So I guess I didn't go down the list and fully explain why I thought the MAFia was no better than just another MAF scaling device.
My statement was incomplete; it is a "scaling device" that Diablo just went and did some of the homework on before hand so that you have some idea of how to select the settings and start tuning with it. This device seems similar to, but a bit more refined than say an SAFC, with maybe a nicer package, th at has some presets that help you get it into the ballpark faster(maybe). Will it save you money though? It is a toss-up to me whether it will decrease the time required to tune and whether it will offset the cost of the device.
No matter how you slice it, it is still altering the MAF signal before it goes into the PCM and then you still have to sit there and screw with the PCM values to get the thing to work. How is this so much different than just getting a differen't MAF for the car except that now you are using their guidelines to try to get it tuned in?
Not to mention that the statements I made earlier about this method actually decreasing the MAFs effective measuring resolution are still valid, and probably making it harder to tune idle/cruise in the process.
I fully agree that maf scaling devices are sometimes necessary and if you read back several pages I stated that early on....in the case where you could not get a properly sized factory MAF then I would use something like this. It really seems to me that Diablo was targeting the competition from a PRO-M like setup and this component paired with a factory MAF could do the same thing.
I personally can NOT see how this is superior to getting a Factory calibrated MAF with the correct airflow range and installing it with the downloaded factory MAF transfer function.
BUt that's right, that is so old school isn't it?
With a scaling device you loose some ability to keep the idle voltage ranges where they were designed and you have to compensate for that by adjusting the MAFia settings, the pcm transfer function, injector slopes, basically a whole crap load of variables!
That method, as opposed to just plugging in 30 datapoints for a new factory MAF or even a PRO-M if they publish the data (Which the DO!) and you can immediately fire the car up and it will idle. Take it on a short drive and it learns how far off the commanded Lambda values the system really is, then it just trims the fuel until those values are reached.
At this point with a wideband you make gradual progressive runs to verify that it is keeping the air fuel in the correct range. Check fuel trims at key rpm points to see if your transfer function is off substantially, then adjust if necessary.
Unless you punched in the values wrong or your O2 sensors are bad, then it will be right close to the target air fuel. If you want to adjust your air fuel, and your fuel trims are all withing +/-10% then and all you have to do is adjust your commanded lambda values until you obtain the desired air/fuel ratio. A very simple process really.
This method takes no more than an hour or two and requires only
a properly sized MAF and injectors along with the flashing/tuning software of your choice like: SCT, TWeecer, Diablo, etc.
-Idle quality is near perfect or not different than factory
-Cruise driveability is completely stock
-WOT air fuel safe and within the target range
and finally, this method yields the following advantages:
-Gas mileage city/highway is usually improved on near stock applications, or only slightly lower than stock with high power applications(on my 3L turbo it was 9% lower than a stock 2.5L engine,this with over twice the stock horsepower to the wheels)
-the ability to raise the boost up and down with no further tuning required.
-No additional electronics required on the engine, nothing but factory hardware to affect reliability.
-Save money through reduced hardware and tuning costs.
This is why I don't understand how you can say/imply that this product is the "cutting edge" of tuning while "we" tuning with
properly sized factory hardware are in the past.
Except in rare cases, the MAF-ia (and other maf scaling devices) is not the most desirable method and IS what I call 'hack-tuning...to be used only in an emergency' type of device or as a crutch when you don't know how to
properly size your maf and injectors.
So before you get all mad, realize I'm saying there are situations where this may present the best solution and in that case would NOT be hack tuning but the only proper method, and I will even go further and say that YOU would probably know the difference and have only used it in situations where it was necessaryHopefully someone else knowledgeable in tuning can come on and share their feelings on it too so that people can see all viewpoints.
BTW, from the Diablosport website, a little more proof that this is actually more work than
proper MAF/injecor sizing and tuning and IMHO should only be used if you have no properly sized MAF available:
Originally posted by Diablosport:
Tuning Notes
There are many factors that may affect your tuning. If you apply the correction ratio and the car does not run properly, you may have to modify the correction factor to get the desired results. Here are a few things to keep in mind.
1. When you do the original tune without the MAFia, reset the keep alive memory. Tune the car just like you normally would. Tune Wide Open Throttle as well, once you see 4.9 volts on your mass air flow meter, stop the pull. Your long terms will stay 0 until you turn the adaptive back on.
2. Load should be between 15-20 %.
3. Check your fuel trims and loads before the installation of the MAFia. Write them down.
Install the MAFia (apply correction factor to tune) and check them again
If your fuel trims are more negative and the load is larger, then try reducing the correction factor and reapply the new correction factor to your original tune.
If your fuel trims are more positive and the load is smaller, then try increasing the correction factor and reapply the new correction factor to your original tune.
4. Some vehicles may develop a high or erratic idle when the mafia is used on it�s higher settings. Lowering the target mass air voltages in the functions can be useful when trying to eliminate idle problems. Reduce the right hand side of the Target Mass Air Functions by the same correction factor as the MAFia setting you are using.
I really don't mind but don't come on insulting me because I don't agree. Your record of arguing and actually admitting you were ever wrong has been pretty slim....to none. In fact, I don't remember you EVER being conviced of anything other than your own opinions and yet you come here and accuse me of what appears to be your own same flaw.
