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The surging is back... but have some codes

I found this online :

33 | EGR not opening | Clogged or bad EGR, bad EVP/PFE sensor, and even a sluggish O2 can set this.

AFAIK the O2 sensor is original. I'm still thinking of replacing the EGR, but it has been cleaned and had been manually tested and did the suck test which all proved the EGR being functional. I had replaced the DPFE sensor temporally with a friends and got another code but the car ran fine. The EVP(EGR solenoid?) is my last suspicion.

I will check my spark plugs and the wires and triple check my vacuum lines very soon. But still need some ideas.
 
Ok, cyclinder 1's spark plug has some oil on it, but the rest of the cyclinders are fine.:shrug:

I took the car out for a spin, more or less. The car drives like ****, simply put. I have bucking, stumbling, surging, you name it, I might have it. The CEL flashes everytime it does "it."

What would cause all this? I'm tempted to change the EGR even though it has been cleaned and tested out fine. Is there a chance the O2 sensor could be bad?

I am very confused at this point and will appreciate any help!
 
You are NOT alone...

You are NOT alone...

Hey KerryKool,

I have 95 Contour GL 2.0L 4cly. Automatic. I am having very similar issue and happened all of a sudden(just overnight). My car drives fine when cruising but is terrible at idle(especially right after I crank it up).
Engine runs very rough, sputters and sometimes stall. I cannot dirve the car. It is at my home...
I am not going to shop or dealer because they will ask more than my car is worth to fix it. Especially going to FORD (simple forget it!..)
They asked over 2k from you for all those part, It is called BS, highway robbery, crap!.. You think that they know how to fix the cars right? No!.. they have no clue. All they do is to change bunch of parts at your cost and hope to fix the problem. What they told you is a plain BS to me. How would all those parts fail at the same time? They are not much related to each other.
I am not a mechanic just a home DIYer but I can claim to fix any cars if I am allowed to change the whole engine at the end...
Don't go to Ford dealer man unless you know someone there PERIOD...

What I did to fix my problem so far and none of them helped is:
1)Removed the oil separator and PCV valve. Cleaned the oil separator; replaced the PCV valve. PCV valve was really bad see the picture... But it wasn't stuck. Anyways it didn't fix the problem...
2)Removed and tested the IAC valve. It was working but I replaced it anyways. Sure it didn't fix the problem. I will remove and put the old one back.

I am working on it and following yout thread hopefully either one of us will find a solution soon...

P.S. I only pulled 335 codes so far...
 

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I'm going to replace the PVC valve anyway, its a cheap part and I have time to get it out. I'm also going to replace the O2 sensor just because it may cause the 33 code I'm getting.

I wish you luck and kinda glad I'm not the only one experiencing this phenomenon, per se.:crazy:

Edit: Forgot to mention, I will be replacing the MAF sensor when it comes in the mail. I have one shipping from Canada for free(Thanks keithr!) so it should be here sometime next week, hopefully.
 
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Well, PCV is cheap indeed but it is hard to get to.
Looks like there are two methods: Some reaching it thru removing the thremostat housing from top, and some get to it from under the car by lowering the cat.

I did use the second method. I am not saying it is better. I just did it that way because I didn't want to deal with draining the coolant.

If you use the second method which I used, Oil separator needs to come out before PCV removal. It actually worked for me because I got to clean that out too. It was SOOOO dirty; carrying 13 years of oily dust in it. Lots of stuff came out of it...
Good luck to you on that but I really doubt that it would be your problem...

Back to our issue, Today I put back the original IAC valve that I replaced with a new one last week thinking that IAC valve was the problem. After cleaning and testing the original one that I took out and seeing the problem didn't go away with the new IAC valve, I decided to put the original one back and I will return the new one. I paid $55 for it and I might as well use that fund for something else...

However, a strange thing happened after I put the original IAC valve back. I forgot to put the MAF sensor connector back and the car started running as if someone fixed it!..
I realized something wasn't right because the CEL was on constantly.
I saw what it was and put the MAF connector back. Shortly after car started exhibiting the same idle surges...
I removed the MAF connector and the car worked fine except that the CEL was on...
So I will be dumbfounded if this turns out to be a BAD MAF sensor...
What do you think:confused: :confused: :confused:
 
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You know thats what the mechanic said what he did. Mentioned that removing the MAF sensor connection improved the symptoms. Thats why I have one shipping to me, figure might as well if it might help.

Edit: I'm curious if you cleaned your MAF recently and do you have a K&N filter?
 
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The flashing CEL you were experiencing was most definitely a misfire, probably linked to the spark plug covered in oil. Clean that ish off and see what that will net you.
 
If it's truly EGR then block off the vac line going to valve and the problem will stop. The engine does not need EGR to run correctly, all it will do is move the timing around a little more when pinging shows up easier. Proper EGR reduces pinging. You must block vac line or will have a leak through EGR solenoid valve. This of course relies on the EGR valve settling all the way down to "zero", or all the way off. If valve sticks, may still give trouble even with it turned off. If motor seems to be running well at the time, that's the time to unplug it.
 
Have a look at the area where the PCV hose enters the intake on Zetec 4. Thinking this is real close to the same as on Focus. I have seen Focus 3 times suck through a fuel softened PCV hose right where it clamps to intake. Makes a really big intake leak that produces most of those symptoms. Hard to find it too.
 
EGR problem shows up worse on cold start and at low rpm/idle or light load (cruise). EGR is supposed to be OFF at idle and cold engine.
 
When I take the Catalytic converter out to replace the PVC(and clean the oil separator) I am going to clean the EGR tube going from the cat to the EGR. Check the car to see if symptoms improve. If no improvement, check/clean tube from intake to EGR (this sounds promising.) If no improvement, replace O2 sensor. If no improvement still, replace the MAF.

After that, I'm hoping for this mess to end.
 
KerryKool said:
When I take the Catalytic converter out to replace the PVC(and clean the oil separator) I am going to clean the EGR tube going from the cat to the EGR. Check the car to see if symptoms improve. If no improvement, check/clean tube from intake to EGR (this sounds promising.) If no improvement, replace O2 sensor. If no improvement still, replace the MAF.

After that, I'm hoping for this mess to end.
Click to expand...

How do you plan on cleaning that EGR tube between EGR valve and cat?
Or what do you expect? That's is a large metal tube and should be tough to remove. Is there any chance that might be clogged? I am thinking that not likely. Chances the vacuum hose coming from PCV valve is more likely to clogged than the EGR tube. But I may be mistaken...
And same goes for the other one between EGR valve and intake.
I didn't mess with those but let me know your findings please.
I will try and find a used MAF sensor but it will be difficult knowing the car is out of production for 8 years.
When are you getting your MAF sensor?
 
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Since its connected to the cat I'll unbolt it and run a wire with a cloth soaked in cleaner through it. I just want to make sure its not clogged or not having enough flow through it, just need to eliminate all possibilities. I'm not sure when I'm getting the MAF, but it should be here in a week, by then, thats all I'll have left to replace, lol. You might get lucky and fun an older Contour/Mystique at a junk yard nearby. If you have no luck, list an ad in the classifieds.

Edit: Noticed your post count isn't high enough yet, get with me and I'll list an ad for you.
 
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Thank you for the offer man. If I am sure that the problem is MAF, I may use your help. Meanwhile I will see if I can find one from a junk yard but I can tell it won't be easy because not all contours have the same type MAF sensor.
Couple years ago while suspecting my MAF sensor, I got one from a junk yard and the connector was different.

I am still trying to convince myself though. How could an MAF sensor cause all this idle issues. It is hard to believe. I will drive the car today with the MAF connector unplugged to since if it is deffinitley curing the problem...

I will post the result.
Meanwhile, can someone please explain the possible side effects of driving the car with MAF sensor unplugged?

Thanks
 
fixed?

fixed?

I've been busy this week and now another update, car is fixed? Heres what I did:

1) Clean MAF with CAF MAF cleaner
2) Replaced K&N filter w/ Fram paper filter
3) PCV valve replaced +cleaned oil separator

The crud that came out of the oil separator was just crazy. The PCV valve itself seemed fine, but there was a difference between the new autozone PCV and my original one. Not sure if it was broken or not, but it wasn't clogged.

The car has yet to stall in any gear after a couple of test drives. I really hope its fixed but I will be doing more tests on it tommorrow after work. Today was only low speed(10-25mph) tests, tommorrow it will go out on the road doing city speeds.

I will update tommorrow.
 
80% sure its fixed!

80% sure its fixed!

After about a 20 min drive around local roads at 45-55mph, no problem arise. Car has no hesitation, bucking, surging of the sorts. It accelerates great and cruises like it should.

I'm going to pick up some gas and head out to my friends place (~3mi away) and see how it does then. I hope for the best, but then again my gut says otherwise. In the past, it has occured randomly, without warning. So my gut instict tells me to bring it to a mechanic to do a once over and see what turns up.

To sum things up, it may have been the PVC valve after all, but cannot be certain. I'm going to take a picture of the difference between the old and new one and I want to see what you have to say.

Thanks for the support to all that has helped me through this mess.
 
Hey Kerry,

Good to hear you made some progress...

Yes, I have done all those in your list and plus more with no luck so far.

PVC valve replacement was my first thing to do and I was hoping alot. When I removed it, it was full of sludge but it was NOT clogged and it would rattle. So then I knew it wasn't going to fix my issue.
I cleaned the oil separator with some brake cleaner and I cannot tell you how much stuff came out of it. It was amazing that the car was running with all that stuff in the oil separator. And although, it was possible to clean the PCV valve, I replaced it with the once I got from Autozone for 3 bucks. Bit before that just to make sure I went to dealr to check the original one and it was identical to what Autozone is selling excpet that dealr was asking $11 for it.

Here is my PCV valve after 13 years and 170k miles and then the new one

The one thing confused me is that this PCV valve is NOT actually a one way valve. It doesn't seal it no matter which way you blow it. Weird!..
 

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well...

well...

I'm glad I said I was only 80% sure it was fixed.

The bucking is back. This is after a 10mi trip to the bank and out to my friends house flawlessly. I stay over for about 2hrs and its time to leave. I get out to my "fixed" car and noticed a little trouble starting and that was my first sign the car wasn't fixed. I drive about 2 mins away and my bucks flashing a cel everytime it bucks. Soon after not giving it gas it stalls out, while still in gear.

Now its back to the same problem as before, works fine in reverse and neutral but as soon I get going in drive I have the surging.

I'm going to leave it at my friends place tonight and come back after work and see if it can drive to the nearby mechanics shop.

For a brief overview of what I've done:
1-EGR valve cleaned and tested -works fine
2-Checked for leaks in vac lines by mechanics and myself -no problems
3-Fuel pump and filter replaced -no improvement
4-IAC replaced -idled better, did not fix problem
5-PITA PVC valve replaced and cleaned oil separator -see 6
6-MAF sensor cleaned and filter replaced(paper) -brief fix for about 20mi but back to the same symptoms.

I might replace the O2 sensor just to rule it out. I should be getting a new MAF in the mail anytime now and will replace when I get it.

Any input is apprieciated!
 
Well durr. You never fixed the oil in the plug well! That oil is killing the spark where the wire connects to the plug.
 
I'm going to run by the auto parts store and pick up the spark plugs after work and replace them at my friends place. I'm not convinced it is the plugs because it idles perfectly and drives fine in reverse (if it wasn't illegal to drive in reverse on the roads, I would do it.:laugh:)

Which plugs should I get? I have Autolite double platnium in right now and have ~20k miles on them.

I've googled this problem in the past, but did it again to see if anything new comes up. I found a few threads similar to my problems.

http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=159178 -water in plug wells was removed and replaced plugs cured problem

http://www.focusfanatics.com/forum/showthread.php?t=117146&highlight=car+bucking&page=5 -tuned to 93 octane and disabled EGR system cured problem

http://www.focushacks.com/index.php?modid=66 -A simple how-to for disabling EGR (might try)
 
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