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Interesting question on front sway delete

rexxdoggy

Hard-core CEG'er
Joined
Jul 14, 2007
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Crestview, Florida
Okay, keeping it simple:

What are the affects of deleting the front sway bar? This is for coilovers, full stiff. During highway speeds, cornering, stability, pros, cons, you're a stupid idiot (lol don't really say that, you might hurt my feelings), I'm talking all of the above.

This is hypothetical... :D
 
Based on how I understand a sway bar works, I think during highway speeds when going straight the ride would be unaffected. If you were to corner sharply at highway speeds then I think your cornering ability might be diminished some without a front sway bar. The sway bar would not be there to distribute the weight of the car between the two front wheels, so if I understand it correctly while cornering there would be more stress on the outside front wheel without a sway bar. I think because you are on full stiff coils the affects might be less than a stock suspension, but it's hard to say how much.

I guess I wonder how much it would throw the weight distribution off while cornering considering you would still have the rear sway bar in place. The rear sway bar would be doing it's job between the rear suspension but the front would not be. So in a hard left hand turn there would be a disproportionate amount of stress put on the front right wheel. Basically I think in a corner the front outside suspension would compress while the inside would not because there is no sway bar to link them together. The rears would do the same, but the sway bar would be distributing some of the force on the outside wheel to the inside.

I'm just speculating based on what I've read about sway bars and suspension. It's an interesting question and I'm sure others who know a lot more about how suspesion works will chime in.
 
This I do understand. But also, with the addition of the front strut tower brace, how much does that affect the absence of the front sway? Surely it does not provide the same balance as what a front sway will, but how much can it negate without it being there, if at all?
 
I have my front unhooked on my daily 99 accord at the moment because my endlinks are bad, man does it feel like crap on turns but its stock suspension lol...Ive also taken the front sway bar off my 92 civic hatchback SI i had for weight reduction with sprint drop springs and kyb shocks,it felt like ass on the turns so i put a bigger integra bar on,it felt way better,but since you have coilovers im not to sure,i had d2 coilovers on my 1997 240sx with a front sway bar and it had not much body roll if any im sure if you removed the front sway bar you wouldnt like it but just my opinion sway bars make the suspension cleaner and take away the slop,i love the way my Csvt feels with front sway i think it is balanced well
 
I read somewhere that the strut tower brace helps eliminate chassis flex but its very minimal if it does anything. I dont think it has anything to do with handling.
 
I read somewhere that the strut tower brace helps eliminate chassis flex but its very minimal if it does anything. I dont think it has anything to do with handling.

^ that's correct. Strut tower braces don't do anything on our cars because the towers are so close to the firewall that they don't flex at all. If the towers were more towards the mid section of the engine bay, then yes a strut tower bar would help but minimal.
 
^ that's correct. Strut tower braces don't do anything on our cars because the towers are so close to the firewall that they don't flex at all. If the towers were more towards the mid section of the engine bay, then yes a strut tower bar would help but minimal.

I do remember reading that somewhere. I also read that a front away delete has slower turn in speed, but greater turn out speed? Something along those lines. Racing applications would not pertain to me if I did go with it. For obvious reasons of going lower. The sway bracket adjusts with height as well, but the lower it goes, the more unbalanced it becomes. And even so, with the rims/tires
I'm looking at now, I shouldn't be taking hard corners anyways lol
 
From what I've read a larger front sway bar in a FWD car creates more understeer which could cause the inner wheel to spin. So the lack of a sway bar would lessen understeer and probably improve traction in a corner but the body roll would be greater without the bar. I think that goes with what you are saying above. If you are slamming the car lower than you have it already and it's mostly for looks I guess you might not be concerned about understeer. Most of us who don't track our cars probably don't even push the limits enough to experience understeer. As long as it's not all squirrely in normal driving and causes safetly issues you might not even notice it.
 
I think it would be fun to have a huge front sway bar and find a rear sway to balance it out and put some real sticky tires that cling to the road
 
From what I've read a larger front sway bar in a FWD car creates more understeer which could cause the inner wheel to spin. So the lack of a sway bar would lessen understeer and probably improve traction in a corner but the body roll would be greater without the bar. I think that goes with what you are saying above. If you are slamming the car lower than you have it already and it's mostly for looks I guess you might not be concerned about understeer. Most of us who don't track our cars probably don't even push the limits enough to experience understeer. As long as it's not all squirrely in normal driving and causes safetly issues you might not even notice it.

Exactly. That's what I'm trying to figure out as far as safety and stability in normal driving. Performance is already hindered being as low as I am, so I'm not worried about diminishing performance numbers. Mainly for safety
 
It sounds like you should be looking at fabbing up some adjustable endlinks to make the bar sit correctly with your drop.
Dont go without, it will make your front end loose like (insert name here)'s mom.
Of course, it would take about 4 minutes to unbolt both of them and test the theory...
 
It sounds like you should be looking at fabbing up some adjustable endlinks to make the bar sit correctly with your drop.
Dont go without, it will make your front end loose like (insert name here)'s mom.
Of course, it would take about 4 minutes to unbolt both of them and test the theory...

you dont even have to unbolt both of them (in fact i wouldnt as the bar will just flop around then). just remove one of the front endlinks and take the car for a drive. how it drives is exactly how it will if you remove the entire bar because at that point the bar is only connected to one wheel so it doesnt do anything.

BTW, if you want some custom length endlinks because you will dropping the car far beyond what my upgraded ones were designed for then I can do that. I will just need to know how long you want them from bolt to bolt. pricing should be pretty close to the same as they are now.
 
Well, that's the thing. I know I priced your endlinks before, and it was definitely a lot more than I had though, albeit, it is adustable. Regardless, I don't even know what the sway bar needs to sit at because of how low it is compared to what it is in stock location.

mmc757, is it like, loose as in, super scary loose? Wobbly when driving higher speeds? Describe a little more intricately. Thanks.
 
Hey Mikey, I think I can address all your questions as I've tried many iterations of suspension and alignment on my car and tested them in every condition imaginable...street, autocross, and track. Sorry if this response gets long.

Earlier this year I installed Ground Control coilovers (my third major suspension setup since owning the car). I had the kit custom-specified with different sleeves, spring free lengths, and rates from the "off-the-shelf" kit for the Contour to suit my competition usage and adjustability objectives for the car. Ultimately my point is that my perspective is entirely from a performance standpoint, and as such my car is only moderately lowered and running very stiff springs front and rear.

I too had a 21mm rear sway bar prior to coilover installation, and it was a very good improvement to the nimbleness of the rear during transitional handling, especially with some toe adjustment to dial in exactly how easily I'd want the rear to break away. The benefit for street driving is that the bigger bar doesn't affect ride quality all that much.

When I went to coilovers with high rear spring rates, the bigger bar was too much. So much roll stiffness comes from the spring (as it should with strictly performance in mind) that the big bar wasn't helping with body roll and handling balance so much as it was transmitting upsetting road inputs from one side to the other and creating a choppy, unpredictable feeling in the rear. Adjusting the rebound damping couldn't fully cure it. I decided to remove it (well, disconnect it at first). The rear immediately settled but the car then just pushed like no other with only the front bar. So I disconnected the front bar. Balance went back to neutral with some toe compensation and actually felt pretty damn good. So much so that I actually drove a few autocrosses with both bars disconnected. However, the steering turn-in precision was all gone. The front would, for lack of a better way to describe it, squirm for part of a second before taking a set, and it was enough to be very disconcerting when driving at or near the limit. This may be what the previous poster was describing as the "loose" feeling. Anyway, I also wouldn't recommend going with no front sway bar, especially with "streetable" spring rates. I wish there were a smaller bar option for us though.

To wrap up this saga, I ended up reconnecting my stock SVT front sway bar and removing the 21mm Roush bar I had to replace it with the stock SVT rear bar. I'm fairly happy with the handling now, although the front is still a little too firm in roll for the open diff. So now to get a Torsen in the off-season so I can actually pull through corners...
 
Well, that's the thing. I'm not worried about performance, but don't want a super crappy turning ride. I'm more worried about safety at higher speeds.
 
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