but don't let the arguers and those sucked in by them bother you. Skip their posts and get the important stuff. But who knows, maybe what you said will work and not start another pissing match...:nonono:

 

[tasso]

Since this topic is back on subject and the need to look at it intelligently was mentioned, I would like to add the following.

Always take advise from the tree that actually bears fruit, not the one who just talks about it.

So, in order to maintain some sort of logic I propose we listen to the people whom actually have relevant experience based on the logically ordered set of criteria (these are "ands" for those familiar with logic statements):

1. Gainfully employed
2. Gainfully employed in the field of the topic in discussion
3. Actual experience in the field of the topic in discussion
4. Post High-School education in the field of the topic in discussion

Weekend warriors/shade tree mechanics need not reply.........

Then again, this is why I do not post here much, if at all...too many Ego's with nothing to back it up.

I will probably get all sorts of fun mail on this one, but......do not care....

Jeff

Jeff I agree 100% I was not posting the information about myself to try and brag in any way but just got tired of the comments. I certainly do not know everything about Contours but I know quite a bit about cars.

 

[todras]

Who F'n cares about credentials?! This is about Spec quality. It seems a few people have had issues. I have installed 4 Spec stage 1 clutches! 4! I forgot about Eurotour99's car. I work on so many I lose track. I've built 3 Duratec 3L. Torn them down to the block. Installed everything. Ask Ryan Kneeshaw how his hybrid is, ask Scott Biggers how his full ovalport 3L with SVT cams is. Ask about 15 other guys how the work I've performed on their cars is? An engine is an engine. Give me anything. Brand, make, model. Doesn't matter to me.

Why is this Tasso guy talking about creditials when he can't even do his own work to his own car! Did you watch what the shop did? Did you hold the guys hand? I have 2 Bachelor degrees and also am a limited licensed Real Estate appraiser. A lot of good the degree's did me since I do nothing with them! I know people with PhD's that are dumber than a box of rocks. Who cares?! Can a guy with a PhD replace and engine and transmission in a car? Most likely not since he hasn't studied and but effort into wanting to learn it. Don't come here and bring up stats. I guess I'm a shade tree mechanic. At a young age I learned the the guys with ASE certifications should not be working on my cars so I taught myself everything! Everything from reading. From books to here on CEG. I'm still learning eveyday. I've torn down every bolt on Contours. I can pull an engine and not label anything any longer! Can you do that Mr. Qualifications?!!!!!!!!!!!! I didn't think so. So when you have the qualifications from tearing out your own MTX-75 and putting it back in come back and talk to me.

I never once bashed you! I bashed the installs that you obviously did not perform. You start calling me "Toad". You're 45 years old? Pretty hard to imagine. If you met me on the street would you call me a name? Doubtful for someone 45. So why do in here. I didn't start the yelling in here. But if that's how you want this once constructive thread to go let it roll.

 

[muntus]

3. Actual experience in the field of the topic in discussion

This is probably the only one that matters. If you have put a Spec clutch in a Contour with your own two hands, you are more qualified to discuss this matter than those other three things you mentioned.

 

[todras]

Yes but that doesn't mean that it was installed incorrectly. I can't prove it either way. But Tod, how is it that I should have it replaced after two years just because the tranny is out? That's ridamdiculous. A clutch should last longer than the 15k miles that I put on it during those two years of fairly easy driving. And I have read more than a few posts about people having problem with spec clutches. Garbage?... I don't know about that. But this has created significant doubt in my mind that spec is as high of quality as oem or other brands. It would be one heck of a coincidence that more than a few people on different forums are all having their clutches installed incorrectly. I don't know what to think, honestly. I'm leaning towards oem.

Didn't realize you didn't put that low of mileage on. I admit I don't go on other forums looking for clutch issues. I go with what is known to work on our cars. True you shouldn't have had to replace it but if a shop told me to do something I'd go there in person to see what they were talking about so I could see with my own eyes. I'd probably go with OEM in your shoes too. I've always agreed that an SVT clutch is excellent. Some of want a little more clutch though which Spec provides at a great price. I wall always use them until I experience an issue personally. Can't really see that happening since the 4 I've done are flawless.

 

[tasso]

"It seems a few people have had issues." At least you are starting to admit I am not the only person having problems with Spec.

The shop the Contour Trans was done in is not just any shop it is my good friends that I use the lifts any time I want on the weekends. I never said I have not pulled the Contour trans myself, it is a pain in the ass, I said it was done in his shop. I have 7 cars and do not have time to do everything myself with my business. I also said he has done 100's of clutches and he never saw a friction plate fall apart like the second one did. In my own shop I have a overhead hoist for my engine pulls out the top but taking the Contour out is a big pain in the ass and much easier out the bottom on a lift. It will be interesting to see what the condition of the Spec clutch is that Mattyk pulls this weekend.

 

[99 svt]

Wow, this started out as a noise diagnosis and turned into a "Spec does/doesn't suck and who are you to tell me different" pissing match. Start a new thread to carry your little debate and lets stick with why the noise it there and what could be done to fix it. With all the mentioned advice, I'm sure he'll find the problem and let us know what it is.

 

[todras]

These are the type of messages I am getting from others about you.

"--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Todras is a very abrasive guy.

He can really be quite a jerk as well...

Last time I heard, he dropped out of school and was doing real estate appraising. Nothong wrong with either of these, but just a point of fact - so again consider the source. Pretty much any one can hang parts on a car......

I will take your skills/experience against anyone this chicken shi$$ board any day....

But then again, enough is enough......

over and out"
--------------------------------

LMAO! You think I care what anyone on this board thinks or says? Dropped out of school? That's rich. Graduated from GVSU back in '98.

Funny ONE guy sent you a PM about me. I can get a friend to come on here and say the same thing about you just the same. Obviouly I'm such a hated guy that no one wants to come to Grand Rapids, MI for Spring Zing. Projected to have 80 ppl. I'm putting everything together for it BTW. Funny how you're singling me out when I'm not the only one talking to you here. Sounds like you're upset that the shop you got your work done at has no business working on Contours. Don't get upset at me. I'm not the one paying $ to have others "fix" my car. LOL!

 

[todras]

I am still waiting to hear about all those stock SVT clutch replacements that failed in under 20,000 miles because of bad installs.

You'll be waiting a long time since almost everyone replaces theirs with a Spec 1. :idea:

 

[tasso]

Tod, I took this off the thread as Rara had asked me to. I have no additional comment other than you are the one trying to continue to make this a public war. I do not think you taking a private email I sent to you after you emailed me and told me to "get a life" and posting that in the public thread is appropriate.

 

[todras]

I have no additional comment other than you are the one trying to continue to make this a public war.

LOL! The only reason I check this post is because of you responding to mine. You can send all the PM's you want. I don't know why you're sending them to me since I'm not the one botching your clutch installs. If you want a Ford Service CD you can PM me about it. I'll send you one free of charge. Might help you the next time you want to fix something on a Contour. Even with all your "expertise.":laugh:

 

[tasso]

The funny thing here Tod is how you ignore and minimize every person who has a Spec clutch and mentions they are having a problem. I might start a seperate thread to keep track of the number of Spec related issues that are and have been reported. We will see how that number compares to me being the only one EVER having a problem.

 

[todras]

Christ can you read?!!!! I said it's funny how you never hear about them until one person posts and then people come out of the wood work. This is the first time I have heard of an issue with them. Too bad you're Spec post will have no merit since no one can know the variables. How the person drove, how the clutch was broken in, what TOB was used. You know most of the people here have shops do their own work? How did the shop handle the job? How was the flywheel done. Good luck!

 

[tasso]

It should be Christ can you read?!!!!
"This is the first time I have heard of an issue with them."

You obviously can not read with that statement. I have found several people reporting clutch issue at low mileage with spec units in past threads. Also the posts in this thread and in the one up right now by MattyK. You do some very selective reading, not sure how you can miss all the posts with people having problems. Tell you what I will start keeping track of all of them for you just to help you out. Thats what buddys are for right?

 

[todras]

Post em up right here. Copy and paste all the links.

 

[beyondloadedSE]

MY man if you are going cmomment at least know what you are talking about. Have you ever done a clutch job? I will answer for you, NO.

My clutch must have installed itself then. onder: Sees 350 foot pounds of torque daily and still runs like a champ.

 

[todras]

Looks like someone is into arguing instead of posting facts. Not trying to start a fire but prove a point.

 

[tasso]

Looks like someone else is into defending Spec and making statements that may not be true. ie. FACT, your statement that I am the only person ever having issues after a Spec install. I also am not trying to start anything but have been and will continue to prove my point!!!

 

[warmonger]

OK that is one svt that went at 40,000 miles, and your right that is lower mileage but I do not think typical of the mileage most get. I dont think I would compare that to the 6 Spec issues in this thread alone. I want to hear about stock svt replacements having issues because of bad installation at the low mileage that these Specs are? You are missing the point of my question. It is being said that the Spec units are failing because of bad installation. If that is true and so many people cant put these in the right way where are the stock SVT clutch failures from poor installation at low mileage?

Actually two. On my first SVT I blew out the stock clutch at 25K miles with broken springs in the hub. Original owner on that T-Red 98SVT. Ford bought that car back from me.
Then I bought a 99SVT and I was the original owner but that clutch acted up with about 30K on it. I think it was actually the TB because I complained and Ford surfaced the disk and put in a new Clutch,PP, and TB. The problem was gone and a great clutch after that.
Within 10K miles I swapped in a 3L and ran that same clutch for the next two years on the 3L, and then for about 3months when I slapped a turbo on my 3L.
AT that point I knew my clutch wasn't going to last, too much torque.
So I put in a spec stage3. I got the flywheel surfaced again....and I'm positive it was not two-step surfaced both times now that I look back on it. But at least that spec3 gripped like mad.

So I know of quite a few SVT clutches that would go out, and I know of quite a few that lasted around 100K miles.

With that said, I know of spec clutches that have both great record and bad record.

So in reality we can't compare unless we got some statistical data and just started counting the number sold to the number of reported failures.
I'm sure that in quantity the OEM SVT clutch will win out because of the higher number installed and tight production quality.
When you got to buy a heavier clutch though, you can't use the SVT clutch. It won't hold nitrous nor will it hold up to 300 ft-lbs of torque.
At that point you just have to pick your poison and do the best job you can installing it.

 

[Matty K]

When you got to buy a heavier clutch though, you can't use the SVT clutch. It won't hold nitrous nor will it hold up to 300 ft-lbs of torque.

Good post warmonger, but I'm not sure on the nitrous part. Unless you're spraying off the line, won't the clutch be fully engaged and moving when the nitrous kicks? In other words, it doesn't get the brunt of the torque (which, from what I've read, is what wrecks clutches)?