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You asked for it lol

1st I hate my voice..

2nd I don't say anything when it's not taking the charge at first, you'll see the needle hop around on the gauge but drops right back when I close the valve...

3rd what I do at the end is stupid, but shows why you have to turn the can upside down...

4th I had to keep it under 25mb so it's kinda poor video, and I should of worked on it more, but wife is bugging me

here is a link to video....

http://media.putfile.com/AC-Charge


JD a.k.a Fingers "Don't Panic" '98 Contour GL 2.0L VCT ATX 88k '98 Contour LX 2.5L MTX 120k Street racing can kill just less of a chance with a 2.0
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Originally posted by projectSHO89:
Wow!

System should be evacuated first. This removes moisture which will 1) cause corrosion in the system and 2) greatly reduce system efficiency.

Make damned certain you're hooking your death kit up to the LOW side port, not the high side port. Only a well-trained person with the correct equipment should do high-side port service filling.

The system should be charged with the can upright, not turned upside down. If you don't know why, you have no business screwing with an AC system.

System capacity is listed either on an underhood label or in the service manual. Do not exceed this amount. If you overcharge the system, it will work just as badly as if it is undercharged, if at all.

Get a manifold guage set so you can monitor both sides of the system. Then, you'll know what's actually going on.

Steve




This man knows his A/C. I know a little about this. When turning the can upside down, you allow refrigerant in the liquid state to travel through the line. Liquids are not compressible, so you risk slugging your compressor with liquid, which will destroy it. It is designed to compress gas, not liquid.

As the gas leaves the can, the can gets very cold because the pressure is dropping inside the can. I have had very good luck with holding the can in the hot stream of air that comes from the engine fan. If you get the can to warm up, the refrigerant will flow, and in the appropriate gas state.

Also, if your mechanic opened up your a/c system to atmosphere and did not evacuate the system before giving it back to you, I would say at the minimum you need to have it evacuated, but to do it right you should replace the receiver/drier because it contains moisture absorbent which goes bad when exposed to atmosphere for a long period of time.

Also critical is that the engine and A/C are on when you are charging.


96 Contour GL 2.0L MTX with Early SE 7 spoke wheels, SE sideskirts, Koni Sport Kit 70 Mustang Sportsroof with mild 351W and '01 Mustang GT wheels
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Originally posted by jd2-98s:
...what I do at the end shows why you should not turn the can upside down...




Fixed


96 Contour GL 2.0L MTX with Early SE 7 spoke wheels, SE sideskirts, Koni Sport Kit 70 Mustang Sportsroof with mild 351W and '01 Mustang GT wheels
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By the way, if you dont mind me asking... How much was your engine replacement? Did they rebuild it themselves? I'd appreciate any details on this.

Im interested because my 96 zetec is getting up there in the miles and I've always wondered what it would cost to have someone else do the job.

Thanks!


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Originally posted by sk8token:
Originally posted by jd2-98s:
...what I do at the end shows why you should not turn the can upside down...




Fixed




Cool I want the input. I'm going to talk to my grandfather, he has worked on A/C all his life. I think at one time he said something about putting a tank in warm/hot water to help the gas flow.

But I have one question. I understand the gas flowing from the can of ref. turning into gas as it boils off. However sometimes these things have oil/stopleak. I'm not understanding how the oil/stopleak would turn into a gas in travel.

I'm not at all saying I'm right, but I did my 4cyl tour last year, turning can upside down, and it seems to still be fine. Again, I'm not saying I'm right. And understand what you are saying about liquid ref on the low side.

I wanted to add. Is if the system cycles, or sorta works but low, wouldn't the liquid as it hits the hot gas in the low side change over as soon as it enters the stream?

Last edited by jd2-98s; 06/23/06 01:38 AM.

JD a.k.a Fingers "Don't Panic" '98 Contour GL 2.0L VCT ATX 88k '98 Contour LX 2.5L MTX 120k Street racing can kill just less of a chance with a 2.0
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Originally posted by jd2-98s:
... However sometimes these things have oil/stopleak. ..




Yes, I'm pretty sure that's when you turn it upside down; towards the end to let the oil/additives go in the system.
http://www.id-usa.com/how_to_faqs_retrofitting.asp#23


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Ya, I've also heard of that method. Either way, warming the can up a little works wonders in getting the gas out.

To answer your 1st question, the R134-a carries particles of these materials with it as it flows, in gas or liquid form. Just like in your a/c system, the oil in the system is made to be carried with the refrigerant used, so that the refrigerant will deliver it through to the various components (especially the compressor) as it moves through the system. This is why you can't use R-12's mineral oil in a R134a system. R134a is not compatible with mineral oil and will not carry the oil through the system very well at all.

By the way, I think the stop leaks and such contained in those cans are frowned upon by a/c technicians. Im not one of them, so I don't know for sure.. but it's one of the reasons they are nicknamed "death kits". They are known to plug up expansion valves and cause issues with gumming up, etc.

To your last point.. I think you are probably right to a certain extent. At idle the "suction" is probably slow enough that any liquid being added has a chance to convert to a gas before entering the compressor. The suction side is cold, though, not hot.

I'm also guilty of having tilted the can when charging in a hurry. It really is playing with fire though from what I've read. When I did it I would more swirl the can in the upright position and briefly turn it upside down, because I knew I was risking it.


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My out look would be this.

If your A/C will not function and is empty. You need to go to the shop.

If your A/C cycles, or just isn't running cold or takes longer to get cold. Then a DIY can be done.

Here is my thoughts on adding liquid to the low side in a cycling/working but low system. There is hot gas in the line being cycle. The thought is, if you add the liquid to the gas, it, itself should turn into gas and expand in the lowside as soon as it enters the system. Therefor bring the psi up in the low side of the A/C system, and never reaching the compressor in a liquid state.





JD a.k.a Fingers "Don't Panic" '98 Contour GL 2.0L VCT ATX 88k '98 Contour LX 2.5L MTX 120k Street racing can kill just less of a chance with a 2.0
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Originally posted by jd2-98s:
My out look would be this.

If your A/C will not function and is empty. You need to go to the shop.

If your A/C cycles, or just isn't running cold or takes longer to get cold. Then a DIY can be done.

Here is my thoughts on adding liquid to the low side in a cycling/working but low system. There is hot gas in the line being cycle. The thought is, if you add the liquid to the gas, it, itself should turn into gas and expand in the lowside as soon as it enters the system. Therefor bring the psi up in the low side of the A/C system, and never reaching the compressor in a liquid state.








Ok, cold gas in the line hehe. I hope this helps everyone, this was a good thread.



JD a.k.a Fingers "Don't Panic" '98 Contour GL 2.0L VCT ATX 88k '98 Contour LX 2.5L MTX 120k Street racing can kill just less of a chance with a 2.0
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Ya, I think for the most part you'd have trouble hydro-locking a compressor by tipping a small can of refrigerant upside down. The question you have to ask yourself though, is "do I really want to risk having the compressor blow, and then have to replace and/or flush out every component in the a/c system, or do I want to just gently warm the can and not have to worry?"

On my zetec I like to hang the can right back by the ignition coil. When the engine is warmed up and the A/C system is on, there is some real heat flow under there... plenty to warm that can up and get the refrigerant moving in a hurry. In fact, I can't even hold my hand there for very long the heat is so intense. I never have any problems emptying a can completely and plenty quickly when I do this.

I hope this helps people charge their a/c. I've done it for about 4 years now on this car (once each summer due to a slow leak). Always works like a champ!




96 Contour GL 2.0L MTX with Early SE 7 spoke wheels, SE sideskirts, Koni Sport Kit 70 Mustang Sportsroof with mild 351W and '01 Mustang GT wheels
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