Max wattage poll - 10/24/02 10:21 PM
I would like to poll all willing CEG's with slumping systems to cast a vote of how much wattage their systems are handling.
Originally posted by Kai:ditto, now if i could fix the amp, i could push 600. right now it's 130
300 . . . barely . . .
In reply to:
I hope you arent giving only 300 watts to anything larger than a 10.
Originally posted by TheGrimace:
I hope you arent giving only 300 watts to anything larger than a 10.
Originally posted by FFE:
In reply to:
I hope you arent giving only 300 watts to anything larger than a 10.
whys that, Under powering a sub won't hurt it. Its the gain happy people that harm the sub
Originally posted by Champagne96GL:
As long as it is clean power you shouldn't hurt the sub at all, its distortion/clipping that kills vc's
Originally posted by TheGrimace:
Underpowering subs tends to make them play very loose. This is fine if you intend on listening to rap. If you listen to rock or even techno underpowering a sub will make your low tones sloppy and it wont sound very good.
Originally posted by TheGrimace:
There is nothing wrong with low power systems
In reply to:
underpowering isnt good. Bridging is bad.
Originally posted by contour se driver:
ive got 450 times 2 continuous at home ATI, car audio sucks nuts.
In reply to:
ive got 450 times 2 continuous at home ATI, car audio sucks nuts.
Originally posted by TheGrimace:Why? I'm not saying you are wrong, I just don't know and am curious.
I still contest that bridging will dirty up your signal. Feel free to argue but you can't win.
Originally posted by TheGrimace:
I still contest that bridging will dirty up your signal. Feel free to argue but you can't win.
Originally posted by TheGrimace:
I still contest that bridging will dirty up your signal. Feel free to argue but you can't win.
Originally posted by contour se driver:
ive got 450 times 2 continuous at home ATI, car audio sucks nuts.
Originally posted by contour se driver:
I get sick and tired of hearing the shops say "It's the box, it's not tuned" or "this box wasnt built for this sub".
Originally posted by contour se driver:
Sorry to take soo long. I'm not a noob by the way, i just never really post anything. Spending money on hame doesnt make car audio suck. It is the fact that a 5k home setup will most likely sound better then a 10k setup in a car. I recently added basslink to my tour and it sucks nut compared to my home stereo. Yes, i have been spoiled, but i have NEVER heard ANYTHING from car come even close.
I get sick and tired of hearing the shops say "It's the box, it's not tuned" or "this box wasnt built for this sub". I recently listened to a JL audio ws7 whatever one. It's their flat cone that takes almost a 1000 watts. The sales guy told me it was the box that is for that sub. A 1000 dollar sub only sounded like as*. I've heard 8's that drop deaper then that thing. Yup i'm talking about sunfire. Name one sub that will compete with that with amp for the exact same price.
So i say car audio sucks nuts. I've heard the Focal 1000 dollar setup which sounded like as*. With speakers sound like trash, it is really difficult to tell whether the amp, or even head units are sounding like crap. It just amazes me that a person could buy so much cheap wattage and crappy sound that it adds up to more what a decent home stereo could sound like. Oh and dont even mention Mark Levinson in the lexus, a low end cd player from those guys cost 6k alone. Do you really thing they put 20-30k worth of audio in that thing?
So, i say car audio sucks nuts.
Originally posted by contour_phoenix_when:
yea bizest but what about the cost of the R/D that was necesary to determine the type of driver to be matched to the kind of box used.
Originally posted by APT CSVT:
Originally posted by contour se driver:
ive got 450 times 2 continuous at home ATI, car audio sucks nuts.
I've got 2x481w rms continuous at 20Hz plus 5x90w rms in my home - big deal. But I spend far more time in my car where it is far more challengine to design a good system.
Originally posted by cthomp21:
Originally posted by TheGrimace:
I still contest that bridging will dirty up your signal. Feel free to argue but you can't win.
Hard to argue with someone who doesn't know what they're talking about.
Generally, running an amp in bridged mode will increase the THD and amount of heat generated. Will the increase in distortion be measurable by scientific instruments? Yes. Will the increase in distortion be detectable by human ears? No.
BTW, 99.99999% of signals will have some level of distortion in them. So, I guess we're all running "dirty" signals.
Originally posted by contour se driver:
Originally posted by cthomp21:
Originally posted by TheGrimace:
I still contest that bridging will dirty up your signal. Feel free to argue but you can't win.
Hard to argue with someone who doesn't know what they're talking about.
Generally, running an amp in bridged mode will increase the THD and amount of heat generated. Will the increase in distortion be measurable by scientific instruments? Yes. Will the increase in distortion be detectable by human ears? No.
BTW, 99.99999% of signals will have some level of distortion in them. So, I guess we're all running "dirty" signals.
My ATI does sound a tick worse in bridged mode. But you didn't mention what amp you are speaking of. Mcintosh quotes no difference in bridge mode. As far as distortion goes about every amp amplifies the signal to a much higher level then it will cut the tops and bottoms off then do it agin. Why do you think there are stages?
Originally posted by contour se driver:
I have perfect hearing
In reply to:
HAHAHAHA. Show me 1 sub that will play 18hz the way sunfire does.
In reply to:
Every car sub maker on the market?? HAHAHAHA, thats a joke. i have NEVER EVER heard any car audio come close to home. NONE.
In reply to:
I have perfect hearing, a 30k amp will dominate a 500 dollar car amp i guarentee it.
In reply to:
Try speaking from experience
In reply to:
i have heard 80k speakers not including the rest of the system.
In reply to:
The Sunfire plays bass deeper then the ws7, JL audio is a joke from what i heard too. I would never put that crap in a serious car setup.
Originally posted by contour se driver:
Originally posted by cthomp21:
Originally posted by TheGrimace:
I still contest that bridging will dirty up your signal. Feel free to argue but you can't win.
Hard to argue with someone who doesn't know what they're talking about.
Generally, running an amp in bridged mode will increase the THD and amount of heat generated. Will the increase in distortion be measurable by scientific instruments? Yes. Will the increase in distortion be detectable by human ears? No.
BTW, 99.99999% of signals will have some level of distortion in them. So, I guess we're all running "dirty" signals.
My ATI does sound a tick worse in bridged mode. But you didn't mention what amp you are speaking of. Mcintosh quotes no difference in bridge mode. As far as distortion goes about every amp amplifies the signal to a much higher level then it will cut the tops and bottoms off then do it agin. Why do you think there are stages?
Originally posted by contour se driver:
Originally posted by APT CSVT:
Originally posted by contour se driver:
ive got 450 times 2 continuous at home ATI, car audio sucks nuts.
I've got 2x481w rms continuous at 20Hz plus 5x90w rms in my home - big deal. But I spend far more time in my car where it is far more challengine to design a good system.
What amp? I forgot to mention this is in 8 ohms, my speakers are 4 ohm, so how much is it now? Obvious you have some kind of receiver which isnt as high current. Same as your amp?
MUHAHAHAHAH.
Smile.
Originally posted by contour_phoenix_when:
Can we really assign a cost to the design of a box.
Yes most manufactures would state.
Originally posted by Specialist23:
hope u guys know, wattage doesn't mean squad. absolute NOTHING!! ask anyone that truly knows and is in the business...
Originally posted by contour se driver:
Thank you cthomp21, someone else is exposing this dnewman or what ever his name is.
In reply to:
It's funny cause you always say a name or roll eyeball or something immature. I have yet to do either, you havent read my posts clear enough.
In reply to:
To me power handling, excursion, all the other mumbo jumbo you speak means nothing to me.
In reply to:
What does is a small sub, preferably a 10 will do 20hz as loud as 60 hz. The challange was find a sub like sunfire, aka an 8, that will play as low as loud.
In reply to:
you said there was, now from who?
In reply to:
Also what speaker manufacturer has a set that cost 160k?
In reply to:
The most expensive i know about cost 250k Pulling figures and lies out of thin air means nothing to me.
In reply to:
20hz bass does.
In reply to:
JL audio is a joke.
In reply to:
I have listened to it and am not impressed.
In reply to:
I still think sunfire plays deaper. Which was my whole point.
In reply to:
Till you give me a name, and a shop, i will hold your words as make believe. Everything you have said can be read out of a mgazine, try saying something for yourself.
In reply to:
Just beacuse you can,t afford it doesnt make it overpriced,
In reply to:
if you know anything about audio you will know that any ati is a very good deal
In reply to:Lets keep your fantasies out of the argument.
but you have already exposed yourself numerous times.
In reply to:
I just wonder what other misimformed monkeys will believe your thin air language.
In reply to:
I'm just trying to help you be a better consumer.
In reply to:
Samson? i found them, try not to brag for your buddy. As i said before watts are cheap, car audio sucks nuts.
Originally posted by Specialist23:
hope u guys know, wattage doesn't mean squad. absolute NOTHING!! ask anyone that truly knows and is in the business...
Originally posted by Honkeytonk Monkey:
I think that Contour SE Driver is actually anothre user name for dnewma04. There is no way anybody could really be that retarded. Seriously, if you are real, shut up and liste to what Dave tells you, he knows more about this crap than you will ever hope to. He doesn't have your obvious litterature knowledge either, he is a DIY audio guru and can think up absolutely perfect system combinations in his sleep. In fact many people here owe him a huge debt of gratitude as he found some of the best equipment any of us have ever seen over the years. No suggestion he has given to date has hed poor results either. He actually knows how to read the specifications of a speaker and in his head determine what other equipment would best match up to it.
As for the statement "car audio sucks nutz"
Obviously a car is not the greatest place to have a stereo system compared to a house. Here's a question for you though, can you take your home system with you on a 4 hour trip? Would cruising be as fun with an 8track instead of a really good sound system? Sounds to me like you sit at home all day listening to Celine Dion with youtr little 8" while everyone else is out with thier friends driving around in thier cars with stereos that "suck nuts" Meeting new people and making new friends. Try it, you may realise it's actually not that bad
Originally posted by contour se driver:
You defend him but look above, wattage isnt everything. Ever heard of sensitivity in a speaker? Also, how about a high current amp? You can have current without voltage, but you cannot have voltage without amps. Anyone in electronics\electric will know the pie chart, watts equal current time voltage. High voltage will not drive a low impedance and low sensitive speaker. High current will.
Also dave whatever said he listend to speakers costing twice as much as 80k, lets see thats, ummmm 160, but then he says they cost 135 and tried correcting me on his lack of reading skills. You guys are soo funny, car audio does suck nuts, when comparing to home audio, get over it. Dave know more? HAHAHAHA, he hasnt shown that he does. Look at his posts, has a hard time even knowing the basics. DYI of trash is what it is. You guys. If you losers eee me on the street dont wave, i dont want to know idiots.
Originally posted by dnewma04:
I will respond to anything he posts, but purely for the entertainment of the rest of the group.
Originally posted by dnewma04:
The Genesis 1 was 160k when I heard it back in 1992. The company went out of business for a few years and came back last year. The current iteration of the Genesis 1 is 135k.
Anyway,
I think it has become clear that this guy is a hoax. I will respond to anything he posts, but purely for the entertainment of the rest of the group.
Originally posted by geoffct:
2580 Watts, 2400 in my sub alone. Then 180 in the doors.
^
I put my Klipsch RSW-15 in the trunk with an inverter :-) Talk about bass!
Originally posted by contour se driver:
To me loudness and excursion mean nothing if it cant do 20hz.
Originally posted by contour se driver:
Originally posted by dnewma04:
The Genesis 1 was 160k when I heard it back in 1992. The company went out of business for a few years and came back last year. The current iteration of the Genesis 1 is 135k.
Anyway,
I think it has become clear that this guy is a hoax. I will respond to anything he posts, but purely for the entertainment of the rest of the group.
Clearly i am a hoax huh? lets see, i can back up everything i am saying, I am not magazine racing like the rest of you.[/qb]
In reply to:
I will say the sunire, the original true sub, has deeper bass then even the 12 inch top model sub from jl.
In reply to:
There is no way to dispute that. To me loudness and excursion mean nothing if it cant do 20hz.
In reply to:
You said something about cerwin vega, that brand is a serious joke. their stoker long ago took a db win, but at only 40hz. I have heard 6.5 inchers drop deeper then that, Joseph audio for one. Ever heard of N.E.A.R.? they used to use 2 5.25 to hit 20.
In reply to:
I find it hilarious, no one has experience yet you jump on the post like your an engineer.
In reply to:
I would advise the two of you to actually go out and listen to some home audio, also try REL, about all their subs are around 10 inch and play 20.
In reply to:
True i have been spoiled by home audio to never really enjoy car, but if someone in the northwest doesnt believe me, you can listen to my home then ill take you to all the local stores to back up what im saying.
In reply to:
Car audio cannot compete with home. Even focal, a sister company of JM Lab, doesnt use the same drivers. Focal is built to a lesser quality. Also i knew an owner of a audio shop, he told me he gave up car cause, it sucks nuts.
In reply to:
please reread my previous post and take a hint.
In reply to:
The RSW-15 surpasses the performance of a conventional 21" single-driver subwoofer through intelligent engineering. Pairing a heart-throbbing 15" rear-firing Cerametallicā?¢ active driver with a 3-inch voice coil and 30-pound motor assembly with a 15" front-firing passive radiator gives you more surface area than a 21" subwoofer in a much smaller footprint.
Originally posted by Honkeytonk Monkey:
You should probably consider giving this up man. You are obviously outclassed here. Let it go. You have gone from being seen as wrong/not very knowledgeable to just plain ignorant. You have not backed any argument with fact, just your opinion (which is wrong). Meanwhile Dave has brought specs, references, and technical explanations to his side of the argument. You can't win, it just isn't possible (although it is highly entertaining) This is about the same as watching a Focus race a Twin Turbo Corvette. You feel sorry for the Focus as it is the second slowest car ever built and it's trying it's best to beat a 650hp beast. Do you get what I'm saying? You are the Focus, Dave is the Vette. You lose. It is highly entertaining much like that race would be, but I think it would get boring to watch the Focus get beat down after a few tries. Keep trying though lil' guy
Originally posted by KnuKonceptz:
Betcha these play lower than your tiny 8" mini, *cough*wussy sized woofer. By the way they are Car Audio Subs
In reply to:
whan i listened to that jl sub it does not sound as deep as a sunfire. how can anyone dismiss this?? no one here has taken a listen to these yet you all are talking like you have. what have i said can be proven wrong? for example, the basslink claims 20hz, hahaha thats a joke, it stumbles on 30.
We can dismiss it because it merely your opinion which right now means about as much to people here as me farting, only my farts aren't as full of [censored] as you. We can't prove you wrong, as even if we did you wouldn't accept our mere "facts" against your opinion. Silly us for trying to educate you right?
In reply to:
there you go again dave, spewing the obvious, of course ported makes a difference, they can be tuned also, ever notice the golf ball looking dimples in them these days? to reduce chuffing, how about the front baffle? rounded too to prevent port noise. i can say the car crap that i have heard sealed or not is crap compared to home.
I have a PB15 in a sealed box in the Focus. If you listened to it you would look like a retard if afterwards you calle dit crap. I'll use your own horrible argument against you here. I claim that my PB15 sounds better than anything in the entire universe. You can't say I'm wrong as you never heard it. Until you hear it you must accept my statement as true. That's what you are expecting of us isn't it?
In reply to:
did you know some speakers are not built to be sealed? are you familiar with earthquake from car to home. it is written documentation that focal is lesser quality then jm lab so what the hell are you making up?
You speak of Dave spewing the obvious, then make this statement? Can you not hold a thought for over a second? Also, besides what you just wrote, show me where that was written. Seriously, it would be nice to see.
In reply to:
the sales rep told me this was the box for it. all this i know what im talking about isnt [censored]. i know what i heard and its different from the trash im hearing here from you nonexperienced fools. dave the dumbass, mcintosh for their car amps say in literature that no specs change when bridged, but you say they do, well theres proof. headphones at 20hz, hahaha unless you spent at least 350, it aint happening. all the bass i have ever heard in my life is cheap ass bass. except home audio.
You call us "nonexperienced" yet all you have for credentials is that you bought a sub and like it. You also note you've heard different subs in different stores. Good for you! So have I, I have also wandered into stereo shops (both home and car audio locations, not just car audio and listened to what I could. I notice a funny thing though. While home audio locations usually have acoustically seperated rooms to listen to the systems without the ambient noise, the locations with the JL subs among others have everything crammed into a wall in an open environment where every sound made from every persom in the room interferes. I love your comparisson method, really accurate! BTW my headphones were $138 CDN and can play 20 HZ (I have a test tone generator on the computer, so yes, I can say it was a 20Hz tone) And I will once again remind you the subwoofer in my car sounds anything but cheap.
In reply to:
good analogy considering you have no idea on this subject. dave hasnt proven anything, i know what i heard and what i hear at home car audio sucks nuts. teahs spec and references? how about anyone here to actually take the challange and listen for your self. there is 30hz and there is 30hz.
I am begining to think you may not be a car audio fan... I think you can't read the specs and it's pissing you off so you are falling back on "My hearing is more precise than any testing instruments" which obviously is not even a real argument. And please try to come up with something a little more clever than "sucks nuts". It isn't helping to make you seem any more intelligent. Just a thought
In reply to:
my problem with some car audio, i have heard some trash and thats where it should be, the over amplification of higher frequencies masking the lowers, i have heard this myself. ohh man i couldnt wait to get home to drain out the mess i heard. i have heard 1 car stero with actual good bass in my life the rest was the 40hz and up trash bass. you say i always mention 20hz, thats because thats what impresses me, not 40 which any speaker can do but 20hz. it is very difficult for any speaker to do 20 with the exact same db as 50hz. im saying truly flat, the sunfire was measured down to 18 with i believe +-2 so the junior is not the same.
You have heard trash, well hooray, now find some good car setups and listen to them. A well setup system does not have all your listed problems. I am curious though, you seem to think that any bass played above 20Hz is a horrible thing, so what music do you listen to? You may be surprised to know that if you set your crossover higher than 20Hz and hook up some speakers along with your little sub the music becomes more accurate to the original recording (you can now make out people's voices, and things like guitars now make sounds!!!). Now I'm not telling you to set the sub at 600Hz or anything, you can stay at a lower level, but do give it a try!
In reply to:
max wattage, excursion, boxes, etc aside....all else equal it is very hard to find a 10 to do 20hz flat. this has gotten to far too, the original post was me saying home audio will stomp car auido. no matter what you say it will not happen, it will not be any different, home will sound better. i gave a challange now im waiting for volunteers to go listen.
Um, no your original post simply said "car audio sucks nutz", a far cry from your cleaned up version. Home audio is alot easier to set up. I am going to be building my home theatre myself as soon as I can afford to do it. Until then I will stick to the car. Nobody ever told you Car audio is better than home audio. I even said so myself a couple pages back. Try reading what you are arguing against next time. Just incase you decide not to I'll say it here too.
Home audio in general sounds better than in car audio as in the home you will not have to deal with such things as speaker location (kicks or doors, either is not the perfect location, where as in your house you can put them wherever you need to) ambient noise (sit in a car on the highway, now sit in you living room, bit of a difference right?) So does this mean it's impossible for a car stereo to sound good? No, and you're an idiot for thinking so. It just means you must try really hard to get it to sound good. You just haven't found anybody that has put any effort into thier car stereo yet.
Now you have a nice day and I await your response "No you am dumb and car stereo is sucks nuts"
In reply to:
To me loudness and excursion mean nothing if it cant do 20hz.