Thoughts on shifting well

Contour Enthusiasts Group Archives

I've been experimenting with the subtle art of shifting my contour. The biggest factor that determines the outcome( that being a good, quick, smooth shift ) seems to be the timing of clutch disengagement vs. gas pedal release.

To me, depressing the clutch just a moment before releasing the gas seem the best. If it's synced, or just a moment after gas release, I get not-so smooth shift.

What is your experience?

you could power shift, i wouldent reccomend it on a daily basis but its not like it kills the car.

When i power shift i let out the gas a little bit so its not madman revving.

I wouldn't reccomend it if you like your car.

I cringe at the thought of forcing the stick through powershifting. I can honestly I've never mustarded up to do it. It's the enginerd in me.

My experience with other cars is different from my Contour. In other vehicles, there is less sensitivity to timing of clutch release and gas pedal coordination. Contour OTOH rewards good skills with smooth, quick shifts.

Originally posted by Tourige:

When i power shift i let out the gas a little bit so its not madman revving.

Then you ain't powershifting!

Biggest factor (to me anyway) is how long it takes the engine to drop revs and if you can get the MTX into the next highest gear before the revs drop all the way to idle. If I shift at anything below about 2500 rpms I'll have to blip the throttle a little to rev match engine speed with forward momentum. Shifting at 3000 or above lets me get into the next highest gear just as the revs are correct for a smooth clutch engagement. However I think it's better for the car and MTX if the shifts aren't done too quickly in order to keep the synchros happy and just match engine revs with the throttle before engaging the clutch.
Karl

I wondered about this myself. One could go to the extreme and do the double clutching that truckers use, matching rev's and all. I'm sure done religiously this will increase longevity of your transmission.

But there is matter of practicality. And when shifted just right, MTX can be shifted very quickly without resistance. I would say my average shift takes less than a second, maybe closer to 1/2 second.

It's really quick when clutch is depressed a fraction of second before gas is let off. Try and see if it makes difference for you. I've been 'experimenting' with this for close to 8 years now.

you guys over think shifting.

Originally posted by lizard:
you guys over think shifting.

Sometimes I overshift thinking, but that's for a different thread.

Originally posted by lizard:
you guys over think shifting.

Well, considering how many people have problems with their MTX, I'd say that at least a minimal amount of thought should be given to the art of shifting them. After all, it's not the same thing as shifting a front engine rear drive type transmission.
Karl

Originally posted by 88SVT:
.. After all, it's not the same thing as shifting a front engine rear drive type transmission.
Karl

Enlighten me, please! Thanks.

Let's refocus on the trans we all have to live with here.

The MTX has, to me, has unique requirements to use it well. Like I said earlier, it rewards drivers who know how to push the right buttons at the right time.

Different way to describe the technique I'm using is to depress the clutch so that engine rev's just a little while shifting. This requires that you keep foot on the gas while pressing clutch. Difference here with powershifting is that you back off the gas very shortly after clutch is disengaged. I can change gears in less than 1 second this way except to go into the 5th gear.

I was hoping the experts would chime in with reasons why this method works so well.

It's like dancing. You can watch your feet and count the steps and be technically correct, but you're only really dancing when you're moving naturally and fluidly, and responding to your partner. I've tried teaching my wife how to drive a MTX with the various steps and timing, but she's never really picked up the natural rhythm of it.

Originally posted by Jeb Hoge:
It's like dancing. You can watch your feet and count the steps and be technically correct, but you're only really dancing when you're moving naturally and fluidly, and responding to your partner. ...

This is an excellent analogy to "when to shift and how to shift."

Originally posted by Tony2005:

Originally posted by Jeb Hoge:
It's like dancing. You can watch your feet and count the steps and be technically correct, but you're only really dancing when you're moving naturally and fluidly, and responding to your partner. ...

This is an excellent analogy to "when to shift and how to shift."

"May I touch your knob?"

Originally posted by RogerB:

Originally posted by Tony2005:

Originally posted by Jeb Hoge:
It's like dancing. You can watch your feet and count the steps and be technically correct, but you're only really dancing when you're moving naturally and fluidly, and responding to your partner. ...

This is an excellent analogy to "when to shift and how to shift."

"May I touch your knob?"

OOOOO

Originally posted by Tony2005:

Originally posted by 88SVT:
.. After all, it's not the same thing as shifting a front engine rear drive type transmission.
Karl

Enlighten me, please! Thanks.

My point was that people forget how relatively fragile these MTXs apparently are. Therefore, easy does it and it will last. Abuse it and you'll be replacing parts. With a standard setup as I mentioned there's no cable ends to stretch or break, no weak differential to grenade, no shifter bolt to snap, etc. It's abvious when you try and put so many parts/functions inside one box, there's more room for failure. With a separate transmission/differential, they can take much more "sporty driving."
Karl

Originally posted by 88SVT:

Originally posted by Tony2005:

Originally posted by 88SVT:
.. After all, it's not the same thing as shifting a front engine rear drive type transmission.
Karl

Enlighten me, please! Thanks.

My point was that people forget how relatively fragile these MTXs apparently are. Therefore, easy does it and it will last. Abuse it and you'll be replacing parts. With a standard setup as I mentioned there's no cable ends to stretch or break, no weak differential to grenade, no shifter bolt to snap, etc. It's abvious when you try and put so many parts/functions inside one box, there's more room for failure. With a separate transmission/differential, they can take much more "sporty driving."
Karl

Thanks.

Let me know if I'm belaboring this point. I really want to quantify and demystify what made good shift vs. poor shift on my Contour. Not only is the transmission a major expense bill if something goes wrong, but shifting is something I do many times while I own this car. So naturally I want to be more skillful.

Earlier I noted Japanese cars are not sensitive to how you shift, they shifted well anyway you shifted. This isn't so with the MTX. One key difference was that their dashpot function is more stronger than ours. In other words, the engine rpm is held longer after you let off the throttle than is calibrated into Contours.

So I emulated this by not fully letting off the throttle while depressing clutch. This is when I discovered the sweet spot. With my foot almost off but not fully off, the engine rpm would blip up just a little when shifting and the shift goes smooth and quick.

This takes a bit of finese and that may be what other person was saying about being like good dancing. But it's my opinion that anyone can be taught to dance well if the mechanics are broken down and analyzed. Though not all of us will be great dancers as a result.

This is crap. Well, not all of it but much of it.
Yes, I think it is belabored too much This car shifts just as well as any other normal manual transmission.
There are Honda transmissions that are a bit smoother and quicker, the transmission in my Volvo is a very high quality German built trans that is one of the best I've ever shifted.
However, unless you've got binding forks, sloppy/worn cables, rods, or shifter, worn out synchros, then this car shifts very well, smooth and and positive. With the right fluid and well broke-in, working parts the car is very enjoyable and quick!!!!
Holding the throttle longer is known as Throttle Hang around here and was present on most cars. We like to get RID of it rather than ask for more. Get yourself an Xcal2 and you can reprogram the dashpot for longer or shorter, faster drop off or slower drop off, etc.
There really are no special tricks to shifting it. It works as well as any other mid high 16-23 thousand dollar car, and better than many! Yes there are better ones out there.

On the other hand, ANY transmission will be easy shifting in and out of gear if you rpm/gear match when you shift. You can shift without the clutch if you match perfectly. I don't advise it, it takes to much attention that should be on the road anyway. Its also too slow for speed.
Upshifting shouldn't require anything at all and downshifting I usually blip the throttle to rev match a little so that I can slip it into a lower gear as I'm coming up to a turn or feel like I'm about to "Need" to accelerate.

Just MY OPINION after seeing this thread hang around so long and reading some of it.

Dance away though.

I just notice my 1st to 2nd shift is not always smooth. This is probably because of the wide gear ratio spread.
I agree with some of your thoughts.