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Royal purple changes

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contour_r_us

Hard-core CEG'er
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I just noticed that Royal Purple 2012-2013 Catalog shows the HPS 10w-40 is used in place of Ford XT-M5-QS. What happend to the Royal Purple Synchromax being the compatable equiv to our Ford XT-M5-QS? Or am I missing something here?

tia -

Terry Haines responded: Very interesting!...Back many years I had lab tests done on the XT-M5-QS and established that its base was a 15W/40 diesel engine oil. Back then Syncromax was called up as being equal to the Ford lube...maybe,just maybe royal Purple have 'caught up with their own lab tests and revised the spec in line with what I found!!

Maybe drop them a mail and ask RP 'why' the spec change. I have noted for many years that a 15W/40 synth diesel engine oil could be used as a substitute for the Ford or even Syncromax fluid.
 
Has anyone tried hps 10w-40 in thier trans? Ive been looking to buy some syncromax for the new svt as ive used it in my old one but the hps is $8 cheaper per quart. Sounds like a cheaper alternative.
 
I am waiting to hear back from my email inquiry of RP and the reason, if any, for the change from Synchromax to HPS 10w-40 as a substitue for out FOMOC XT-M5-QS. Will post response here.
 
I have heard back from RP - unfortunately there are still questions I have to James' responses. My questions/posts will be in BOLD:
I just noticed that Royal Purple 2012-2013 Catalog shows the HPS 10w-40 is used in place of Ford XT-M5-QS. What happend to the Royal Purple Synchromax being the compatable equiv to our Ford XT-M5-QS? Or am I missing something here?
Synchromax is a significantly lighter “ATF like” fluid than the “Ford Honey” XT-M5-QS, and when we are recommending a replacement manual transmission fluid we try to get the viscosity as close as reasonably possible. This is so that noise, NVH and shift feel will all remain optimal. Although we will sometimes recommend Synchromax to replace XT-M5-QS in some high revving race only applications, it is not our normal go to fluid for normal street use to replace this particular fluid.

What is your application? Year, make, model, engine, trans?
 
I appreciate your explanation.

I drive two different Ford Contours 1) 1995 Contour 2.0 Zetec with the manual 5 speed MTX-75

2) 1998.5 Contour SVT 2.5 Duratec with the manual 5 speed MTX-75.


btw – there are MANY of us Ford Contour/Mercury Mystique enthusiasts out there using your products. See contour.org and fordcontour.org Do a search as a visitor for “RP”.
Don’t forget the many Mercury Cougars (1998 – 2002) and the Ford Focus – all with the MTX-75 transaxle.

You are very welcome!
Sweet! You have an SVT Contour! Those are very cool cars!
I am also a moderator part time on SVTperformance.com and drive an 04 SVT Focus and an 04 SVT Cobra Mustang, both with Synchromax in the trans naturally.  User name Jimmysidecarr
Keep in mind you can also use the XPR 10W-40(part #01041, quart bottle) to replace the Ford Honey in the MTX-75s.

Have a great Christmas!
Jim Morrissey


PS I’ll be off until 12/26 on vacation.
 
James – very cool indeed!!!!

So, I am a little confused….which do you suggest for “normal” driving of the MTX-75? For years RP suggested the Synchromax, changing to the HPS 10w-40 for the 2012-2013 Application Chart. Now you mention the XPR 10w-40. See my confusion? I was asked, on behalf of Terry Haines and others on both of my Contour forums, to inquire of RP. Terry Haines has been rebuilding the MTX-75’s for many, many years.

Yes – you also have an excellent Christmas.
 
OK, here is the last of my posts on this topic; this is from RP:

I have only been in the tech department here at Royal Purple since May of 2011, however unless it was a race application the MTX-75 transaxle recommendation has always been a 10W-40 performance oil. I’m not sure if that was changed from before because I was not here, though my supervisor Chris has been here 2 ½ years longer than me and he indicated it has been that way for a good while.

The 10W-40 recommendation is what best matches the original Ford fluid viscosity, this matters because shift feel, smoothness and quietness are best optimized this way. There is no question Synchromax works and has more than enough protection, but it may not feel correct as it is closer to a light 20 weight on the engine scale. We used to recommend our old formula SAE API-SL street oil 10W-40, but that is now an API-SN and as a result of the SN chemistry restrictions it now has less anti wear additive than we feel is appropriate for gear box usage.
Any of our performance 10W-40 oils will work great in the Ford MTX-75.
Royal Purple HPS 10W-40 (part #31140, quart bottle)
Royal Purple Max Cycle 10W-40 (part #01315, quart bottle)
Royal Purple XPR 10W-40 (part #01041, quart bottle)

Thank you for choosing Royal Purple and have a great day!

Jim Morrissey
Technical Services/Automotive
Royal Purple, Inc.
 
Well the original Ford recommendation and fill was not the current requirement, it was ATF which results in hard shifts into first, reverse, and possibly second in cold weather. I had that in the old Contour for roughly 3 years, and RP syncromax for the other 4 I had the car, the syncromax was superior in every way, shape, and form. You can certainly go with what they recommend and probably be happy, but when I swap this MTXs fluid, I won't be going with anything but syncromax.
 
Dan - I hear you loud and clear and I never intended to use anything but Terry Haines' recommendation - Syncromax. I was simply pointing out that RP has changed their specs for our MTX's from years past. I was asked by many of you to seek a response from RP, which I have posted.
 
contour_r_us said:
I have heard back from RP - unfortunately there are still questions I have to James' responses. My questions/posts will be in BOLD:
I just noticed that Royal Purple 2012-2013 Catalog shows the HPS 10w-40 is used in place of Ford XT-M5-QS. What happend to the Royal Purple Synchromax being the compatable equiv to our Ford XT-M5-QS? Or am I missing something here?
Synchromax is a significantly lighter “ATF like” fluid than the “Ford Honey” XT-M5-QS, and when we are recommending a replacement manual transmission fluid we try to get the viscosity as close as reasonably possible. This is so that noise, NVH and shift feel will all remain optimal. Although we will sometimes recommend Synchromax to replace XT-M5-QS in some high revving race only applications, it is not our normal go to fluid for normal street use to replace this particular fluid.
Click to expand...

Thanks for all your hard work getting this info Contour_r_us. The comment by RP rep, above, concerns me somewhat. I just replaced the transmission fluid with RP Synchromax in my '95 SE, and bought three more bottles for the '96 LS, which I haven't put in yet and can't return at this point. I know recommendations are changed now and again, and better to change them if there's something better to use, but now I'm wondering what to do: put in the RP Snychromax I already bought, or swallow down a loss and buy RP's currently recommended fluid (or else Ford honey). I don't have any problem with the feel of Synchromax in my '95 SE; in fact, as many here have said, I think shifting feels smoother.
 
Hi Ferrett!!! I also had seen your post about your purchasing the Synchromax a while back, and share your concerns of your above post. I personally am going with the wisdom of Terry Haines, as this guy has been "around the block" on our MTX's many more times than you or I. If he say's this is the way to go, I will follow. I am not one to follow just anyone, but Terry has the data points to back up his talk track. I would not worry needlessly over what RP states - for starters, I have a copy of the 2010-2011 application guide, and it does state synchromax for our MTX's. I am not satisfied with RP's response (above); take it for what it's worth.
 
And I appreciate the inquiry and information. I do think running the HPS 10w-40 will probably also work and provide a good experience, I'm merely sharing that in my personal experience syncromax works excellently especially in a cold weather environment such as mine with no added NVH. Also pointing out that Jims statement that 10w-40 matches the "original" recommendation does not make much sense seeing as how the original requirement (what it says in my 98's and my 99's owners manual) was ATF which is, in my experience, an unacceptable viscosity with harsh shifts into low gears in cold weather until it warmed up a little. FWIW I've even had reverse feel like it's engaged, and then pop out of gear halfway through the clutch pedal travel on initial start up with factory fill, but never with syncromax.

Again though I do appreciate the inquiry and information, thank you.
 
Dan - Thank you for the well written response! Your experience is "spot on" as the British would say ;-) I also appreciate these conversations.
 
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