Contour Enthusiasts Group Archives
Posted By: SpeakerBoxxx DVC Subwoofer question - 03/20/06 04:44 AM
Is there anything wrong with using a different amplifier on each voice coil of a subwoofer? For example, if I had a 4 hom DVC sub, and I had two identical amplifiers, if I bridged each amp and used them on different speaker terminals on the subwoofer, made sure that the gains/xover/bass boost/etc on each amp were at the same level, would that cause any harm to the subwoofer?

...the reason I asked is because I just got my hands on a RF Punch 400a4 (old school) and I wanted to use it with a Kicker S10L7. The amplifier is powered at 200wrmsx2 if you bridge channels 1+2/3+4

Thanks for your help
Posted By: icysvt Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/20/06 10:34 AM
that you can do safely with a 4 channel but as far as 2 seperate amps you never find 2 amps that actually put out the same power even with gain levels and such. You would have to level match them with a volt meter
Posted By: dnewma04_dup1 Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/20/06 01:51 PM
why would you have to level match with a volt meter?



hint: i'm setting you up.
Posted By: MxRacer Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/20/06 02:28 PM
Originally posted by dnewma04:
why would you have to level match with a volt meter?



hint: i'm setting you up.




aren't you supposed to be in FL?
Posted By: SpeakerBoxxx Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/20/06 04:07 PM
Originally posted by icysvt:
that you can do safely with a 4 channel




does everyone agree? also, i dont know why i gave you guys the 2 amplifier scenario, cause im using a 4 channel amplifier. i think that example came from the memphis website, where they were talking about a quad 1 ohm subwoofer, and customers putting 4 amps on that one subwoofer
Posted By: dnewma04_dup1 Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/20/06 06:33 PM
there is no problem with running seperate channels, seperate amps, etc.
Posted By: GrandMasterKhan Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/20/06 08:58 PM
It is "possible" to wire it this way. But it is the least effecive and most costly solution.

You would need to RCA Ys. take the Subwoofer preout and Y the SUB rca into all 4 inputs of the amp so they all get the same exact signal.

Then you would need to gain match each channel with a multimeter.

Failure to properly match each channel will result in poor performance from the subwoofer and possible damage.

Both channels MUST be 100% the same. If one is off just a little each voice coil will be putting out a different signal and they will fight each other reducing your volume, greatly increasing distortion and heat. Which could damage your amp and your sub.


So my answer is NO. Dont use that amp for your sub. More trouble than its worth. Use that amp for your mids/highs and get a mono class D subwoofer amplifer with at least 400-600 watts RMS x 1 @ 2ohms.
Posted By: GrandMasterKhan Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/20/06 09:09 PM
A 4ch amplier is essentiall two 2 channel amps in a single housing. Each pair of channels has it own indivuals gain settins.



Additionally amplifers which are capable of being Strapped together would use a special cable in order to automatically gain match multiple amps to one another.

Kicker subwoofer amplifers for example have this abilty. one amp becomes the master and the other amp is the slave.

This allows you to take 2 amps and put out double the power at double the oms.

example. The kicker kx400.1 is 400watts rms @ 2ohm. If you strap two together you get 800watts rms @ 4ohm. That quad 4ohm sub could then be wired to two kicker amps. 2 voice coils per amp.
Posted By: dnewma04_dup1 Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/21/06 09:13 PM
Originally posted by GrandMasterKhan:

Failure to properly match each channel will result in poor performance from the subwoofer and possible damage.

Both channels MUST be 100% the same. If one is off just a little each voice coil will be putting out a different signal and they will fight each other reducing your volume, greatly increasing distortion and heat. Which could damage your amp and your sub.





Wrong, wrong, wrong, and one more wrong for good measure. The original development of DVC drivers was to be able to produce both sides of a stereo signal with one driver. Providing the VCs are not playing the same signal but with reverse polarity, their will be no damage caused by playing signals that aren't exactly the same.
Posted By: GrandMasterKhan Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/22/06 01:39 AM
Your going to say that at high volume if channel 1/2 is set to +3db and channel 3/4 is set to 3.5db then it wont cause any harm or distortion?

The whole point is for harmony. If the voice coils are not getting the same signal it is like two people siging slightly out of sync. Sure it might not cause the amp to blow up or the sub to blow. But its not ideal and *might* cause damage over time vs a properly setup single channel setup.

Needless to say find a single channel monoblock amplifer and avoid all the multichannel BS. Its not worth the trouble.
Posted By: SpeakerBoxxx Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/22/06 02:22 PM
Now I'm confused...
Posted By: dnewma04_dup1 Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/22/06 06:42 PM
Originally posted by GrandMasterKhan:
Your going to say that at high volume if channel 1/2 is set to +3db and channel 3/4 is set to 3.5db then it wont cause any harm or distortion?




Absolutely correct.
Quote:


The whole point is for harmony. If the voice coils are not getting the same signal it is like two people siging slightly out of sync. Sure it might not cause the amp to blow up or the sub to blow. But its not ideal and *might* cause damage over time vs a properly setup single channel setup.




Why would you be playing two different signals? I'm assuming there is one source with my responses. I'm getting the impression you are confused about how DVC subs work. You understand that the two signals are summed electrically and not mechanically, right?

Quote:



Needless to say find a single channel monoblock amplifer and avoid all the multichannel BS. Its not worth the trouble.




There is no trouble and he has the multi-channel amp currently.
Posted By: CarpePoon_dup1 Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/22/06 08:20 PM
Originally posted by GrandMasterKhan:
Needless to say find a single channel monoblock amplifer and avoid all the multichannel BS. Its not worth the trouble.



Why spend money on a new amp? just to make the wiring easier?
Posted By: GS474 Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/22/06 10:14 PM
bottom line yes you can

no it isn't recomended
no it isn't that safe
no it isn't worth it
Posted By: MxRacer Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/23/06 01:31 AM
Originally posted by GS474:
bottom line yes you can

no it isn't recomended
no it isn't that safe
no it isn't worth it




bottom line is, you are wrong.

guess what many two channel amps are? two seperate amplifiers in one body. god forbid we wire a DVC with the "stereo" outputs from a two channel amp, eh?
Posted By: SpeakerBoxxx Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/23/06 02:12 AM
so its 3 vs 2... 3 people i know have been around here for awhile, versus 2 people, one with a considerable amount of posts and one with around 120.

i dont know what to do... we'll try it out and see.
Posted By: MxRacer Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/23/06 03:24 AM
Originally posted by SpeakerBoxxx:
so its 3 vs 2... 3 people i know have been around here for awhile, versus 2 people, one with a considerable amount of posts and one with around 120.

i dont know what to do... we'll try it out and see.




newman will never, ever steer you wrong man. trust me.
Posted By: Reverend DBZ Jr Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/23/06 11:59 AM
Having different signals to your DVC sub doen not damage it. In fact, as long as it doesn't cause the sub to bottom out, or you don't exceed its thermal capabilities, IT WILL NOT BLOW.
Posted By: GrandMasterKhan Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/23/06 06:58 PM
Post count has nothing to do with someone knowledge. Only how much they feel they need to post on a certain forum.

I see your guy's points. Thank you for input.


I am assuming this 4 channel amplifer has a Low pass filter?
Posted By: SpeakerBoxxx Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/24/06 01:03 AM
Originally posted by GrandMasterKhan:
Post count has nothing to do with someone knowledge. Only how much they feel they need to post on a certain forum.

I see your guy's points. Thank you for input.


I am assuming this 4 channel amplifer has a Low pass filter?




I'm not saying that low post count means you dont know squat, but the guys with high post count in this thread, I've gotten good advice for time and time again.

and yes it does have a LPF.... and so does my HU.

Originally posted by MxRacer:
newman will never, ever steer you wrong man. trust me.




I understand. But I can't disregard anyone elses opinion.

Thank everyone for their input. I don't think anyone here has actually tried it, so I'll be the first to do so. I'll let everyone know how it goes.
Posted By: dnewma04_dup1 Re: DVC Subwoofer question - 03/25/06 12:58 AM
I played a stereo bass signal through my Shiva when i used it in my contour for a few months. No problems.
© CEG Archives