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Originally posted by EternalOne:
In otherwards you'd rather have entire countries fall into the hands of terrorist leaders, willing and able to exert their influence across the entire region? Do you even understand what this would do to the global economy, or do you just not care?
E1
I don't care about the global economy or the region. I care about what is best for The American People. I don't think perpetuating the hatred for the west by constantly meddling in the ME and suporting Isreal is good for us
"Bros before Hoes" <-- More men need this mentality.
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Originally posted by Pete D:
I don't care about the global economy or the region. I care about what is best for The American People. I don't think perpetuating the hatred for the west by constantly meddling in the ME and suporting Isreal is good for us
And yet you do not realize how that would directly affect the American public at large?
Say we did leave, what do you think Iran would do? Or Syria? You think they'd just say, "Oh! The Americans left! Let's throw a party and lower our oil prices!!!"
Give me a break... Your method would destroy the entire global economy, leading to a fundamental breakdown in everything we hold dear, along with giving an entire region to terrorists, where they will then set their sights back on US Soil.
E1
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Originally posted by EternalOne:
And yet again you refuse to accept the fact that President Clinton was handed Osama on a silver platter, yet refused to act, even though it would have ultimately saved thousands of lives.
i can see you won't budge from bush's lap. whatever...it's all clinton's fault. 
Originally posted by EternalOne:
Mission Goals for the Iraqi Campaign....
these look like your goals. the way i remember it was the war in iraq being tied directly to the wot. and while there has been accomplishments in cleaning up some of the mess in iraq, the overwhelming fact is that it's in a downward spiral of disarray and the me is more unstable than ever. now when you look at that larger picture of the wot i fail to see how we've accomplished any of the goals there. like i said before some of these may be longer term than previously expected, but that's just the problem. the expectation was never set other than remove saddam from power. now we're in a bottome$$ quagmire and we have few options for the short term that will improve the situation in iraq or the wot.
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Originally posted by BP:
the way i remember it
Nice. You're basically admitting that you're ill-informed and proceeding on selective memory.
"Think of it, if you like, as a librarian with a G-string under the tweed." Clarkson on the Mondeo.
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Originally posted by EternalOne:
Originally posted by Pete D:
I don't care about the global economy or the region. I care about what is best for The American People. I don't think perpetuating the hatred for the west by constantly meddling in the ME and suporting Isreal is good for us
And yet you do not realize how that would directly affect the American public at large?
Say we did leave, what do you think Iran would do? Or Syria? You think they'd just say, "Oh! The Americans left! Let's throw a party and lower our oil prices!!!"
Give me a break... Your method would destroy the entire global economy, leading to a fundamental breakdown in everything we hold dear, along with giving an entire region to terrorists, where they will then set their sights back on US Soil.
E1
I'm trying to follow your train of thought here. How does the US pulling out of the ME (and especially ending all ties to Isreal) end up in the collapse of the global economy and our way of life as we know it 
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Originally posted by BP:
Originally posted by EternalOne:
And yet again you refuse to accept the fact that President Clinton was handed Osama on a silver platter, yet refused to act, even though it would have ultimately saved thousands of lives.
i can see you won't budge from bush's lap. whatever...it's all clinton's fault.
The way I read his posts, he conceded that other administrations have placed terrorism on a back burner & did little to abate the problem - as did I. His point was ... Well you know what he was saying, it just seems to get all jumbled up somewhere between your computer screen & you keying in a response on your keyboard. Clinton's lap seems to be a popular place for both you & Monica.
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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Originally posted by BP:
i can see you won't budge from bush's lap. whatever...it's all clinton's fault.
Yet again you refuse to see my point. I can ONLY comment on what I know to be FACT. You refuse to admit that Clinton could have taken out Osama and saved us a ton of headaches, and that Osama started his Jihad against American DURING Clinton's watch... Sure enuff if Abu Musab al-Zarqawi would have become a major terror player in 5 years you'd have no problem blaming Bush.
Originally posted by BP:
these look like your goals. the way i remember it was the war in iraq being tied directly to the wot.
These are the EXACT mission goals from the Iraqi campaign. Goes to show that you have NO idea what we are really doing there.
Originally posted by BP:
the expectation was never set other than remove saddam from power.
See my previous post for actual mission objectives.
Originally posted by Pete D:
I'm trying to follow your train of thought here. How does the US pulling out of the ME (and especially ending all ties to Isreal) end up in the collapse of the global economy and our way of life as we know it
Let's see how this would work out.
First, Isreal would be destroyed, or at the very least occupied. Next you would have Syria and Iran gaining in power in the region, able to say and do whatever they want, and shutting out all outside sources of information, thus winning the propaganda war, and bringing more youngsters under their reign. You would also have total collapse of the int'l waterways in the region, since currently the US Navy ensures open transport routes free of pirates. Adding in that Iran and Syria would then exert their influence on every country in the region once again (Iraq, Palestine, Lebanon, etc) and now you have the majority of the worlds oil in control of a rogue group. With int'l shipping hurting, and oil under their control, what do you think would happen here? Those large numbers of youngers I talked about above? Yeah, I'm sure they'd be happy with their small section... No, actually they'd then set their sights on the moderate Mulim nations, such as Egypt, Saudi, etc -- those with any ties to the West. From there you've now ended up creating an entire region of the world that is lawless and a breeding ground for terror. You think Iraq is bad now? Imagine an area 50x the size, where instead of 1% of the people willing to die to kill any American you have more along the lines of 50%, growing each year...
Understand now? And that's a VERY high level overview...
E1
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Originally posted by TourDeForce:
The way I read his posts, he conceded that other administrations have placed terrorism on a back burner & did little to abate the problem - as did I.
Thank you, very well put. And yes, this is what I meant, although I admit it might not have come out this clear.
E1
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Originally posted by Jeb Hoge:
Nice. You're basically admitting that you're ill-informed and proceeding on selective memory.
so you're saying bush isn't linking the war in iraq to the wot? please correct me if i'm wrong, i'm sure the rest of the country would like to hear it too. thanks jeb.
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Originally posted by TourDeForce:
The way I read his posts, he conceded that other administrations have placed terrorism on a back burner & did little to abate the problem - as did I.
if you say so. maybe that's some sort of secret communication tactic you conservative boys came up with in your reach around circle jerks cause that's not what i read.
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