Bearing noise?

[ubnpast]

I have a 96 2.5 mtx mystuque, currently 134k miles. I recently had my idler pulley bearings go, I replaced that anlong with the serp belt, and about a week later I have somewhat of a screetching ticking noise that gets faster as the rpms go up, it usually comes after i drive a mile after the cars been sitting overnight (I will post a video tommorow when I get one).
I tried to spray oil on things I though it could be coming from, but the noise did not go away (like it did when i sprayed oil on the idler pulley). Im thinking its either the power steering pump or something to do with my wobbling crank pulley.. Any ideas?

 

[Ray]

remove the serp belt.

check for play in all pulleys/bearings

if no results, start car.. Is the sound gone? If so, it is one of the pulleys that the belt normally moves. If the sound is STILL there it may be your crank pulley (even with no play) or something not related to the FEAD.

 

[bobdorit]

I have a 96 2.5 mtx mystuque, currently 134k miles. I recently had my idler pulley bearings go, I replaced that anlong with the serp belt, and about a week later I have somewhat of a screetching ticking noise that gets faster as the rpms go up, it usually comes after i drive a mile after the cars been sitting overnight (I will post a video tommorow when I get one).
I tried to spray oil on things I though it could be coming from, but the noise did not go away (like it did when i sprayed oil on the idler pulley). Im thinking its either the power steering pump or something to do with my wobbling crank pulley.. Any ideas?

some times when you put a new belt it does not completely match with the groves on pullies and make noise, spray water! on the belt while engine is runing and see if the noise goes or not.

 

[Ray]

Please do not spray water on ANY part of your engine, especially while running!


The only exception should be mild/CONTROLLED amounts if you are degreasing the UIM/strut towers, etc.. NEVER get water near the PCM/Alternator, or wiring, which is exactly what the above poster said to do.


:nonono:

 

[bobdorit]

Please do not spray water on ANY part of your engine, especially while running!


The only exception should be mild/CONTROLLED amounts if you are degreasing the UIM/strut towers, etc.. NEVER get water near the PCM/Alternator, or wiring, which is exactly what the above poster said to do.


:nonono:

I never said spray water on PCM, alternator, or wiring I said carfully spray a little water on belt, I have done it before , and to be sure not to splash water on electrical components and PCM, you should check which place is best on belt, and if you think water reaches PCM!! better not to do that at all.

 

[Ray]

The point stands..

don't use water... The ENDS is fine.. your means is not. they make belt spray, dressing and silencer for those reasons.

Either way.. you should never place ANY dressing, spray or water on your FEAD/serp belt.. those things are made for radiator belts, V-belts, etc. Read the bottles, they all specifically state not to place on serp belts, etc.

if your belt is SQUEAKING.. there is a problem.. if its humming, or noisy, then the belt could be riding a pulley or tensioner wrong, or just be wider/noisier than the old one..

Just because YOU have done something doesn't mean you should recommend it to the masses. You have to remember there are reasons for this:

1: you could have been lucky, the other person may not be and then THEY are out a car.. that sucks!

2: they may not have ANY automotive inclination and wouldn't KNOW what NOT to spray or what was safe.. Just because YOU had the forethought to check doesn't mean they would or would even know what to look for.

You simply can't go around recommending things that you've squeaked by on, or do all the time JUST because you've never had a problem. Its not safe, or wise, and when a novice does what you did and loses an engine or a PCM or worse a HAND (you never know) it won't affect you.. it affects THEM... You have to think about that before you make a recommendation

 

[gary_jabo]

I'm curous about the whole conversation regarding water
sprayed on the engine while it is running. Right or
wrong I have sprayed a few drops of water on a belt
to isolate a squeek.

I do have experience with using belt dressing on a serp belt.
DON'T do it. I was stupid and did it more than once
and the result was always the same. The belt dressing
works in reverse, that is, it makes the noise worse.
The only solution I have found for a squeeky belt is a new belt.
I've tried other remedies as well. When you don't have a
24x7 parts store around at 2am you try other techniques.
Like taking the belt off and roughing it up with a wire brush
to take off the shiny glow. That didn't work well either.
At least the noise didn't get any worse. Has anyone tried
sand-blasting the pulley's to increase friction?

But my question is with regard to water. What happens when
it rains, or snows. To assume none of the water from the road
touches the engine cannot be believed. I've driven in snow
storms where the snow fills the engine compartment right up
to the hood where all you can see is the spinning fan (on a
belt driven fan / rear drive car) and the engine still runs fine.
So why should I be so cautious as to never let a drop of water
fall on a running engine? Within reason I believe that the engine is
designed to handle a little bit of water from the outside while
it is running.

That's my humble opinion.
Gary --- Atlanta

 

[Ray]

To clear that up:

I didn't say "one drop of water will ruin the engine" I said that he was going around recommending sort of "willy-nilly" to "spray water!" on the engine/belt with it running..

He didn't state ANY cautions, any warnings, ANY descriptions, ANY adverse effects that you may cause if you spray the PCM, the alternator (which is the LOWEST POINT ON THE BELT PATH!!) nothing.. just "spray water..."

a novice reads that, thinks they found the perfect solution to their noise and blasts the alternator. the PCM or worse.

 

[bobdorit]

To clear that up:

I didn't say "one drop of water will ruin the engine" I said that he was going around recommending sort of "willy-nilly" to "spray water!" on the engine/belt with it running..

He didn't state ANY cautions, any warnings, ANY descriptions, ANY adverse effects that you may cause if you spray the PCM, the alternator (which is the LOWEST POINT ON THE BELT PATH!!) nothing.. just "spray water..."

a novice reads that, thinks they found the perfect solution to their noise and blasts the alternator. the PCM or worse.

I should have talk about the warnings and dangers I am happy the conversation reached to this point thanks Ray and Gary so anybody who reads this knows about dangers.

 

[Ray]

Yeah, like I said.. its not anything personal.. The ENDS is a good thing.. it was just the MEANS that I wanted to make sure were described..

 

[rk2k2]

Here's one for you- what if it was pure H2O?

I know the rain and snow isn't pure but I would think it has way less contaminants than tap water. Which in turn could lead to one reason rain and snow usually have little effect on the engine. Then again, must be enough contaminates that vehicles driven into a flooded area usually die if deep enough. Then again, I suppose by the time an area has flooded an area the water has had enough time to pick up contanimants that conduct ...

 

[Ray]

uhm... vehicles die from deep water through a simple for of asphyxiation. (you starved the engine of air by blocking the filter with water!

 

[rk2k2]

uhm... vehicles die from deep water through a simple for of asphyxiation. (you starved the engine of air by blocking the filter with water!

Not THAT deep! I'm talking people that drive through say a foot of water ...

Don't know how it is with vehicles today, but back in the days of distrubutors with points, driving in heavy 'flooding' was a good way to kill your car

 

[Ray]

oh.. haha
that is simple corrosion.. in the wiring, etc.

 

[ubnpast]

I pulled the belt off this morning, the noise went away. I played with the ps pump pulley, it turns but has shaft play (from drivers side to pass. side), i would say it moves about 1/8".

I guess time to look for another pump.

remove the serp belt.

check for play in all pulleys/bearings

if no results, start car.. Is the sound gone? If so, it is one of the pulleys that the belt normally moves. If the sound is STILL there it may be your crank pulley (even with no play) or something not related to the FEAD.

 

[Ray]

So, the bearing of the pulley on the PS pump is tight (no wobble of the pulley itself)

but the shaft ITSELF rides in and out of the block (longer and shorter shaft length) by about an 1/8".. correct?




good work! job well done!

 

[bobdorit]

So, the bearing of the pulley on the PS pump is tight (no wobble of the pulley itself)

but the shaft ITSELF rides in and out of the block (longer and shorter shaft length) by about an 1/8".. correct?




good work! job well done!

what do you think? just after one week the belt is changed the pump is gone? my friend it is not the way to find faulty pump!
the first thing is that people who do not have experience can not distinguish the noise from a bad bearing and squeeky belt, with removing belt and disapearing noise, the niose could be from squeeky belt, or a bad bearing, first go for cheapest one, at this stage I recammand apply some dishwasher liquid or some corn or other cooking oil like Mazolla on the belt and install it ( both of them do not have any bad effects on the rubber or pullies and do not last long) install the belt and see if the noise dissapears for a while or not if so you find that noise is from the squeeky belt, otherwise you go for PS bearing or alternator bearing or others...

 

[Tony2005]

Just one more thing on water, our engines, and issues. Our Contours are prone to wiring harness issues. Letting water touch the exposed wires is not a good thing. While we cannot prevent small amounts of water from getting to the engine area (especially the bottom) when it rains, it would be silly to intentionally pour water on the engine.

 

[gary_jabo]

I really like the comment regarding deep water.

>>> uhm... vehicles die from deep water through a simple for of asphyxiation.

My personal experience is with my Mitsu. Eclipse and its cold air intake.
Going through some deep water is really bad when the air intake is 8-inches
above the ground. Car stalled of asphyxiation but fortunately no permanent
damage.
The broken timing belt a few days later on the Eclipse took care damage
thing giving me the opportunity to fix 4 bent valves.

I've had a little experience with water and wiring in the Contour.
After "Mr. J's Wild ride" off the interstate in a rain storm the car
ended up in a ditch listing to the right. The passenger side floor was
filled with 3 inches of water. The tow truck pulled me out and once
I drained the water out I started the car and drove it, but the CEL
light started flashing, strange code about a sensor that I believe was
not affected by the off-road experience.

So I pulled out the seats and carpets. I was baffled by the fact that I
could not find a major electrical connector between the firewall and
the engine compartment. Pulling out the carpets revealed a giant
electrical connector, apparently some of the major wiring between
the dashboard and the engine compartment. The connector was located
just in front of the right door jam very near the rocker panel.

Of course this connector
was under water during the (almost) crash. So I disconnected the
2 halves of the connector and applied warm air with a hair dryer.
After a few minutes I connected the wires again and VOILA,
no more CEL. Lucky for me because I didn't want to take the car
to a mechanic so he could charge me for using his hair dryer.

Many thanks to those that read my comments.
Regards-- Gary--- Atlanta

 

[ubnpast]

So, the bearing of the pulley on the PS pump is tight (no wobble of the pulley itself)

but the shaft ITSELF rides in and out of the block (longer and shorter shaft length) by about an 1/8".. correct?




good work! job well done!

Yes. Is it normal for the shaft to ride in and out like that?