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This oneâ??s for all the people that know who this oneâ??s for. Thanks to Tom for making the design and me for making it correct.  300mm front rotors and 280mm rear rotors using the stock calipers. This would work on any stock disc brake car. (including ~98.5+ SVTâ??s) 300mm SVT Focus front rotors with E1 rims that even have inner wheel weights.  280mm Bendix (ex)front rotors on the rear.  There are larger pictures on my website. I have had them on for nearly 2000 brutal miles that includes: repetitive 60-0 testing, high spade fade testing, my typical driving, etc. My pad wear is ideal as shown on the rotors. I have had every thing apart numerous times to check every thing. All the hardware is grade 10, the spacers are non-ferrous stainless steel, the front adapter bracket is 1/2" & the rear is 3/8â? - both high carbon plate steel. The adapter brackets are painted with high temp black paint. The OEM caliper brackets, calipers, & rotors are painted with silver VHT. I have Stainless Steel lines. I consider these a must due to the fact that the caliper position is rotated radially. The improvement in braking is a lot better then I expected. The average braking distance over 10 stops, which factors in fade, dropped nearly 20 feet. My best one time braking distance improved 8 feet, from 124 to a very tire limited 116. Stock was 131 feet. The fade resistance is just excellent at any speed. I tested the previous brake setup right before I did the changes. I was running Bendix CT3 pads and rotors. I first tested the change to 300mm fronts and performance ceramic pads. I then installed the 280mm rears (my old Bendix fronts) with KVR pads. I went with KVR over â??stockishâ? pads because during the testing I was doing I had noticed the brake bias was still a bit imbalanced towards the front. With the higher CoF KVR pads the rear now feels more stable under hard braking and any braking in the corners. I have included the braking data from AutoSpec Rotors and Bendix T2 pads. (from Stazi a while ago) My car was a bit lighter & had 225/50 KDW tires when I did that testing. My car has gained a few pounds back in its old age. Luckily Iâ??ve lost a couple myself.  I flushed the fluid at the beginning and between every test. Iâ??m using ATE super blue. It is quite good as many others already know. The test runs are two groups of five consecutive 60-0 mph stops. There is roughly a five minute period of moderate driving, for me, between the groups in order to go back and repeat them in order again. I feel this is a very good indication of fade. I also think that using the average braking number results this way is a better barometer of the braking systems real ability. Call it braking under the curve. The average also is also an indicator of how they would handle stops from higher speeds as well.   The weather and my camera have both sucked recently so I do not have any good car pictures. (side view) I'm fixing the camera part because I should have my new one in a few days. In the mean time here is an okay side view picture I took on the way home today. Better ones soon hopefully.  Looks stock doesn't it? I love that. I updated my pages.
2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
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GREAT work guys. Can't wait to get my hands on some of these parts.
10 fade stops........hmmm, looks like someone has and idea about FMVSS-105 testing.
I'll put holes in him!!
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Cool Toe Chris
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Cool Toe Chris
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Greg, your brakes link on your site is no workee.
Chris
NJ
98.5 SVT Silver Frost
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OMFG...I am sooo glad you guys did this! 
I JUST bought BRAND new calipers...Goodridge lines for all 4 corners. Now I need these brackets...when can I buy these!? 
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Finally you get a dang full length shot of the car so I can actually see how they look on stock wheels.  I'm so proud......
Very Nice write-up Demon, and of course the braking data was everything I was hoping for! 
So how did this come about?
For those of you frequent the brake forums, you'll see an old post I started that is several years old about using FSVT rotors with stock caliper brackets.
Well, in the time since then I was deployed for a year, I started to pick up the project, then gave up because I ran into limitations.
After I really started needing brakes this past summer from turbo kit enhancement #3...  ; I decided I needed better brakes in a hurry.
And then I found that just to get a quality high performance braking system like the TCE setup to fit my Focus Rims, I was looking down the barrel of $1800 with no guarantees that they would fit well or clear the wheel without a significant amount of work. The rotor size was also limited to the 12.2" and such. The rears were fine but I didn't want beautiful rears with cheap azzed fronts. And bottom line, I didn't need true racing car brakes, only something better than stock to compensate for all that increased power I had (That Ray now has). So if I couldn't fit the higher quality brakes kits and still keep the rims, then I wasn't going to spend that kind of cash and STILL end up having to swap out my rims.
So I started again on this project. I sunk a chunk of change into parts and started to build a setup on a hub I had bolted to the bench. Well, the first design failed and I decided screw it that I would order the FSVT front hardware and give up.
I kid you not, while the parts were en route from Bill Jenkins, I was just daydreaming about the first design and I slapped myself on the forehead for being so dumb as I got a revelation. This time all I did was "think out of the box" and I made the design work by offsetting the calipers. I had already done all the hard measurements within 10 minutes I had the first "New" Design sketch and I was confident with some more R&D it would work.
So then I went on to design rear brake bracketry using similar desings and when ahead and built a set for the rears. Again I put out some cash and lots of time and built a set of rears. I got them working, tested and when matched with the FSVT front kit and stainless steel lines I had what for me was the best braking car I'd ever had.
But I already had FSVT fronts now and I just wanted to see the front project to completion so I contacted Demon about taking the basic raw hardware kit I would put together and then making all necessary modifications to actually get it to work, and of course to do all the testing on it. Plus he had stock rims so that was a big factor.
Well, he ran into some challenges but I was confident with his skills that he would overcome them. And boy did he! There were some days that would have just made an ordinary man give up or some people to start bitching and quit.
Well he was bitching lol, but he never quit and because of his work the kit became finalized.
Congrats to him.
PS: Make no mistake, if I were wealthy this project would never have happened. The TCE Brake kit is some great stuff and if you want the ultimate in brakes for our car then go for it.
If you are a Focus SVT brakes kinda guy then this is going to be a good solution should I choose to release this for the general CEG'r/NECO'r
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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I have no life
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Nice! I have the FSVT front kit. Still waiting to get rotors for a good price so I can install it with my SS lines. So you guys built a custom bracket so the front caliper would fit in the rear?
-'96 SE MTX 3L
-'98 SVT 1,173 of 6,535
-'05 Mazda 6s, loaded, g/f's ride
-Need a 96-00 manual on CD? PM or email me
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Addicted CEG\'er
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In a nutshell? yes, they did.
'99 CSVT - Silver #222/276
In a constant state of blow-off euphoria.
Originally posted by Kremitthefrog:
I like to wear dresses and use binoculars to watch grandmas across the street.
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Originally posted by todras:
So you guys built a custom bracket so the front caliper would fit in the rear?
Looks like the rear caliper is being used. I wouldn't want to lose the parking brake
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Hard-core CEG'er
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Originally posted by todras:
Nice! I have the FSVT front kit. Still waiting to get rotors for a good price so I can install it with my SS lines. So you guys built a custom bracket so the front caliper would fit in the rear?
The ROTORS are used on the back, calipers stay stock. If have a set of CSVT rotors you'll be set to do the backs.
The hardware is designed to use the stock caliper, bracketry and pads on the front (including lines but SS lines rec.) and with some modification install a 300mm FSVT rotor.
Then the former front rotor can be turned and with a little modification to it and the rear caliper bracket, and you will use the former fornt rotor on the rear.
The change in rotor size on both the front and the rear at the same time essentially keeps the same percentage of brake bias front to rear as was designed stock, only with a lot more stopping power and fade resistance.
It also saves you the money of having to buy rear rotors.
So you buy FSVT front rotors, the hardware kits, new pads if necessary, SS lines if you want, then that is it.
However, the conversion requires some tools and mechanical skills.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Well, I am up for the 'kit' if you decide to make it. Just say the word. I had planned on the FSVT front kit already, and have aquired the rear disk setup for conversion, so this will enhance plans for the car.
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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So this is basically similar to the TCE rear kit, which uses the stock rear caliper, but for cheap? 280mm vs the 11in(?) TCE kit...looks good. I already have a Baer 13in front kit so anything out back to make up for that bias would be great, especially without having to spend 500 for the TCE kit.
Ohsigmachi '96 GL MTX Zetec
--I don't won't to hurt you, but it's still on my list of things to do.--
View project Slippery Slope
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would this kit work with the early e0 calipars?
"Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but STUPID lasts forever."-Aristophanes.
--93 pgt,headers,intake,borla=14.9 1/4mile
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Originally posted by tour96SeVT:
would this kit work with the early e0 calipars?
According to Demons post, YES.
My understanding is that the Front 280mm rotors will be moved to the back, but the stock rear calipers will be retained. If you don't keep the stock rears, you lose the parking brake. 
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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i understand how the swap works,but the front calipars and the mounting bracket are different for early and late svt's..ahhh forget it, i'll figure it out
"Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated, and drunkenness sobered, but STUPID lasts forever."-Aristophanes.
--93 pgt,headers,intake,borla=14.9 1/4mile
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Originally posted by tour96SeVT:
i understand how the swap works,but the front calipars and the mounting bracket are different for early and late svt's..ahhh forget it, i'll figure it out
It doesn't matter. As long as the bracketry are for a 280mm rotor then it will work with this hardware; early or late model SVT brakes, cougars, etc.
BTW, this stuff is not a replacement for the TCE stuff. The TCE stuff is very high quality. This setup uses OEM hardware.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Sign me up....I need info on parts needed for this (ie adapter brackets)
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The brakes look great and I want a set. Demon or Warmonger, since this is too complicated for a basic how-to do you guys think you might create a kit and sell it on CEG. Maybe you could hook up with stazi and do a package deal where you guys fab up the brackets and stuff and stazi gets us rotors and pads. I am in need of new front brakes and this is something I am def. interested in buying asap. I have got paypal ready to go, and need some brakes! Let me know if this would be possible ASAP. If you guys cant do this I will just get a stazi kit and upgrade to tce stuff when I get larger wheels.
Originally posted by Who the F are You?:
does your family tree not have any branches on it?
99SVT
235hp @ 6550rpm
212tq @ 5350rpm
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Pics of the rear set up would be the cats PJ's.
-'96 SE MTX 3L
-'98 SVT 1,173 of 6,535
-'05 Mazda 6s, loaded, g/f's ride
-Need a 96-00 manual on CD? PM or email me
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Originally posted by TourDeForce:
Well, I am up for the 'kit' if you decide to make it. Just say the word.
I had planned on the FSVT front kit already, and have aquired the rear disk setup for conversion, so this will enhance plans for the car.
Make that two bracket kits. I'll upgrade the daughter's car while I'm at it. She's diggin on some performance driving these days, and her friends are starting to get into it too.
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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i have been estimating the price to upgrade all for corners of my car for a month or two now. if this is an option i would love to be involved since i imagine it would be less expensive than the route i had planned on.
00 black/tan svt, #2052 of 2150, born 2/1/00
formerly known as my csvt
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than a sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." -Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Im gonna need brakes soon too. I really hope you can get some kind of bracket kit for CEG. I have a feeling alot of people on here would be very interested in a kit. I like using OEM parts to upgrade with. -tropictour
2000 Contour SVT
Tropic Green
SHO Shop CAI
Bassani
1999 Contour SE
BAT Kit
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Originally posted by tropictour:
Im gonna need brakes soon too. I really hope you can get some kind of bracket kit for CEG. I have a feeling alot of people on here would be very interested in a kit. I like using OEM parts to upgrade with.
-tropictour
Good work guys, this is awsome! I've been toying with the idea of going out for TCE or the Baer fronts, but I think that'd be a bit over kill for my useage of my car. I do need something, and soon like so many others.
I'd be up for either a how-to or even a kit. This is the ultimate OEM setup for our cars
2005 Ford F150 SuperCab FX4
1964 Chevrolet Impala SS
1998 CSVT: 354HP/328TQ @ 10 psi, now gone
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Hmm, I just happen to have a set of 280mm rotors lying around. 
· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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Originally posted by TourDeForce:
Originally posted by tour96SeVT:
would this kit work with the early e0 calipars?
According to Demons post, YES.
My understanding is that the Front 280mm rotors will be moved to the back, but the stock rear calipers will be retained. If you don't keep the stock rears, you lose the parking brake.
Demon should be the one to answer this, but I suspect that his brackets would preclude the use of the E0 front calipers. The brake pad backing plate partually rests against the bracket, and although you could probably mount the caliper, I have no idea where you would find the custom pad that would be required.
Also a question for Demon about the rears. IIRC the hat offset of the old rear and old front rotors is different. You must have accounted for that when you built the new rear brackets. Any enlightenment there?
Jim Johnson
98 SVT
03 Escape Limited
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Originally posted by Big Jim:
Originally posted by TourDeForce:
Originally posted by tour96SeVT:
would this kit work with the early e0 calipars?
According to Demons post, YES.
My understanding is that the Front 280mm rotors will be moved to the back, but the stock rear calipers will be retained. If you don't keep the stock rears, you lose the parking brake.
Demon should be the one to answer this, but I suspect that his brackets would preclude the use of the E0 front calipers. The brake pad backing plate partually rests against the bracket, and although you could probably mount the caliper, I have no idea where you would find the custom pad that would be required.
Also a question for Demon about the rears. IIRC the hat offset of the old rear and old front rotors is different. You must have accounted for that when you built the new rear brackets. Any enlightenment there?
You didn't read my post. I invented both these brake conversion kits and asked Demon to do final adjustments and modifications to the fronts for me since I had already put on FSVT brakes on the front of my car... 
So trust me when I say the E0 calipers will work fine.
I compensated for the rotor hat offsets and diameters in the bracketry and spacer design, both front and rear.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Are you saying that you came up with a bracket that will take both the E0 and E1 pads? Or is this a second extension piece that lets you use stock calipers of any type?
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I have no life
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Originally posted by TourDeForce:
My understanding is that the Front 280mm rotors will be moved to the back, but the stock rear calipers will be retained. If you don't keep the stock rears, you lose the parking brake.
Right. I can't see Greg or Tom doing this and eliminating the stock bracket. Must have made a plate to move the stock bracket up.
-'96 SE MTX 3L
-'98 SVT 1,173 of 6,535
-'05 Mazda 6s, loaded, g/f's ride
-Need a 96-00 manual on CD? PM or email me
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So basically we'll need:
FSVT 300mm rotors for front
CSVT 280mm rotors for rear
CSVT stock calipers
Mounting kit/hardware
SS brake lines(optional?)
I just want to make sure that we'd be using the stock calipers that are currently on the car. No moving calipers from front to back, or anything like that. Just adding a mounting kit, to accomodate for the larger rotors.
Mark
2000 Black CSVT
3.0L Hybrid - 206fwhp & 195fwtq
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Ready to buy...money in hand.
99 SE V6\5spd - 156 HP\157 TQ 15.166-90.84
Totaled 02/12/06
99 SVT # 1571 - 175 HP\153 TQ 14.999-91.88
Born 3/24/99 Reborn 3/18/06
Pietenpol Racing Technologies project vehicle
90 Festiva L 5spd, Blue(not for long), 103k
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I have a few questions:
Do you plan to fab and sell this? If not, will you release the dimensions and material specs so someone else can do so?
Do you have to machine the SVT front rotors to get them to fit in the rear calipers?
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Tom and I are working on this to sell them brackets as an upgrade-kit. Hold tight. We're working through logistics and such, so please hold onto your money for any brake upgrades right now. These brackets have had a LOT of work put into them, so don't think we are going to farm out the design. In fact I would go so far as to say that anyone who attempts to copy them will face repurcussions! (A patent may be required to stop would be copiers).
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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Sweet! I'll be due for brakes in the near future and this would work out perfect.  I thought about a big brake kit, but I just can't see spending that much for one when I don't "need" it for everyday driving.
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Warmonger and DemonSVT the contributions you have made to CEG are nothing short of brilliant. This really should not go unnoticed. The information you guys have posted has translated directly into money savings for me. This is yet another example of that. Looking forward to purchasing your kit. My stock non-SVT brakes are not really cutting it with the 3L, as you can imagine.
96 Mystique Black On Tan V6 MTX Port Matched 01 3L, 2.5L Cams, 2.5" Exhaust Optimized y-pipe, SVT clutch, Superchips, 3L split port LIM, SVT UIM, Intake, Mustang 65mm TB, MSDS Headers. Eibach Pro Kit, Torsen Diff., Ford Racing 17" Wheels.
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Originally posted by pole120:
Ready to buy...money in hand.
x2 (for the rears only though)
Ohsigmachi '96 GL MTX Zetec
--I don't won't to hurt you, but it's still on my list of things to do.--
View project Slippery Slope
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Originally posted by Avey:
Warmonger and DemonSVT the contributions you have made to CEG are nothing short of brilliant. This really should not go unnoticed. The information you guys have posted has translated directly into money savings for me. This is yet another example of that. Looking forward to purchasing your kit. My stock SVT brakes are not really cutting it.
Edited...
X2
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this is sweet! Both my front and rear rotors are worn and purple... so I've been thinking about the FSVT brakes. The delay in finalizing these will even allow me to save up $$. Any rough guestimate of about how much we'll need for the kit?
morbid
2000 Contour SVT (black)
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Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by Big Jim:
Originally posted by TourDeForce:
Originally posted by tour96SeVT:
would this kit work with the early e0 calipars?
According to Demons post, YES.
My understanding is that the Front 280mm rotors will be moved to the back, but the stock rear calipers will be retained. If you don't keep the stock rears, you lose the parking brake.
Demon should be the one to answer this, but I suspect that his brackets would preclude the use of the E0 front calipers. The brake pad backing plate partually rests against the bracket, and although you could probably mount the caliper, I have no idea where you would find the custom pad that would be required.
Also a question for Demon about the rears. IIRC the hat offset of the old rear and old front rotors is different. You must have accounted for that when you built the new rear brackets. Any enlightenment there?
You didn't read my post. I invented both these brake conversion kits and asked Demon to do final adjustments and modifications to the fronts for me since I had already put on FSVT brakes on the front of my car...
So trust me when I say the E0 calipers will work fine.
I compensated for the rotor hat offsets and diameters in the bracketry and spacer design, both front and rear.
Please keep us informed. Even though my brakes are reasonably new I'm interested in this kind of an upgrade.
I suspect that they will also work on the E0 wheels. I'll bet that you are not able to commit on that point because you have not had the chance to bolt up a set to confirm.
I'm also interested in how you may end up making the brackets. It looks like a good project for a CNC machine if you intend to use billit. Or perhaps you are looking into a casting/forging with CNC for finishing.
Jim Johnson
98 SVT
03 Escape Limited
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Good Stuff Demon.
I'll be honest, I couldn't come up with a bracket for the stock calipers to use the FSVT fronts that I was happy with design-wise. Props to you if its a good one . . .
When I get some time, I'm going to go through the data you put up a little closer, and I'll probably have some detailed questions about your test method/procedure, lol.
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Originally posted by Big Jim:
Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by Big Jim:
Originally posted by TourDeForce:
Originally posted by tour96SeVT:
would this kit work with the early e0 calipars?
According to Demons post, YES.
My understanding is that the Front 280mm rotors will be moved to the back, but the stock rear calipers will be retained. If you don't keep the stock rears, you lose the parking brake.
Demon should be the one to answer this, but I suspect that his brackets would preclude the use of the E0 front calipers. The brake pad backing plate partually rests against the bracket, and although you could probably mount the caliper, I have no idea where you would find the custom pad that would be required.
Also a question for Demon about the rears. IIRC the hat offset of the old rear and old front rotors is different. You must have accounted for that when you built the new rear brackets. Any enlightenment there?
You didn't read my post. I invented both these brake conversion kits and asked Demon to do final adjustments and modifications to the fronts for me since I had already put on FSVT brakes on the front of my car...
So trust me when I say the E0 calipers will work fine.
I compensated for the rotor hat offsets and diameters in the bracketry and spacer design, both front and rear.
Please keep us informed. Even though my brakes are reasonably new I'm interested in this kind of an upgrade.
I suspect that they will also work on the E0 wheels. I'll bet that you are not able to commit on that point because you have not had the chance to bolt up a set to confirm.
I'm also interested in how you may end up making the brackets. It looks like a good project for a CNC machine if you intend to use billit. Or perhaps you are looking into a casting/forging with CNC for finishing.
You are correct. I do not know if they will fit with E0 wheels because my beta tester had only E1 rims.  I was suprised they fit the E1's so easily but DemonSVT assured me that they would clear the wheel weights. In that case, I'm going to assume they will clear an E0 with exterior wheel weights with quite a bit of confidence. As far as interior weights on an E0, I'll need another Beta tester for that.
Oh yeah, you guys should know that it took some Balls for Demon to put this kit on and go out and test them!
Think about it, an untested brake modification.....then do your first 60-0 test and imagine if something didn't hold!!
He did an awesome job of testing, and an awesome job of cleaning up and finalizing the final design of the front kit for me.
Still, you have a point Jim. If anyone has E0 rims and an otherwise stock brake system and wants to Beta Test a set of front brackets, check with me and I might be able to cut the cost pretty low on the front.
Other than Beta Testing, I want all questions about pricing to go to Stazi because if we decide to go ahead and sell them, it will only be through him. I don't have time to go around dealing with the mailing and sales and stuff with my current job and he and I have an understanding on this. Not only that, he has all the other brake pad/rotor combos and it will be easier to get a complete package from him.
OH, and as a matter of fact, NO. I will NOT release the plans, or give permission for others to release the plans or have the designs copied!  I put too much time and effort into this, and I also don't want someone killing themselves! I've given out almost every mod I've ever done and some have allowed others to make money on them. But this one is a real safety issue that I went to a lot of trouble to make sure was overbuilt, so it should be left at that.
Thanks for all the props guys, I wanted to do one last thing for CEG even though I was selling my car and this is it. Of course I wont lie and say that it is completely selfless at this point as I really NEED to pay for all my R&D costs.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
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I'll be down for these, if these can be put into production for the summer ALOT of ceg'rs will sure be happy.
Time to keep my fingers crossed and hope that these don't become another morrette project.
Nice work BTW guys, you really took one for the team here.
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Originally posted by djdanyloz:
Time to keep my fingers crossed and hope that these don't become another morrette project.
We're talking about brakes here. Ill gladly wait a few months to ensure that the bracketry is 100% perfect (in material and production). I dont need my rear calipers breaking off. Take your time fellas!
#4559 of 6535 born on Feb 17, 1998
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I suppose you are using something similar? 
3.0 14.392@97.237 2.302 60ft
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Originally posted by 96BlackSE:
I suppose you are using something similar?
What car is that off of? Actually, it is similar but that control arm setup, strut/spindle have more clearance in areas where it counts than the stock contour front end components. That would have been an easier kit to design whereas the contour fronts required that I take some different approaches.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
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Oh yeah, I forgot to comment on the hardware.
I don't like how those appear to be standard grade hardware and spacers. IDK if that is a prototype but I used much higher grade materials.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
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'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Any idea on IF you'll be producing this kit? Seems like you're up in the air on whether or not you'll be selling these. Wasn't sure if it was a liability issue, or something else. This is exactly what I've been waiting for, for our cars! Hopefully we'll know more before mid summer, as that's about the time that I'd like to do this. Mark
2000 Black CSVT
3.0L Hybrid - 206fwhp & 195fwtq
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I have no life
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I wouldn't be too concerned about liability but our society sucks. Just needs an off-road use only sticker. I don't care about the fronts. It's the rear bracket I want. If something happens to the rears who cares. Only does 25% of the breaking anywho.
-'96 SE MTX 3L
-'98 SVT 1,173 of 6,535
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Originally posted by todras:
I wouldn't be too concerned about liability but our society sucks. Just needs an off-road use only sticker. I don't care about the fronts. It's the rear bracket I want. If something happens to the rears who cares. Only does 25% of the breaking anywho.
breaking eh!? 
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Shut it. Least I don't do it on purpose because I don't know any better like most of the young CEGers.
-'96 SE MTX 3L
-'98 SVT 1,173 of 6,535
-'05 Mazda 6s, loaded, g/f's ride
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Originally posted by todras:
I wouldn't be too concerned about liability but our society sucks. Just needs an off-road use only sticker. I don't care about the fronts. It's the rear bracket I want. If something happens to the rears who cares. Only does 25% of the breaking anywho.
Then I'm assuming you have the FSVT brakes up front already? Or another big brake kit? If the front mounting hardware alone is cheaper than 2 FSVT calipers(can't see how it wouldn't be), then I'd say this will be a huge benefit! If I'm picking up the front kit, I might as well do the rears as well!
Mark
2000 Black CSVT
3.0L Hybrid - 206fwhp & 195fwtq
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Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
Originally posted by todras:
I wouldn't be too concerned about liability but our society sucks. Just needs an off-road use only sticker. I don't care about the fronts. It's the rear bracket I want. If something happens to the rears who cares. Only does 25% of the breaking anywho.
Then I'm assuming you have the FSVT brakes up front already? Or another big brake kit? If the front mounting hardware alone is cheaper than 2 FSVT calipers(can't see how it wouldn't be), then I'd say this will be a huge benefit! If I'm picking up the front kit, I might as well do the rears as well!
Mark
Agreed!
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Originally posted by warmonger:
Oh yeah, I forgot to comment on the hardware.
I don't like how those appear to be standard grade hardware and spacers. IDK if that is a prototype but I used much higher grade materials.
Tom...congrats on getting the kit built and working, I'd like to do the same but want even larger rear rotors to go with my 13" Bear brakes
Also...how are you making that statment on the hardware from that pic ? Bolt Grade ratings can only be determined from the top/end of the bolt head not the sides 
example:
Scott
2000 Contour SVT #1464
Mustang Dyno: 171.6hp/145.3lb
Dynojet Dyno: 171.1hp/148.9lb
1989 20th Anniversary Turbo T/A "Indy 500 Pace Car"
#1376 of 1550 All Original, 46k with a few mods
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Originally posted by todras:
Shut it. Least I don't do it on purpose because I don't know any better like most of the young CEGers.
What'd you just say?????
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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so what set-up was that picture?
Noble?
98 E0 SVT with some stuff
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Originally posted by scottd60:
Originally posted by warmonger:
Oh yeah, I forgot to comment on the hardware.
I don't like how those appear to be standard grade hardware and spacers. IDK if that is a prototype but I used much higher grade materials.
Tom...congrats on getting the kit built and working, I'd like to do the same but want even larger rear rotors to go with my 13" Bear brakes
Also...how are you making that statment on the hardware from that pic ? Bolt Grade ratings can only be determined from the top/end of the bolt head not the sides
example:
Yes and no.
You're funny by the way, showing me what an SAE bolt hardness rating is. 
Anyhow, you are right. I do not know for positive. On the other hand I looked at enough bolts during my years of experience and more recently during my hardware selection to realize how to identify what the higher metric grade bolts were commonly coated in. I learned that the various hardness bolts most of the time had different coloration that went along with the head style, and those look like grade 8.8 hardness bolts to me. Like JIS bolts and various flang-head bolts versus standard SAE and normal metric bolts all have different characteristics.
Those are plated the same and have the same head size (proportionately) as all the grade 8.8 bolts I saw. Now grade 8.8 has a high tensile strength, probably 85% or more of a 10.9 bolt, but they are not as hard. I went the extra mile to get bolts that were 10.9 and even 12.9 as well as with corrosion protection. The plate steel is not painted and is about the same type I'm using but much thinner, depending on the weight of the car maybe too thin.
For the contour I didn't take any chances since it is front heavy anyway.
The spacers he used are mild steel. I can see that from looking at them, and the nuts are standard plated.
The hardened nuts&bolts are plated in a different material and have a different color....or they are black....or they are stainless which is obvious to see.
Anyway, rest assured that these brakes are overbuilt to provide a high safety margin.
Also, I am not going to set final pricing; that is probably going to fall on Stazi. However, I can't imagine that the cost of all four wheels using this brake setup would be too different than just the cost of the FSVT kit.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
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3.0 14.392@97.237 2.302 60ft
OEM 4-bolt LCA's $105 each
Watch me go
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Originally posted by warmonger:
You're funny by the way, showing me what an SAE bolt hardness rating is.
Anyhow, you are right. I do not know for positive. On the other hand I looked at enough bolts during my years of experience and more recently during my hardware selection to realize how to identify what the higher metric grade bolts were commonly coated in. I learned that the various hardness bolts most of the time had different coloration that went along with the head style, and those look like grade 8.8 hardness bolts to me.
Here's another view... Spot-on visual assessment btw.
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by scottd60:
Originally posted by warmonger:
Oh yeah, I forgot to comment on the hardware.
I don't like how those appear to be standard grade hardware and spacers. IDK if that is a prototype but I used much higher grade materials.
Tom...congrats on getting the kit built and working, I'd like to do the same but want even larger rear rotors to go with my 13" Bear brakes
Also...how are you making that statment on the hardware from that pic ? Bolt Grade ratings can only be determined from the top/end of the bolt head not the sides
example:
Yes and no.
You're funny by the way, showing me what an SAE bolt hardness rating is.
Anyhow, you are right. I do not know for positive. On the other hand I looked at enough bolts during my years of experience and more recently during my hardware selection to realize how to identify what the higher metric grade bolts were commonly coated in. I learned that the various hardness bolts most of the time had different coloration that went along with the head style, and those look like grade 8.8 hardness bolts to me. Like JIS bolts and various flang-head bolts versus standard SAE and normal metric bolts all have different characteristics.
Those are plated the same and have the same head size (proportionately) as all the grade 8.8 bolts I saw. Now grade 8.8 has a high tensile strength, probably 85% or more of a 10.9 bolt, but they are not as hard. I went the extra mile to get bolts that were 10.9 and even 12.9 as well as with corrosion protection. The plate steel is not painted and is about the same type I'm using but much thinner, depending on the weight of the car maybe too thin.
For the contour I didn't take any chances since it is front heavy anyway.
The spacers he used are mild steel. I can see that from looking at them, and the nuts are standard plated.
The hardened nuts&bolts are plated in a different material and have a different color....or they are black....or they are stainless which is obvious to see.
Anyway, rest assured that these brakes are overbuilt to provide a high safety margin.
Also, I am not going to set final pricing; that is probably going to fall on Stazi. However, I can't imagine that the cost of all four wheels using this brake setup would be too different than just the cost of the FSVT kit.
Tom,
Never questioned your knowledge on bolt ratings...the pic was just an example more for others that may be wondering what we are talking about. I was just curious a little about your statement. I'm very familiar with the ratings as well and have been working with all types of hardware for the last 27 years in my job. I have also seen lots of different finishes on high strength bolts some nice some junk just depends on the manufacturer. Yeah you are correct most tend to be black in color but not always some will be cadium plated too and they tend to look more on the cheap side if the plating is crap. No biggie like I said ...was just curious why you thought that
Personally I would avoid using multiple spacers if possible and try and make the whole thing out of one solid piece of aluminum and mil it to the needed shape. Also avoid using nuts if possible and drill and tap the adapter plate instead. I think it makes a much cleaner install, less parts, lighter and just as strong.
Kind of like the adapter used on the Bear kit (not that hard to make if you have a mil)â?¦1.150" thick aluminum plate w/through and taped holes plus black anodized to avoid corrosion.
here playing around with a friends Cobra calipers...same exact caliper as the Bear PBR caliper and by the way only needs a little modification on the carrier bracket to work
Scott
2000 Contour SVT #1464
Mustang Dyno: 171.6hp/145.3lb
Dynojet Dyno: 171.1hp/148.9lb
1989 20th Anniversary Turbo T/A "Indy 500 Pace Car"
#1376 of 1550 All Original, 46k with a few mods
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So can we invite ourselves onto an "I'd sure like to get a PM when this package is ready and for sale" list?
Or will a post like this suffice?
MSDS, SHO-shop Y, custom 2.5" catback; xcal2; 63mm TB, K&N 3530; Koni struts, Aussie bar; THaines forks, Quaife, SpecII, UR fly; DMD; Nima UD pullies; Stazi brakes; f&r Pole120 mounts. Just a daily commuter car. Silver '98 SVT E0 #3159
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Originally posted by scottd60:
Personally I would avoid using multiple spacers if possible and try and make the whole thing out of one solid piece of aluminum and mil it to the needed shape. Also avoid using nuts if possible and drill and tap the adapter plate instead. I think it makes a much cleaner install, less parts, lighter and just as strong.
If they already figured the offsets they need to make the bracket work they could easily make a AL or steel bracket to eliminate spacers and nuts. Or any knowledgeable machinist/ machine shop could make some in a few hours on a cnc/bridgeport.
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Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
Originally posted by scottd60:
Personally I would avoid using multiple spacers if possible and try and make the whole thing out of one solid piece of aluminum and mil it to the needed shape. Also avoid using nuts if possible and drill and tap the adapter plate instead. I think it makes a much cleaner install, less parts, lighter and just as strong.
If they already figured the offsets they need to make the bracket work they could easily make a AL or steel bracket to eliminate spacers and nuts. Or any knowledgeable machinist/ machine shop could make some in a few hours on a cnc/bridgeport.
Nice that nobody read the first post in this thread.
...and I quote this cool dude...
Originally posted by DemonSVT:
All the hardware is grade 10, the spacers are non-ferrous stainless steel, the front adapter bracket is 1/2" & the rear is 3/8â? - both high carbon plate steel.
2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
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I guarantee you that CNC charges are easily going to exceed the costs I have already incurred designing the current pieces. As far as "a few hours", sure. If they had all the pertinent measurements and the Datum point that I used to make all of them then they probably could. But those brackets will still cost you. I also considered a solid piece of metal. However, the weight of the bracket would then be twice what it is now and cost more, at least in the beginning. You know what, I'm already irritated with a few of these posts. Funny how people are jumping out the woodwork and can build these things all of a sudden. Where were these geniuses 2+ darn years ago when I first posed the question as to whether this could be done? Exactly. If someone else builds their own design and call it easy and cheap, then I'll listen to them then...maybe. Some people who had the skill were not interested in doing it. I got that and I have no problem with it. Look at the post date on the sticky at the top of the brake forum. Realistically, no one wanted to expend the effort, and they STILL don't want to expend the effort either. I did. I didn't even need these front brakes and I went ahead and finished the design. Now, I'm ready to just scrap it. I don't need the money if you are wondering, and I definitely DON'T need the headaches. This is why I THOUGHT Stazi might be willing to handle the kit side of things but I don't wish the nightmare on him either. Besides, you can get bigger front brakes; the FSVT kit will only cost you a tad under $500.....for just the fronts.  I'm pretty frigging busy anyway.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
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Alex
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War, don't let anyone rain on your parade! What you and Demon have been able to do is badazz! I know I would be let down if your brake mod didn't see kit form, atleast in a limited run! Please War, say it ain't so! I don't wanna throw down the cash for a TCE or Baer kit!
2005 Ford F150 SuperCab FX4
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I am on Tom's side.
But Tom...there are so many people on this site...especially lately who don't know a thing...claim all this crap and then never show up. Don't let that disappoint you!!!!
Although at the same time...I do understand...I mean you don't even have a contour anymore.
I still appreciate everything you have helped me with and inspired me to do!!!!
98 E0 SVT with some stuff
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Great I guess I will have to stick with the stock brakes. I was really looking foward to getting bigger brakes and keeping my E1's. -tropictour
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Tropic Green
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Bassani
1999 Contour SE
BAT Kit
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I don't think the few people trying to intervene are anywhere near the amount of people who are looking forward to your kit. Please don't get discouraged by them.
morbid
2000 Contour SVT (black)
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Originally posted by morbid:
I don't think the few people trying to intervene are anywhere near the amount of people who are looking forward to your kit. Please don't get discouraged by them.
yes, i say screw those other guys trying to act like they have anything to add. you and demon actually got up and did what the rest of us only thought/wondered about so props to you guys for that. many of us here would love for this to happen. thanks for your time and effort.
00 black/tan svt, #2052 of 2150, born 2/1/00
formerly known as my csvt
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than a sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." -Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Well there will always be someone that thinks they can do it better, the key word being "thinks" in theory only. I say ignore the "keyboard fabricators". You have made it happen and put together a solid product that 99% of the people on CEG could not replicate.
Many times the most complicated problem requires a very simple solution; the genius is the one that can spot that solution amongst the cloud of confusion.
If it means anything I am a serious buyer.
96 Mystique Black On Tan V6 MTX Port Matched 01 3L, 2.5L Cams, 2.5" Exhaust Optimized y-pipe, SVT clutch, Superchips, 3L split port LIM, SVT UIM, Intake, Mustang 65mm TB, MSDS Headers. Eibach Pro Kit, Torsen Diff., Ford Racing 17" Wheels.
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Originally posted by Avey:
If it means anything I am a serious buyer.
-tropictour
2000 Contour SVT
Tropic Green
SHO Shop CAI
Bassani
1999 Contour SE
BAT Kit
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Tom did you really expect any thing less from the CEG?
Ryan
Trollin!
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Originally posted by DemonSVT:
All the hardware is grade 10, the spacers are non-ferrous stainless steel, the front adapter bracket is 1/2" & the rear is 3/8â? - both high carbon plate steel.
Yes i did read the post actually about 3 times. Just kind of wondering why you made brackets and still needed spacers?
I wasn't attacking you or Warmonger..not really sure why he jumped off the deep end? I was just wondering why you would risk your brakes with spacers/washers. Just thought you guys would machine a bracket to eliminate the spacers. Sorry I ruffled your feathers again
06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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Originally posted by morbid:
I don't think the few people trying to intervene are anywhere near the amount of people who are looking forward to your kit. Please don't get discouraged by them.
x1
Serious buyer here as well...
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Tom, Demon, you both deserve accolades about this project, on top of CEG lifetime achievement awards you should have along with Stazi.
Will it help if I send a nominal deposit to you or Stazi?
MSDS, SHO-shop Y, custom 2.5" catback; xcal2; 63mm TB, K&N 3530; Koni struts, Aussie bar; THaines forks, Quaife, SpecII, UR fly; DMD; Nima UD pullies; Stazi brakes; f&r Pole120 mounts. Just a daily commuter car. Silver '98 SVT E0 #3159
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Originally posted by Mod-Deth:
Originally posted by morbid:
I don't think the few people trying to intervene are anywhere near the amount of people who are looking forward to your kit. Please don't get discouraged by them.
Serious buyer here as well...
Mostly interested in the rear config.
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If you are interested in the kit and have questions post here. If you just want to judge the kit or say you could do better, save your complaints for when you have the kit in hands.
Originally posted by Who the F are You?:
does your family tree not have any branches on it?
99SVT
235hp @ 6550rpm
212tq @ 5350rpm
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Originally posted by RandyCSVT:
If you just want to judge the kit or say you could do better, save your complaints for when you have your kit in hands.
Fixed!
Tom has spent a lot of time and money on this project. If someone thinks that they can do better go ahead and show us. Having another avenue to look into for parts is always welcome. The amount of people that can and actually will pull off something like this, or another major change to the car, are very few and far between. The others are talk, constructive critisim is one thing, badmouthing someone elses work saying it can be done cheaper/better/faster/whatever and then not producing an example, is another.
Tom and Stazi are among the small handful of people who I would actually trust with something like this.
· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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I am very interested in the final product and I give a lot of credit to Warmonger and Demon (maybe others involved?) for putting in the effort to make this kit a reality. Im sure it took a lot more time to design, build and test that most people are acknowledging. I do have one question about the kit, would there be a possibility of front brackets for those of us who aren't lucky enough to have SVT front brakes? I would like to do something soon with brakes on my car and I will likely end up getting this kit, if I can afford it, or upgrading to the SVT fronts, which are not always easy to find. Again, you guys deserve lots of credit for putting in the time to make this a quality option for those looking to upgrade brakes.
1999 Mystique LS V6
Alpine CDA-9807, Rear deck sub, Opt. TB, K&N RU-3530/MAF adaptor, custom heatshield, FSVT 17's, SCT 4-program chip, Eibach's/ST200's, Hella Fogs...
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Originally posted by warmonger:
I guarantee you that CNC charges are easily going to exceed the costs I have already incurred designing the current pieces. As far as "a few hours", sure. If they had all the pertinent measurements and the Datum point that I used to make all of them then they probably could. But those brackets will still cost you. I also considered a solid piece of metal. However, the weight of the bracket would then be twice what it is now and cost more, at least in the beginning.
You know what, I'm already irritated with a few of these posts.
Funny how people are jumping out the woodwork and can build these things all of a sudden. Where were these geniuses 2+ darn years ago when I first posed the question as to whether this could be done? Exactly. If someone else builds their own design and call it easy and cheap, then I'll listen to them then...maybe. Some people who had the skill were not interested in doing it. I got that and I have no problem with it.
Look at the post date on the sticky at the top of the brake forum.
Realistically, no one wanted to expend the effort, and they STILL don't want to expend the effort either. I did.
I didn't even need these front brakes and I went ahead and finished the design.
Now, I'm ready to just scrap it. I don't need the money if you are wondering, and I definitely DON'T need the headaches. This is why I THOUGHT Stazi might be willing to handle the kit side of things but I don't wish the nightmare on him either.
Besides, you can get bigger front brakes; the FSVT kit will only cost you a tad under $500.....for just the fronts.
I'm pretty frigging busy anyway.
I hope that I am not included in or the causeof this once again uncalled for all too common CEG hissy fit Now if you go back and read not once did I bash the design or claim to be able to do better, I haven't even seen pic's of it other then a few wheel pic's on Demon's car. In fact I complimented Tom for doing this and getting it to a kit. I only said I would like to do the same but wanted bigger rear rotors to match my 13" Baer front brakes. I commented on the pic posted of a TOTALLY DIFFERENT design NOT Tom's about the hardware and spacers used and Tom's comment about hardware grade based on the angle of the pic. Was it a bash on Tom absolutely not, if was just a simple question and nothing more as I stated in my post back to Tom. I also showed a pic of the Baer adapter for the Contour just as an example and that the Cobra calipers fit (something I had been messing with) and nothing more. You are correct that not many step up and do this sort of thing and true not many can but some of us can but just don't have the time. I truly commend you on your effort and time because I know it took a lot of each. But you guys need to read posts a little closer and stop being so defensive. As for what you are doingâ?¦Yes I am very familiar with various materials, hardware, bolt grades, machining, etc. as I have been working with this stuff in my job for the last 27 years as an engineering designer doing mechanical, electro-mechanical, and electronic design and fabrication at the Johns Hopkins Applied Physics Lab. So yes I truly do know what you have been through in this design process. Can I design and build a kit as well...sure, can I do it better...don't know I haven't seen your design, will I do it...probably not but I might one day if I don't get rid of my car first. Like you said it takes a lot of time and I have a lot of other projects to keep me busy for a long time.
I'm probably old enough to be most of you guys father and I have modified and worked on cars most of my life and yet I have tremendous respect for the knowledge some of you have on this car and other related areas but every time I here these hissy fits it honestly makes me want to leave this site and not come back and sometimes even makes me want to sell my car 
I'm not here to argue I am just here to learn and help out where I can and socialize some as well that's about it. Take what I have said however you like but if you go back and read the posts you will realize that you are wrong with your accusations at least the ones towards me. I think it should be pretty clear now but If I have been misunderstood then I apologize for not clarifying my post's enough to avoid unintentionally pissing people off.
Scott
Scott
2000 Contour SVT #1464
Mustang Dyno: 171.6hp/145.3lb
Dynojet Dyno: 171.1hp/148.9lb
1989 20th Anniversary Turbo T/A "Indy 500 Pace Car"
#1376 of 1550 All Original, 46k with a few mods
2002 F150 SuperCrew
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Yeah. I got pissy about it, and I'm not going to lie. What, I'm not entitled to my own emotions and reactions? Am I the ONLY one who's got to hide it? Heck, aren't you responding to my post and in your own way having a hissy fit? I don't think my being upset about something should have anything to do with you feeling like you have a place here. It shouldn't. I read a series of posts I didn't like, that's all. There have been other things in the past that I built or did that I've had to defend almost weekly. If you hadn't followed those then you may not be aware. However, when you have a history of building stuff or doing things a certain way with quite a bit of success and yet you are always defending yourself....well then maybe you'd be a bit testy too. I didn't name you specifically, nor Thinkmoto and I'm not saying it is just this one post or just this one item. When I see a series of posts that are heading toward that general trend then I jumped to a conclusion and answered several questions in just one post. So it wasn't all you and don't think it was. And yes, I'm still a little irritated. I didn't/don't know how old you are nor your background and therefore that had nothing to do with it. At least I didn't curse anyone out, use foul language, post links to funny pics, or ridicule anyone. If that is enough to piss you off enough to leave..... Sorry. As far as the brakes go, I did the best I could within the constraints I identified as important. Namely: Kit Cost - Low Availability of replacement parts - easily available Outperform stock brakes - they do handily Fit stock rims - they do so far Brackets like the BAER ones are nice but won't fit as they require a greater change in rotor size just to fit, thereby requiring bigger rims and excluding stock rims. Also excludes the cheaper FSVT rotors. Oh, and by the way the OEM FSVT rotors are very good quality, coated and grooved. Worth the price I think. As far as brake kits: Lets give Stazi time to get some numbers together for kits. We'll go from there.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Originally posted by warmonger:
As far as brake kits:
Lets give Stazi time to get some numbers together for kits. We'll go from there.
OK...
<==== (* Waiting patiently... Pours a scotch & water, & plays a Black Sheep Squadron DVD *)
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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Originally posted by scottd60:
I hope that I am not included in or the causeof this once again uncalled for all too common CEG hissy fit Now if you go back and read not once did I bash the design or claim to be able to do better, I haven't even seen pic's of it other then a few wheel pic's on Demon's car. In fact I complimented Tom for doing this and getting it to a kit.
I'm probably old enough to be most of you guys father and I have modified and worked on cars most of my life and yet I have tremendous respect for the knowledge some of you have on this car and other related areas....
I'm not here to argue I am just here to learn and help out where I can and socialize some as well that's about it. Take what I have said however you like but if you go back and read the posts you will realize that you are wrong with your accusations at least the ones towards me. I think it should be pretty clear now but If I have been misunderstood then I apologize for not clarifying my post's enough to avoid unintentionally pissing people off.
Scott
Foolishly sticking my head in the beehiveâ?¦.
For what its worth Scott, I had a similar reaction to Warmongerâ??s post when I first saw it. Warmonger can definitely come across as wound too tight sometimes, a natural born rebel. I donâ??t know if thatâ??s a true reflection of his personality or just an Internet thing.
Reading his posts over the years, I think he deals with one hell of a lot of stress with his active duty military responsibilities. CEG is a pretty safe place to have some fun and maybe blow off some steam occasionally. The reassuring thing is that when he does get POâ??d, he usually follows up pretty quickly with something more level headed.
Warmonger, you are very talented hobbyist and I hope a lot of people get to benefit from your creativity with this platform.
But this is just a hobby with you, right? Or is there something more going on here? I believe you when you state that money is not a driver. What is it that you really want?
I could answer that questions myself but I have to say I donâ??t know if its possible to find on a public forum like CEG. Maybe with the old style car clubs where most things were done face to face - and mostly on the weekends, but not here.
Pulling my head back out of the bee-hive (or maybe out of my you-know-what).
99 Tropic Green SVT, Tan Leather, 20K miles, "Nice Twin" (factory stock).
99 Tropic Green SVT, Tan Leather, 28K miles, "Evil Twin" (Turbo AER 3L and more in progress)
96 Red LX, Opal Grey Leather 2.5L, ATX, 22K miles
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Can we get a rough price estimate? I realize you dont want to get held to anything, but Im curious to know. Even if its a fairly broad range.
#4559 of 6535 born on Feb 17, 1998
Black 1998.5 CSVT
FOR SALE [cleaning house]: SVT rear swaybar. Reasonable offer and its yours!
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Originally posted by JEDsContour:
Foolishly sticking my head in the beehiveâ?¦.
Reading his posts over the years, I think he deals with one hell of a lot of stress with his active duty military responsibilities. CEG is a pretty safe place to have some fun and maybe blow off some steam occasionally. The reassuring thing is that when he does get POâ??d, he usually follows up pretty quickly with something more level headed.
But this is just a hobby with you, right? Or is there something more going on here? I believe you when you state that money is not a driver. What is it that you really want?
I could answer that questions myself but I have to say I donâ??t know if its possible to find on a public forum like CEG. Maybe with the old style car clubs where most things were done face to face - and mostly on the weekends, but not here.
Pulling my head back out of the bee-hive (or maybe out of my you-know-what).
Uhh Yeah!!
Wow, I'm a philosophical guy but his is a little deep eh?
Don't read into it too much. If you've been around longer than me than you'll know that I'm usually a pretty respectfull guy. Military has nothing to do with this either.
I enjoy building stuff, but I enjoy seeing people use those things/ideas/stuff just as much.
Don't get me wrong, I want my money back out of this project and I AM going to take a little profit for my labors if I produce any more stuff. I won't be raping anyone but there is monetary gain too.
So just chock it up to the fact that I got pissed off and didn't like the way some things were said. Shyte happens! Not one person but a general trend which is I why I didn't single anyone out.
Sorry to Scott specifically because I wasn't trying to offend him.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Originally posted by KingpinSVT:
Can we get a rough price estimate? I realize you dont want to get held to anything, but Im curious to know. Even if its a fairly broad range.
Let Stazi get his prices together for rotors and pads unless you just want the bracketry and hardware.
Roughly speaking, as I already said: you will be able to do all four wheels complete for less than what I paid Bill J. for just upgrading to FSVT fronts.
Obviously just the fronts will be significantly cheaper.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Originally posted by warmonger:
Roughly speaking, as I already said: you will be able to do all four wheels complete for less than what I paid Bill J. for just upgrading to FSVT fronts.
Obviously just the fronts will be significantly cheaper.
Bringing tears to my eyes!!!
Tom da bomb!!
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Captain Impound Boy
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i just want the rears and Stazi knows that. Just the braket soo let me know when i can get Them
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Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
i just want the rears and Stazi knows that. Just the braket soo let me know when i can get Them
Well part of the stipulations are that Steeda can't have any brackets, especially the rears!
j/k
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by JEDsContour:
Foolishly sticking my head in the beehiveâ?¦.
Reading his posts over the years, I think he deals with one hell of a lot of stress with his active duty military responsibilities. CEG is a pretty safe place to have some fun and maybe blow off some steam occasionally. The reassuring thing is that when he does get POâ??d, he usually follows up pretty quickly with something more level headed.
But this is just a hobby with you, right? Or is there something more going on here? I believe you when you state that money is not a driver. What is it that you really want?
I could answer that questions myself but I have to say I donâ??t know if its possible to find on a public forum like CEG. Maybe with the old style car clubs where most things were done face to face - and mostly on the weekends, but not here.
Pulling my head back out of the bee-hive (or maybe out of my you-know-what).
Uhh Yeah!!
Wow, I'm a philosophical guy but his is a little deep eh?
Don't read into it too much. If you've been around longer than me than you'll know that I'm usually a pretty respectfull guy. Military has nothing to do with this either.
I enjoy building stuff, but I enjoy seeing people use those things/ideas/stuff just as much.
Don't get me wrong, I want my money back out of this project and I AM going to take a little profit for my labors if I produce any more stuff. I won't be raping anyone but there is monetary gain too.
So just chock it up to the fact that I got pissed off and didn't like the way some things were said. Shyte happens! Not one person but a general trend which is I why I didn't single anyone out.
Sorry to Scott specifically because I wasn't trying to offend him.
Tom,
Yeah I got a little pissy tooâ?¦been working a lot of hours lately and Iâ??m feeling a little high strung as well. I visit this site and a couple others for my TTA to unwind, relax a little and learn a thing or two when I get a chance. Thanks for your sensible reply...I apologize for over reacting just a little I was concerned that my post were taken wrong and may have added to the possibility that you would pull the plug on your brake kit and ruin it for all the interested members. You are doing fantastic things for this platform and Iâ??m sure many will appreciate it for a long time to come
Carry onâ?¦
Scott
Scott
2000 Contour SVT #1464
Mustang Dyno: 171.6hp/145.3lb
Dynojet Dyno: 171.1hp/148.9lb
1989 20th Anniversary Turbo T/A "Indy 500 Pace Car"
#1376 of 1550 All Original, 46k with a few mods
2002 F150 SuperCrew
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Captain Impound Boy
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Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
i just want the rears and Stazi knows that. Just the braket soo let me know when i can get Them
Well part of the stipulations are that Steeda can't have any brackets, especially the rears!
j/k
I know where he lives ill just steal them TOM!!!!
With the REAR brackets i can CONTROL THE WORLD!!!!! ahhhhhahahahahahahahaha
so tell him to give me cuase i want!
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Drinks for everybody!!! On me!
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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Guys - chillax already. Holy crap you'd think that everyone had to prep for the Cannonball Run next week the way you guys are getting all bent out of shape and pushy.  Lets remember something: these are brakes, not an a-pillar pod, sweatshirt, strut brace or some other NON-SAFETY related item...hence you need to be PATIENT while we test and set up the logistics of the kits. You can jump up and down and speculate about whatever you want, but at the end of the day - it's not helping anything. We realise how much you guys want these (although when the time to order comes and I don't see orders from people making all the fuss I'll personally send you a PM to go eat poo!). And as such we are trying to get this all done as quickly as possible while not taking any shortcuts. Anyway... I digress; Tom, and I are working out the cost and shipping etc, right now....so we're getting close. TENTATIVELY - and remember this CAN/PROBABLY change depending on the cost vs. volume (i.e. more orders = better price )of the manufacturing of the plates. You will be able to get the full upgrade, i.e. FSVT front rotors (new rotors and new pads) and the calipers brackets for the front and rear for between $300 and ~$350 (remember this price is still TBD!). If you want new rotors and don't want to reuse your old SVT fronts - this will add to the cost. Note: Canadian orders will incurr a shipping increase - TBD!!!!! NOW PLEASE, BEFORE YOU ALL START CLICKING THE REPLY BUTTON - LET THAT FIRST WORD IN THE PARAGRAPH SOAK INTO YOUR GREY MATTER....OK? THIS IS TENTATIVE PRICING. OK, let the chaos ensue.
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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Captain Impound Boy
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Captain Impound Boy
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Im wondering a few things?
#1 Can we get Cross Drilled Rotors? I like to stop faster!
#2 This adapter plate can we get color matched to the Calipers? Like red and stuff?
#3 What about Slotted/Cross Drilled for added stopping power?
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Will you be offering the rear bracket as a separate item?
'98 SVT Red/midnight blue - a few mods
E0 wheels for sale - PM me
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Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by KingpinSVT:
Can we get a rough price estimate? I realize you dont want to get held to anything, but Im curious to know. Even if its a fairly broad range.
Let Stazi get his prices together for rotors and pads unless you just want the bracketry and hardware.
Roughly speaking, as I already said: you will be able to do all four wheels complete for less than what I paid Bill J. for just upgrading to FSVT fronts.
Obviously just the fronts will be significantly cheaper.
I just cried a little bit, its so wonderful! lmao
Alex
'99 SVT Contour
-=|WANTED: Vortech, working or not |=-
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With all the hulla-baloo I was actually getting a bit nervous that this arrangement might go down the tubes. Glad to hear things are still on track. Thanks for the post Stazi. I feel better now...
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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X-drilled option will be $10,000 more to disuade people fron wanting such a pathetic option in the first place.
Yes the brackets will be available separate for just fronts or just rears - but please note: running JUST the rear upgrade with no change to the fronts, i.e. same size rotors front and rear is NOT, I repeat NOT smart - the bias will be all screwed up..... so unless you like switching ends when the car is braking, then don't think you can be a cheap-ass and just do the rears.
And most importantly; These kits will be sold as OFF-HIGHWAY USE ONLY....those who choose to use these kits for ON-HIGHWAY use will do so waive the right to hold either Tom or myself liable/responsible/accountable either legally or monetarily for any damages, injuries or deaths associated from the use of these kits.
Thanks for playing.
Last edited by Stazi; 03/08/06 04:56 PM.
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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I already have 13" brakes on the front, hence my interest in the rears only.
'98 SVT Red/midnight blue - a few mods
E0 wheels for sale - PM me
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Originally posted by Stazi:
X-drilled option will be $10,000 more to disuade people fron wanting such a pathetic option in the first place.
Yes the brackets will be available separate for just fronts or just rears - but please note: running JUST the rear upgrade with no change to the fronts, i.e. same size rotors front and rear is NOT, I repeat NOT smart - the bias will be all screwed up..... so unless you like switching ends when the car is braking, then don't think you can be a cheap-ass and just do the rears.
And most importantly; These kits will be sold as OFF-HIGHWAY USE ONLY....those who choose to use these kits for ON-HIGHWAY use will do so waive the right to hold either Tom or myself liable/responsible/accountable either legally or monetarily for any damages, injuries or deaths associated from the use of these kits.
Thanks for playing.
Stazi,
I realize that this kit is for SVT front rotors on the back and FSVT front rotors. My question is for us guys with Baer 13" (330mm) front brakes would the FSVT front 300mm rotors be a better match for the rear instead of the 280mm SVT rotors? Just thinking down the road
Thanks,
Scott
Scott
2000 Contour SVT #1464
Mustang Dyno: 171.6hp/145.3lb
Dynojet Dyno: 171.1hp/148.9lb
1989 20th Anniversary Turbo T/A "Indy 500 Pace Car"
#1376 of 1550 All Original, 46k with a few mods
2002 F150 SuperCrew
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Originally posted by scottd60:
Stazi,
I realize that this kit is for SVT front rotors on the back and FSVT front rotors. My question is for us guys with Baer 13" (330mm) front brakes would the FSVT front 300mm rotors be a better match for the rear instead of the 280mm SVT rotors? Just thinking down the road
Thanks,
Scott
I wouldn't say that. Sure with BAER$'s you get more front bias, but I wouldn't downgrade from BAER's to FSVT's. Just the rear kit, for guys with your setup, will bring the brake biasing closer to what it should be.
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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Captain Impound Boy
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I was thinking the Same thing, Rara and I talked about it and if you have the 13" kit the Focus FSVT rotors on the Rear seems it would be a better option. Than the 280 CSVT rotors on the rear
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Originally posted by Stazi:
Originally posted by scottd60:
Stazi,
I realize that this kit is for SVT front rotors on the back and FSVT front rotors. My question is for us guys with Baer 13" (330mm) front brakes would the FSVT front 300mm rotors be a better match for the rear instead of the 280mm SVT rotors? Just thinking down the road
Thanks,
Scott
I wouldn't say that. Sure with BAER$'s you get more front bias, but I wouldn't downgrade from BAER's to FSVT's. Just the rear kit, for guys with your setup, will bring the brake biasing closer to what it should be.
You missunderstood me...I think. I'm asking if I put the FSVT 300mm front rotors on the rear and keep the Baer 330mm's on the front. That would give me 330mm front and 300mm rear (would need a different adapter bracket to do this) but would the biasing be close to where it should be?
Scott
Last edited by scottd60; 03/08/06 08:12 PM.
Scott
2000 Contour SVT #1464
Mustang Dyno: 171.6hp/145.3lb
Dynojet Dyno: 171.1hp/148.9lb
1989 20th Anniversary Turbo T/A "Indy 500 Pace Car"
#1376 of 1550 All Original, 46k with a few mods
2002 F150 SuperCrew
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Is it as easy as matching the percentage difference between the front and rear rotor sizes on a stock car?
SVT = 280mm front rotors and ???mm rear rotors (???/280 = X.X% difference in size)
BAER = 330mm and FSVT = 300mm (300/330 = 9.1% difference in size)
Wouldn't you want to come as close matching the percentage difference that comes from the factory?
Mark
2000 Black CSVT
3.0L Hybrid - 206fwhp & 195fwtq
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Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
i just want it in the rear and Stazi knows that.
wow.
Ryan
Trollin!
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Captain Impound Boy
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Originally posted by RTStabler51:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
i just want it in the rear and Stazi knows that.
wow.
Sorry Ryan you where already taken by one of your Marine buddies,
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Guys to run FSVT's in the rear will need a different bracket again, and frankly I think it would start looking a little ridiculous seeing as the actual swept area on the FSVT rotors, buy a stock rear pad would be patheticly thin compared to the diameter of the rotor.
I will guess that Tom won't want to make an even larger offset bracket.
And if it were me making the brackets, I wouldn't bother IMHO, the return on investment and the benefit doesn't justify the effort.
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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Captain Impound Boy
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Very True!!!! The Rear needs diff cal's all together LOL
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Originally posted by Stazi:
Guys to run FSVT's in the rear will need a different bracket again, and frankly I think it would start looking a little ridiculous seeing as the actual swept area on the FSVT rotors, buy a stock rear pad would be patheticly thin compared to the diameter of the rotor.
I will guess that Tom won't want to make an even larger offset bracket.
And if it were me making the brackets, I wouldn't bother IMHO, the return on investment and the benefit doesn't justify the effort.
I realize that a different bracket would be needed and may even take it on myself...I have been thinking about this for quite a while. I'm running 18" wheels and the stock SVT rear rotor looks lost, the 13" Baer looks great up front. But as stated the bias is probably off a good bit with this combination. Just wondering if the FSVT 300mm would be better then the SVT 280mm in the rear in combination with the Baer 13" 330mm front brakes?
If you had the option which would be best?
front 330mm (13"), rear 280mm (11")
VS.
front 330mm (13"), rear 300mm (11 13/16")
Thanks
Scott
2000 Contour SVT #1464
Mustang Dyno: 171.6hp/145.3lb
Dynojet Dyno: 171.1hp/148.9lb
1989 20th Anniversary Turbo T/A "Indy 500 Pace Car"
#1376 of 1550 All Original, 46k with a few mods
2002 F150 SuperCrew
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Scott - look at what I said. The REAR pad and caliper will look ridiculous (i.e. lost...as you put it) on FSVT front rotors.
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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Thank you guys for all the effort and hard work you put into this. I am in need of a brake job, so hopefully all of this can be available in the near future. Chalk me up for FSVT Rotors/Pads, Front and Rear brackets, Rear pads
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Originally posted by Stazi:
Scott - look at what I said. The REAR pad and caliper will look ridiculous (i.e. lost...as you put it) on FSVT front rotors.
ok I got it now I suppose I'll be getting a set of rear brackets when they are available.
too bad this car doesn't have an internal drum e-brake/disk brake set-up...rear upgrades would sure be a lot easier
Thanks,
Scott
Last edited by scottd60; 03/08/06 09:56 PM.
Scott
2000 Contour SVT #1464
Mustang Dyno: 171.6hp/145.3lb
Dynojet Dyno: 171.1hp/148.9lb
1989 20th Anniversary Turbo T/A "Indy 500 Pace Car"
#1376 of 1550 All Original, 46k with a few mods
2002 F150 SuperCrew
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Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
Im wondering a few things?
#1 Can we get Cross Drilled Rotors? I like to stop faster!
#2 This adapter plate can we get color matched to the Calipers? Like red and stuff?
#3 What about Slotted/Cross Drilled for added stopping power?
STFU! 
<high strung and ready to unload with guns blazin!>
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
Originally posted by RTStabler51:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
i just want it in the rear and Stazi knows that.
wow.
Sorry Ryan you where already taken by one of your Marine buddies,
LMAO ROFL on both these comments. Tears...
My wife came over to find out what was wrong with me.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
I was thinking the Same thing, Rara and I talked about it and if you have the 13" kit the Focus FSVT rotors on the Rear seems it would be a better option. Than the 280 CSVT rotors on the rear
For looks only.
Rara knows all about braking bias. On a nose heavy FWD car the rear brakes, at best, can generate 20% of the braking force. On a stock weight distribution Contour it is more like 15%.
This does not even take into consideration to caliper piston's ability to stop the rotors. (its force output) This is the reason I went with an overly aggressive pad choice on the rears. I wanted to make the most out of what the small stock rear caliper would give me.
ANY BRAKE SETUP CHANGE, from pro-fabbed kits to economy brake pads, is much more then a simple swap fest. The devil is always in the detail work. If you don't do your homework you normally end up with poor results. There are countless "big brake" upgrade kits out there that prove that fact over and over again.
2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
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Captain Impound Boy
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Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
Im wondering a few things?
#1 Can we get Cross Drilled Rotors? I like to stop faster!
#2 This adapter plate can we get color matched to the Calipers? Like red and stuff?
#3 What about Slotted/Cross Drilled for added stopping power?
STFU!
<high strung and ready to unload with guns blazin!>
YOU LOVE IT!!!!
Seriously though i was all about it then he said it was just plain metal color I need more BLING Factor
Ya We where talking about the 13" baer Kit and trying to figure out rear options and anything with the Stock rear cal's above the 280's is pretty much just looks, But if slotted/X-drilled and Zinc Plated, Looks would be Toight!
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Originally posted by Stazi:
chillax
Done..... as long as I gets me some stainless lines, I'll gladly STFU
2005 Ford F150 SuperCab FX4
1964 Chevrolet Impala SS
1998 CSVT: 354HP/328TQ @ 10 psi, now gone
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"Absolut Rara."
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Originally posted by DemonSVT:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
I was thinking the Same thing, Rara and I talked about it and if you have the 13" kit the Focus FSVT rotors on the Rear seems it would be a better option. Than the 280 CSVT rotors on the rear
For looks only.
Rara knows all about braking bias. On a nose heavy FWD car the rear brakes, at best, can generate 20% of the braking force. On a stock weight distribution Contour it is more like 15%.
This does not even take into consideration to caliper piston's ability to stop the rotors. (its force output) This is the reason I went with an overly aggressive pad choice on the rears. I wanted to make the most out of what the small stock rear caliper would give me.
ANY BRAKE SETUP CHANGE, from pro-fabbed kits to economy brake pads, is much more then a simple swap fest. The devil is always in the detail work. If you don't do your homework you normally end up with poor results. There are countless "big brake" upgrade kits out there that prove that fact over and over again.
Demon, you are mostly right here. But remember, once you have upgraded the fronts, you have shifted the brake bias to the front, potentially by a significant amount, which then needs to be balanced back to stock levels to make the best use of the full brake system. There are four key ways to affect the F/R bias of a brake system, and any of them can have a significant effect, so its not a terribly simple proposal in getting it all right.
First is proportioning, or rear line pressure proportioning. Some contours have a typical prop valve which limits rear line pressure, and some are controlled electronically by the ABS.
Second, is the torque lever arm, or basically the effective radius of the rotor (note, this is not the same as the actual radius of the rotor, but it depends on pad size as well)
Third is the friction co-efficient of the linings used. This one is difficult on a street car, because good data is hard to come by on most linings.
and Fourth is also system pressure, but more related to the caliper piston sizes relative to the master cylinder size. Most kit makers try not to change this much, as it will dramatically change pedal feel as well.
So, I'll tell you guys what, if I can dig up the info I need, I'll run some bias numbers today, and post the results. However, my gut feeling says the 300/280 combo will be a little more rear biased than stock, and a 330/300 combo will be about the same as stock, all depending on what linings are used.
Also, as a side note, swept area, and pad size (within reason) don't have a lot to do with overall braking power. These factors more come in to play when you start to consider fade, and pad life, and aesthetic concerns like Stazi mentioned.
On Edit - btw, Demon, I know I addressed the first comment directly to you, but the rest of the post is informational for the general public who may not know the fundamentals of a brake system design.
Last edited by Rara; 03/09/06 04:09 PM.
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"Absolut Rara."
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ok dang it, for some reason I can't find the stock contour and FSVT piston sizes anywhere . . . I've managed to lose my notes on them, and can no longer look them up at Ford.
Anyone have them handy so I don't have to go pull my wheels off and measure?
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Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
Originally posted by RTStabler51:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
i just want it in the rear and Stazi knows that.
wow.
Sorry Ryan you where already taken by one of your Marine buddies,
LMAO ROFL on both these comments. Tears...
My wife came over to find out what was wrong with me.
then she saw the beret on your head
Ryan
Trollin!
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Very good summary. I'm not in the brake business so having all that info succinctly presented in a single post demonstrates the dynamics and complexities of braking systems, and offers up a lot of food for thought.
I've always been very conservative when it comes to a critical system like brakes. Never even attempted a pad/shoe change on any car until I was quite confident in my vehicle maintenance skills. Too much at stake for my liking. It speaks well of you gentlemen that I am comfortable enough in your expertise to consider modding my brakes based on your design work & research.
I offer my profound respect & thanks to all involved in this.
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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Captain Impound Boy
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Originally posted by RTStabler51:
Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
Originally posted by RTStabler51:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
i just want it in the rear and Stazi knows that.
wow.
Sorry Ryan you where already taken by one of your Marine buddies,
LMAO ROFL on both these comments. Tears...
My wife came over to find out what was wrong with me.
then she saw the beret on your head
LOL USAF vs ARMY vs Marines in the same thread! LOL Whos in the Navy?
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"Absolut Rara."
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btw, calcs using some assumed numbers for piston sizes show the difference between the 278mm and 300mm rotors on the rear worth about 1.2% on rear bias. Compared to ~1.8% difference for a minor change in friction on the rear.
I'll throw out some actual #'s when I can dig up those piston sizes.
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Originally posted by Rara:
However, my gut feeling says the 300/280 combo will be a little more rear biased than stock
Even with the smaller pads in the rear? Definitely not questioning your expertise, but more or less trying to get an understanding of what you're saying, exactly.
Mark
2000 Black CSVT
3.0L Hybrid - 206fwhp & 195fwtq
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"Absolut Rara."
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"Absolut Rara."
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Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
Originally posted by Rara:
However, my gut feeling says the 300/280 combo will be a little more rear biased than stock
Even with the smaller pads in the rear? Definitely not questioning your expertise, but more or less trying to get an understanding of what you're saying, exactly.
Mark
Rear pad size doesn't change. Besides, pad size (within reason) really doesn't have a lot to do with overall brake torque, in fact increasing pad size down toward the center of the rotor (much like how the FSVT pad is larger than the later CSVT pad) will very slightly DECREASE brake torque due to the decrease in effective radius (eff. radius is the distance from the center of the rotor to the radial center of the pad)
Using my assumed piston sizes, my suspicions played out as accurate, but only barely.
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Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
LOL USAF vs ARMY vs Marines in the same thread! LOL Whos in the Navy?
Right here, you bunch of weenies. Stay on the shore where you belong.
(PS. I am out of the branch match-off now.. just wanted to throw that in there.)
'99 CSVT - Silver #222/276
In a constant state of blow-off euphoria.
Originally posted by Kremitthefrog:
I like to wear dresses and use binoculars to watch grandmas across the street.
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Originally posted by Ray:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
LOL USAF vs ARMY vs Marines in the same thread! LOL Whos in the Navy?
Right here, you bunch of weenies. Stay on the shore where you belong.
(PS. I am out of the branch match-off now.. just wanted to throw that in there.)
Just like a squid to hit and run.
Ryan
Trollin!
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"Absolut Rara."
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Go argue somewhere else, keep this thread on topic.
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Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
Originally posted by RTStabler51:
Originally posted by warmonger:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
Originally posted by RTStabler51:
Originally posted by SteedaSVTâ??¢:
i just want it in the rear and Stazi knows that.
wow.
Sorry Ryan you where already taken by one of your Marine buddies,
LMAO ROFL on both these comments. Tears...
My wife came over to find out what was wrong with me.
then she saw the beret on your head
LOL USAF vs ARMY vs Marines in the same thread! LOL Whos in the Navy?
I'm sure theres a squid around somewhere....hiding in the deep ready to pop their head up and chime in.
(Like 20000 leagues under the sea)
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Originally posted by Rara:
btw, calcs using some assumed numbers for piston sizes show the difference between the 278mm and 300mm rotors on the rear worth about 1.2% on rear bias. Compared to ~1.8% difference for a minor change in friction on the rear.
I'll throw out some actual #'s when I can dig up those piston sizes.
I calculated about 1% difference, I suppose that isn't much different than what you got, but I wonder why we have different numbers??
Either way, I did the calcs and then with actual testing found out I liked it VERY much with FSVT Rotors/pads on the front and with bendix Ti on the rear. Very good feel when braking hard and I even had the bad luck to do real life panic stop on them once where I was limited by the road surface and traction and the ABS kicked in.
Otherwise, with the bigger rubber I had on the car I finally had awesome brakes.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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"Absolut Rara."
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"Absolut Rara."
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Tom, what piston sizes did you use for front and rear?
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Never mind, I used the CSVT front and Rear sizes with Tod's (TCE) calculators to see what the effect of just rotor sizing would be if the pad compound was constant. Probably too simplified eh? So it wasn't using FSVT pistons because I was designing it for CSVT calipers all the way around.
Former owner of '99 CSVT - Silver #222/2760
356/334 wHP/TQ at 10psi on pump gas!
See My Mods
'05 Volvo S40 Turbo 5 AWD with 6spd, Passion Red
'06 Mazda5 Touring, 5spd,MTX, Black
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Originally posted by TourDeForce:
Originally posted by warmonger:
As far as brake kits:
Lets give Stazi time to get some numbers together for kits. We'll go from there.
OK...
<==== (* Waiting patiently... Pours a scotch & water, & plays a Black Sheep Squadron DVD *)
Black Sheep Squadron DVDs complete. Any updates on anticipated availability time line?
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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I need this(the rears) really soon(1 week or less) or its TCE for me, I'm tired of delays and have the cash in hand and just want my car to be done.
Ohsigmachi '96 GL MTX Zetec
--I don't won't to hurt you, but it's still on my list of things to do.--
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Originally posted by ohsigmachi:
I need this(the rears) really soon(1 week or less) or its TCE for me, I'm tired of delays and have the cash in hand and just want my car to be done.
I'm in the same boat, but give them time. Hopefully when I have some time I'll be talking to TCE again about my setup. I pretty much know what I'm running up front but I want to discuss options for the rear to keep the bias as good as possible
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I'm due for a change, but not in a hurry. I also have my $ ready to go as I was planning a FSVT front swap and a rear disc conversion to start with. Already have the rear disc setup to install this coming weekend - just to get the cable & calipers broken in & working properly for the coming upgrade. The summer Dragon Run is coming up in June & I've gotta have something better than stock for that. My last Dragon Run in October I was complelled to ease up on my driving to allow for the stock brake setup... I have a long drive back to Florida & didn't want any issues from glowing rotors to rear their ugly head on the way home. <=== (* Opens a fresh bottle of scotch & kicks back for a while longer *)
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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Originally posted by TourDeForce:
(* Opens a fresh bottle of scotch & kicks back for a while longer *)
Damn man, scotch at 11:30am!! Might want to ease up a bit on the sauce a-for workin on them brakes.
I'll put holes in him!!
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I'm in. Now I have to go kill my stock brakes. A few 100-0 stops should do the trick. I'm surprised they still look good after that trackday last year. Must not have been pushing it enough.
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Originally posted by JCSVT:
I'm in. Now I have to go kill my stock brakes. A few 100-0 stops should do the trick. I'm surprised they still look good after that trackday last year. Must not have been pushing it enough.
If your rotors are still good, just move them to the back. Saves from having to buy new rotors, unless they're pretty warn out already, or just want to have all new brake parts.
Mark
2000 Black CSVT
3.0L Hybrid - 206fwhp & 195fwtq
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Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
Originally posted by JCSVT:
I'm in. Now I have to go kill my stock brakes. A few 100-0 stops should do the trick. I'm surprised they still look good after that trackday last year. Must not have been pushing it enough.
If your rotors are still good, just move them to the back. Saves from having to buy new rotors, unless they're pretty warn out already, or just want to have all new brake parts.
Mark
Im already saving my money. Ive still got a decent amount left, but its just more fun to have all new stuff on the car
Alex
'99 SVT Contour
-=|WANTED: Vortech, working or not |=-
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Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
If your rotors are still good, just move them to the back. Saves from having to buy new rotors, unless they're pretty warn out already, or just want to have all new brake parts.
Mark
I will be needing new front brakes soon. Can I but a stazi kit for now (new stock front rotors and titaniumetallic2 pads) and then transfer the parts over. So when this kit comes out I would put my nearly new rotors on the back with new pads, and the FSVT new rotors with my nearly new pads. Would that work? I wouldn't want to have to replace the front pads so soon after barely using them.
Originally posted by Who the F are You?:
does your family tree not have any branches on it?
99SVT
235hp @ 6550rpm
212tq @ 5350rpm
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Yes you can buy nmy standard CSVT kit from me, then when the big-brake upgrade is made available, all you would need is new front FSVT rotors (also available from me) to completethe upgrade.
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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Originally posted by Stazi:
Yes you can buy nmy standard CSVT kit from me, then when the big-brake upgrade is made available, all you would need is new front FSVT rotors (also available from me) to completethe upgrade.
excellent!!
#0009
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hopefully i'm getting this right and not sounding like a broken record.
this will use the csvt calipers and pads front and rear? csvt front rotor goes to the back and fsvt front rotor goes to csvt front. ss lines recommended.
so whats the benefit of going with the fsvt front kit? does the fsvt use larger calipers with better pistons and larger pads to sweep the 300mm rotors better? will the csvt pads be big enough to sweep the larger rotors (front and rear). so once the kit is completely installed and worn out, then we'll go shopping for csvt front/rear pads as we would now and csvt front rotors for the back and fsvt front rotors for the csvt front. i think this is right, right?
Hugo AIM:omegazodiac
95 gl & 99 contour svt #1750/2760
my profile pics stuff for sale
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Originally posted by hmouta:
hopefully i'm getting this right and not sounding like a broken record.
this will use the csvt calipers and pads front and rear? csvt front rotor goes to the back and fsvt front rotor goes to csvt front. ss lines recommended.
so whats the benefit of going with the fsvt front kit? does the fsvt use larger calipers with better pistons and larger pads to sweep the 300mm rotors better? will the csvt pads be big enough to sweep the larger rotors (front and rear). so once the kit is completely installed and worn out, then we'll go shopping for csvt front/rear pads as we would now and csvt front rotors for the back and fsvt front rotors for the csvt front. i think this is right, right?
For a CSVT: Purchase FSVT front rotors and custom brackets. FSVT
- Install FSVT front rotor with stock CSVT calipers using custom bracket.
- Install CSVT front rotor on rear with stock rear CSVT calipers using custom bracket.
- FSVT front caliper is the same as CSVT front caliper. The benefit of going with the larger rotor: increase in diameter will increase the braking torque (even with the stock calipers), larger surface area will help cooling and decrease fade.
- SS Lines are recommended.
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Originally posted by mamisano:
- FSVT front caliper is the same as CSVT front caliper.
Incorrect. The SVTF caliper is slightly larger and mounts differently. (thus requiring a special "SVTF" bracket)
Also for the record - All CDW-27 rear disc brake components are the same. They are not SVT specific. (well the stock SVT rear rotors supposedly had a "dacromat" finish)
2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
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ok got it. so price wise and i dont race the car, going to fsvt calipers isnt really needed. csvt calipers with fsvt rotors will be fine for street driving.
Hugo AIM:omegazodiac
95 gl & 99 contour svt #1750/2760
my profile pics stuff for sale
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Is this ever going to happen?
Ohsigmachi '96 GL MTX Zetec
--I don't won't to hurt you, but it's still on my list of things to do.--
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Originally posted by ohsigmachi:
Is this ever going to happen?
I'm in no hurry but would like to be put on the list of "PM as this progresses further" as it sounds like a good cost efficient upgrade for those of us who don't NEED a big 13" brake upgrade but would rather just stop a little cooler and easier
If/When this comes available i will be in on a full set of new pads, all hardware/brackets, and most likely the FSVT Rotors
CSVT#1321/2150 Born 1/6/2000
It's just a Contour..
Before Dyno: 178.9whp w/2.5L
94 Probe 4cyl/150k KYB struts, Magnaflow Polished SS muffler (Daily Driver)
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Ordered my TCE kit today, so I guess I'm out...
Ohsigmachi '96 GL MTX Zetec
--I don't won't to hurt you, but it's still on my list of things to do.--
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Well to be honest if I had the $$$$ I would get the TCE anyway. Besides the lighter wallet, youre better off.
#4559 of 6535 born on Feb 17, 1998
Black 1998.5 CSVT
FOR SALE [cleaning house]: SVT rear swaybar. Reasonable offer and its yours!
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ill probably do this, seems like a good idea and i dont think it should be to pricey.
99 TRed Contour SVT # 1853 out of 2760
230.2 WHP @ 6500
237.0 WTR @ 2250
Originally posted by MxRacer:
Originally posted by RawBurt:
I'll be keeping it to myself, until the time comes. It'll be hard to find.
much like your weiner.
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