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Vacuum Leak

P

pletby

New CEG'er
Joined
Jun 28, 2009
Messages
28
Location
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Hey guys, I have found another problem on my car and decided to get out of the kiddie pool (new member classroom) and wade into posting with the big kids.

My car will sometimes upon start up and after the 10 seconds of high idle, nearly stall, then rev way up, then nearly stall about 5 times. If I'm in a rush and try to drive it like this it bucks, or at a stop will surge forward if I'm not careful. After this it idles fine. Another problem is that midrange power isn't always there. If I mat it, it's good power, otherwise pretty flat.

Anyway, here's the goods on my car:
1997 Ford Contour GL 2.5L V6 ATX with 200,000km or about 124,000 Miles

P0171 DTC system too lean bank 1
P0420 catalyst system efficiency below threshold bank 1
P0430 catalyst system efficiency below threshold bank 2
P1131 Lack of H02S11 switches - sensor indicates lean
P1151 Lack of H02S11 switches - sensor indicates lean
P0306 Cylinder 6 Misfire detected
P0133 02 Circuit slow response (bank1, sensor1)
P0174 system too lean bank 2
p1000 obd systems test not complete
P1467 AC demand out of self test range


Thanks to all the cool articles here on CEG I've been able to track down a few issues and fix them (how's a tune up at 200,000 km to fix rough idle?), but I've still got a ton of codes. I was reading articles again on the codes I've got, and P 0171 and P 0174 were mentioned to be related to Vac leak. That made me think about a funny sucking noise by the EGR I noticed when replacing the spark wires and plugs. Some poking a prodding found this:

07-13-09_1812.jpg


It's about a 3/4" gash in the line. It sucked on my finger when I pushed on it. I'm going to try to take it out and get a ride to the local Canadian Tire to find a replacement hose.

I'm having trouble wrapping my head around the rest of the codes. I found the TSB 01-9-7 HO2S Service Tips page in my searching but it's frying my brain to read. Should I simply fix the vac leak, reset and check codes that show up after that?
 
Okay, here's a better picture of that hose with the split. I tapped it and a little pile of black powder came out. Is this something I should be concerned about?

07-13-09_2051.jpg


I replaced the hose and I have a new car. I never imagined a vacuum leak could change an engine so much. I suppose over time as it got worse I got used to it. Smooth idle. Linear power. Wow.:cool:

So what now? Do I need to disconnect the battery and let the computer re-learn how to idle now? Or should I be doing maintenance on my induction system first? I also have to go back to Mom and Dad's this weekend to check the codes, possibly reset them. (I'm still a bit dumb about this stuff):help:
 
The picture and hose you showed is probably related to the EGR valve (which explains the sucking sound and soot). There is also a good chance that you need new Upper O2 sensors (not lower). Bank 1 upper (below the coil pack, hardest to reach). Bank 2 Upper (left of front exhaust manifold, if you stand in front of the radiator, it is to the left of the exhaust. Remove the oil filter for more room to work around it.).

Autozonelink for EGR
http://www.autozone.com/autozone/repairinfo/repairguide/repairGuideContent.jsp?chapterTitle=Emission+Controls&partName=Driveability+%26+Emissions+Controls&pageId=0900c152800a8aa6&subChapterTitle=Exhaust+Gas+Recirculation+System&partId=0900c152800a8a91
 
That's one of the hoses that conects to PCV “T” coupling, I think. Hard to tell from the picture. Anyway, I see you mentioned Canadian Tire. Where about are you? If you are within GTA I can help you troubleshoot.
 
I'm a touch west of you and on the other side of some great lakes in the center of Canada, the gateway to the prairies, Winnipeg! And it's summer this week so I won't be indoors much.:laugh: Thanks for the offer though.

That part of the hose did attach to a 'T' coupler. The other side was connected to a plastic corrugated hose that ran behind the engine and into the firewall I think. Was a bit dark.

Just for reference, that picture of my finger pointing at the hose was from the perspective of standing on the driver's side of the car, EGR at the top of the pic, and transmission dipstick at the bottom, throttle goodies under my hand.
 
Tony2005 said:
There is also a good chance that you need new Upper O2 sensors (not lower). Bank 1 upper (below the coil pack, hardest to reach). Bank 2 Upper (left of front exhaust manifold, if you stand in front of the radiator, it is to the left of the exhaust. Remove the oil filter for more room to work around it.).
Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply Tony. I went to the local Parts Source and they wanted $135 each for the upstream O2 sensors. I'll look around for prices. If that's the best I can get this might have to wait til next payday, got OT heading my way. I've been reading for a few hours today (Man, this forum is like TV for sucking me in) and noticed that my car is likely to have bad wire insulation. Since I'm not replacing those sensors immediately I'll go have a look at the wiring. I'll also poke around the hose I replaced so we can all rest peacefully knowing exactly what it hooked up to.
 
Okay, here are some pics I took with my phone. Where that corrugated hose ends up is on the firewall behind the coil pack. It's the top hose with the blue connector. It's about the only thing that's really in focus here from standing over the driver's side front wheel:

07-15-09_1958.jpg


Here's a picture of the other end, located under the EGR and forward a bit. This is the T-fitting. Well it's not really T-shaped, more F with one of the branches going the other way:

07-15-09_1957.jpg


Located here:



07-15-09_1959.jpg


Clear as mud? There's actually alot less since I cleaned the engine bay with a few quick swipes of the wand at a car wash. Anyhow, I hope you guys can figure it out from these pics. I shoved the phone under the intake for the 'Bug View' and this is the best view after rotating and fixing up:

07-15-09_2048.jpg


So let me know. Thanks guys. Now I'm going to look up PCV valve and where the heck it is. I'm learning... slowly.
 
Last edited:
If you need o2 sensors, go to oxygensensors.com and buy it from them for less than half the price. I've order from them many time and for many different cars and they alway have the best prices. They provide shipping/delivery updates via emails and shipping is super fast. Just avoid the bosch ones.






pletby said:
Thanks for the reply Tony. I went to the local Parts Source and they wanted $135 each for the upstream O2 sensors. I'll look around for prices. If that's the best I can get this might have to wait til next payday, got OT heading my way. I've been reading for a few hours today (Man, this forum is like TV for sucking me in) and noticed that my car is likely to have bad wire insulation. Since I'm not replacing those sensors immediately I'll go have a look at the wiring. I'll also poke around the hose I replaced so we can all rest peacefully knowing exactly what it hooked up to.
Click to expand...
 
If that is PCV system, the corrugated tube going to firewall probably eventually goes to purge solenoid that allows purge of carbon canister. Not for EGR, temperature of that system too hot for rubber hose. Regarding O2 sensor replacement, you should fix vacuum leak first and reset PCM to see if O2 sensor codes reappear. May not need to change them. You can do a simple voltmeter test to check the sensor switching without spending the big money for them. Upper sensor must switch back and forth across .5 volt to be working right. The ones after convertor(s) should stay pretty steady at .5 volt most of the time. If those start the up and down movement like the uppers then converter going bad.
 
Thanks for the replies guys. Great information, and thanks for the oxygen sensor website. WAY better prices there!:cool: I'll reset the codes tomorrow. I'm also replacing discs, pads and replacing brake fluid. The old discs are warped in front and in back I have some heavy galling on one side. The shaking under braking has gotten pretty bad quickly and I figure safe brakes are more important at this point. After I do that I'll drive it for a bit and check the codes again and see where I stand. Hopefully nothing's gotten beat up terribly in the front end from all the shaking.
 
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