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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,045
Hard-core CEG\'er
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Hard-core CEG\'er
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 3,045 |
why don't you just buy a new one of whatever part(s) it is that control brake bias and see what if anything changes. if nothing changes then there you have it. if something does change then come back and tell us.
00 black/tan svt, #2052 of 2150, born 2/1/00
formerly known as my csvt
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than a sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." -Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 10,015
Hard-core CEG'er
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Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 10,015 |
Originally posted by 99fordsvt:
Originally posted by Stazi:
If the clown wants the car to swap ends next time his stands on the brakes, then fine let him increase the rear bias, and end up facing oncoming traffic.
Bravo! You've just indicated that you don't know what the HeII the thread is about.
It is about a vehicle with rear bias well BELOW what it is supposed to be. So to add rear bias (or preferably fix whatever is causing the gross underbias) would put it back to NORMAL!
Nice 1+1 = 2 post of yours, but I never disputed those braking 101 items. Why you bring them up is mysterious to me.
I plan to borrow the IR temp gauge again soon and do more testing. Here are some comparisons from other vehicles:
http://www.zeckhausen.com/testing_brakes.htm
Hey - whatdayaknow - all those rear brakes in the test are above the "sizzle temp"
The know it all flamers who can't comprehend obviously know the outcome beforehand and that all Contour brake systems are faultless and NEVER NEVER NEVER underbias the rear .... NEVER.
Yeah and you're SOOOOOOO analytical with your whole argument based on the sound some snow made when you threw it on your rotors.   You're ridiculous. How did you come up with your imaginary bias proportion? How do you know it isn't 70-80-90-95%? 
Stop trying to act like you're in some sort of divine connection with your braking system.
Without ACTUAL brake pressure readings on each wheel, you CANNOT make the assumptions you have made. Temps won't tell you enough due to the different sized rotors, front to rear. You need to know the pad pressure, coefficient of fricton of the front and rear pads and actual contact area.
So if you measure the temps, what kind of home-brew calculation will you use to deduce that your brake roportioning is wrong? Do you have access to the original DVP&R for the CDW-27 Brake Design?......... somehow, I think NOT!
Eh, f@#k, do what the hell you want you are a lost cause.
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 3,223
"Absolut Rara."
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"Absolut Rara."
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 3,223 |
Originally posted by 99fordsvt:
I plan to borrow the IR temp gauge again soon and do more testing. Here are some comparisons from other vehicles:
http://www.zeckhausen.com/testing_brakes.htm
Hey - whatdayaknow - all those rear brakes in the test are above the "sizzle temp"
The know it all flamers who can't comprehend obviously know the outcome beforehand and that all Contour brake systems are faultless and NEVER NEVER NEVER underbias the rear .... NEVER.
First, Hey, "whatdayaknow" all the cars in those tests were rwd, had completely different setups, and were being tested beyond some normal stop and go OF COURSE THEY WILL HAVE HIGHER REAR TEMPS
And the "know-it-all-flamers" aren't saying a contour could never be under-biased; only that yours doesn't have a problem based on the information you have provided.
You don't seem to understand that in some conditions the rear MUST be underbiased in order to prevent overbias in other conditions. Overbias in the rear = very bad and dangerous. Please get this through your thick skull and quit clogging up my board.
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 10,015
Hard-core CEG'er
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Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 10,015 |
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 383
CEG\'er
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CEG\'er
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 383 |
The flawed premise is that the brakes are functioning normally other than the rear bias. THEY ARE NOT.
You're getting uneven front temps, and the brakes pull to one side. That's not a problem with the rear brakes, it's a problem with the FRONTS.
It ain't rocket science; any self-respecting semi-literate home mechanic would have shut off the computer days ago and gone back through the front [censored] brakes looking for problems associated with either a sticky caliper, air in the system, or an internally damaged flex line restricting the fluid back-flow when the brakes are released.
When it's the middle of winter and your hose is too warm inside, do you turn on the air conditioning instead of turning down the furnace? Do you switch cereal brands because the milk is spoiled? Do you buy new glasses instead of simply cleaning the TV screen? I mean God DAMN. KISD...Keep It Simple, DUMBASS.
Pacific Green '96 Contour LX V6
â??98 GTP, light mods, 14.66/94
Calypso Green '92 Mustang LX coupe, 13.56/101
Crown Autocross Club 1999 Street Tire Champion, 2000/2001/2002 Street Modified Champion
KCR SCCA 2002 Solo II Street Modified Champion
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,100
Addicted CEG\'er
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Addicted CEG\'er
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,100 |
Originally posted by 99fordsvt:
Bravo! You've just indicated that you don't know what the HeII the thread is about.
Actually, he wasn't indicating anything of the sort.. He was stating that, according to the current data at hand, nothing seems unbiased, and if you DO increase rear bias then it would not be "back to normal" it would, indeed, be higher... so you'd be a spinner.
You are correct, if it WERE lower and you raised it, it would fix the problem, but to raise the rear bias when you haven't got CONCRETE proof that its off, is simply crazy. Just because those temps are lower doesn't mean anything. As stated, larger front rotors, and more contact area in the front make anything but an ACTUAL pressure reading simply a "Guess", at best (even IR temps, as we both performed..)
This is just their (much more aggresive) way of telling you that increasing the rear bias when going on nothing more than a hunch and IR temps is not a good thing to do...
It is much simpler, and more cost effective (not to mention safer) to diagnose the fronts, replace anything you may have missed (even though you just worked the fronts over) and then move to the rear, looking more in depth for sticking parts, etc, etc.
The fact that you just replaced all the braking components recently and then you have a problem show up seems to point to the fact that something may be wrong (air let in the system, etc, etc..) but it could be absolutely ANYTHING...
If your car pulls to any side while braking it is the fronts you need to worry about. (with the obvious exceptions of bushings, and LCA's being worn, etc.)
This thread has gone on MUCH too long.. How about you start looking in to the fronts a little more, and then move to the rears, and let us know what parts are worn (or broken), if any. Don't assume since they are recently checked that all is well...
Ray
'99 CSVT - Silver #222/276
In a constant state of blow-off euphoria.
Originally posted by Kremitthefrog:
I like to wear dresses and use binoculars to watch grandmas across the street.
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 3,065
Hard-core CEG\'er
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Hard-core CEG\'er
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Rara and Stazi work with brakes prolly every single day. If anyone on this entire site knows what they are talking about, it is these two.
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 217
CEG\'er
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CEG\'er
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 217 |
Let me try and restate the original poster's statement:
"It seems to me my rear brake is working less efficient than the fronts because given the proportioning in my car, the rears are far cooler than the fronts. Ideally the rotor temps should be more even in all situation for best efficiency."
Does this paraphrasing capture the thought?
I read through the whole post with interest because I thought I saw misinterpretation what was said and a lot of frustration as the result.
I'm interested in this from engineering point of view as equal temperature must be one of the holy grail for brake system designer.
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 383
CEG\'er
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CEG\'er
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 383 |
Originally posted by TSIN03SE:
Does this paraphrasing capture the thought?
Yeah, it captures the original intent, but leaves out the willful ignorance that follows.
Pacific Green '96 Contour LX V6
â??98 GTP, light mods, 14.66/94
Calypso Green '92 Mustang LX coupe, 13.56/101
Crown Autocross Club 1999 Street Tire Champion, 2000/2001/2002 Street Modified Champion
KCR SCCA 2002 Solo II Street Modified Champion
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 10,015
Hard-core CEG'er
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Tony, you're righ in your transaltion. But How can you ASSUME that temperatures should be equal on the front and rear rotors? You simply cannot do that, especially after a panic stop as the rears will NEVER do as much work as the fronts and therefore will NEVER reach the same temperature.
2000 SVT Turbo 295hp/269ftlb@12psi
#1 for Bendix Brakes Kits!
Knuckles rebuilt w/new bearings $55
AUSSIE ENDLINKS $70
Gutted pre-cats $80/set
A lack of planning on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine!
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