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So I Didn't Do Enough Research

T

TennTechMan

CEG'er
Joined
Dec 18, 2008
Messages
198
Location
Maryville, TN
Like I've posted times before, the swap I'm working on is a port-matched 2004 Taurus engine going into a 99 CSVT using the SVT cams. I thought I had done enough research to complete the swap quick and smoothly. I think I've done pretty well so far, but a couple of small issues have come up that I haven't seen mentioned much or at all.

I created another post about the black box between the heads. I got that resolved, and installed. I mainly posted that because I hadn't seen the problem mentioned, and wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something.

I now have the engine assembled and ready to drop in. I just need to get the trans bolted up first, and that's where the second issue comes from. I placed the flex plate on the back of the engine to find out some of the bolt holes don't line up. One of the dowels also does not line up. The two bolt holes that don't line up are on the bottom through the oil pan. I think I've read somewhere before that this was the case, and to just not use those two holes. This problem should apply to all 3.0 swaps, so I'm surprised I haven't seen this come up much.

The bigger problem I have is that only one of the dowels line up. I know I haven't read anything about that yet. What have others done? Just leave it as is, and only use one dowel? It doesn't sound like a good idea to me. With only one dowel pin, I think it would guarantee damage to the clutch disk, input shaft bearing, or both. There is already a hole in the block where the 2.5's dowel was. My plan is to just buy another dowel and press it into the hole that would match the 2.5.

Thanks in advance for the help everyone.
 
For the oilpan, most people get an escape oilpan (0r updated contour pan, same thing). This has the holes to go into the trans. If you do change the pan you need to change the pickup and dipstick as well. No need to change the windage tray.
On my swap we were able to pull a dowel out of the old engine and use it to line everything up. I was worried that the other dowel would foul on the trans but it clears it no prob.
 
I'm not familiar with what the "updated Contour oil pan" is. Do you mean my stock 99 CSVT oil pan? Something that has to be bought from Ford? Or is there a chance that it's something I can get from a local parts store?
 
The dowel that doesn't line up can be pulled out and moved to the other dowel hole next to it. Normally this isn't mentioned because people will run their SVT oil cooler and that ear with the dowel on the motor needs to be cut off so the oil cooler lines fit on correctly.
 
TennTechMan said:
I'm not familiar with what the "updated Contour oil pan" is.
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If you were to order a new oilpan for a v6 contour they would send you the escape oilpan. You could use the oilpan from your old engine if you wanted to (I think).

Blackcoog said:
The dowel that doesn't line up can be pulled out and moved to the other dowel hole next to it. Normally this isn't mentioned because people will run their SVT oil cooler and that ear with the dowel on the motor needs to be cut off so the oil cooler lines fit on correctly.
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I know this is generally the way its done but my oil cooler lines fit around it (1 above and 1 below) without a problem.
 
TennTechMan said:
The oil cooler lines fit without removing the tab.

Any suggestions on how to remove the dowel?
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Cut into the ear with a grinder and try not to damage the dowel much. Two cuts should let you knock part of the ear off to expose the side of the dowel. Then knock it out with a screw driver.

FYI you can't swap your old 2.5L pan on without running into pickup and windage tray issues. Stick with the 3L pan and skip the lower two bolts.
 
TRicker said:
a vise grip will ruin the dowel and it needs to be smooth. more trouble than it's worth IMO.
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just flip the dowel around and the damage the vice grip inflicts will help hold it in the block.

leave the 3L pan on use the thin piece of metal that is bolted between the engine and the transmission to locate the new lower two holes and drill them out with a little customizing you will be able to solve the lower bolt hole problem with out changing oil pans.....

I don't know how you got the oil cooler lines to go around that tab on the block with out separating the oil cooler lines
 
PurdySVT said:
just flip the dowel around and the damage the vice grip inflicts will help hold it in the block.

leave the 3L pan on use the thin piece of metal that is bolted between the engine and the transmission to locate the new lower two holes and drill them out with a little customizing you will be able to solve the lower bolt hole problem with out changing oil pans.....

I don't know how you got the oil cooler lines to go around that tab on the block with out separating the oil cooler lines
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I was able to get one of the dowels out of the 2.5L block without much trouble. The one in the 3.0L was not coming out.

We've already swapped the 2.5L oil pan onto the 3.0L just to get it running. A new Escape oil pan is on order and will be swapped out as soon as it comes in. I considered drilling new holes on the Taurus pan, but one of the holes would have broken out.

The oil cooler lines fit around the tab no problem. After looking at it all again though, I'm going to put some kind of rubber around the lines because they are against the block. I'm afraid engine vibrations will slowly wear a hole in one of the tubes.

Thanks for all the support guys. I'm expecting to have it running one evening this week.
 
ahhh.... how did you get the 2.5L pan to fit over the taurus pickup tube? The pickup is too long so it will hit the bottom of the pan preventing you from bolting the pan up. Make sure you didn't force the pan up and mash the pickup tube up. There is no reason to ditch the 3.0L pan. The two lower transmission bolts can be skipped without creating any issues.
 
Blackcoog said:
ahhh.... how did you get the 2.5L pan to fit over the taurus pickup tube? The pickup is too long so it will hit the bottom of the pan preventing you from bolting the pan up. Make sure you didn't force the pan up and mash the pickup tube up. There is no reason to ditch the 3.0L pan. The two lower transmission bolts can be skipped without creating any issues.
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i believe there was a change as some point as we had a 3L that the escape pan fit with no issue.
 
Blackcoog said:
ahhh.... how did you get the 2.5L pan to fit over the taurus pickup tube? The pickup is too long so it will hit the bottom of the pan preventing you from bolting the pan up. Make sure you didn't force the pan up and mash the pickup tube up. There is no reason to ditch the 3.0L pan. The two lower transmission bolts can be skipped without creating any issues.
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We swapped in the 2.5L pick up tube also.
 
TennTechMan said:
The bigger problem I have is that only one of the dowels line up. I know I haven't read anything about that yet. What have others done? Just leave it as is, and only use one dowel? It doesn't sound like a good idea to me. With only one dowel pin, I think it would guarantee damage to the clutch disk, input shaft bearing, or both. There is already a hole in the block where the 2.5's dowel was. My plan is to just buy another dowel and press it into the hole that would match the 2.5.

Thanks in advance for the help everyone.
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I was just reading this, and I realized that I think I may have assemble the transmission to the engine with only one dowel. I haven't droped it into the car yet, so have I already damaged something or would it just be potential damage with the engine running?
 
You should be ok. The dowel helps line up the transmission to the block but if you bolted the transmission to the block and the input shaft fit into the clutch you should be fine.
 
Blackcoog said:
You should be ok. The dowel helps line up the transmission to the block but if you bolted the transmission to the block and the input shaft fit into the clutch you should be fine.
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How sure are you of that?

I don't have experience with it in this vehicle, but there's a good chance you could end up with a nasty vibration due to the clutch disc and flywheel/pressure plate not being exactly concentric. If this car had a pilot bushing also, you would have to worry about the trans input shaft bearing failing prematurely also.

The dowels are what locate the trans relative to the engine. The bolts are only there to hold it together. Of course, it is still possible that the clutch components could all be concentric without one or both of the dowel pins, but that's not a chance I'd be willing to take.

Especially if the motor/trans isn't in the car yet, just unbolt it and put it back together with the dowel.
 
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