SCT Pro Race Opinions and Sources

try wayne with Hypillauto (or something like that) he's the guy that has been doing a pretty good hook-up for the Xcal2, he quoted me $630 a couple months ago.

Originally posted by ButtonPuncher:
I didn't wan't this to go unnoticed form another thread...

Originally posted by warmonger:
Now, how about a comprehensive review of the SCT Racer package? How much can you really change? What is your pcm code?

I have and SFG2 return style and I was ready to buy from Wayne at Hypillauto a while back but that sort of fell through. Now I'm looking at another company and I want to make sure I'll have no issues when the first code is programmed into it.

Personally, I am looking to buy the SCT PRP with the Raptor datalogger. I've heard from other CEGers that Modular Depot is not a good company to buy from.

If you have a SCT PRP could you post a review? What are some other sources other than Modular Depot with good support? Also, is the "base" tune on the SCT PRP a preformance tune, or is it the same as stock?

BTW, I have a return style system with the DJK4 PCM code.

Thanks,
BP

I'll get some screen shots of the Advantage software and can get any info needed when I grab my laptop out of my SVT. I have a return style fuel system and an RJL1 code. I haven't used any other tuning software, so I can't say how much better/worse it is compared to others. Though, from what I've read it is very good and many, many tuners in Mustang and other popular Ford platforms are switching over to it.

From what I can tell, you can change every aspect of your program. Also, with the 4 bank chip you can switch between the 4 programs on the fly. You get a base tune which is a safe tune and needs fine tuning. A flasher version is available for the same price, and it will flash your PCM through the OBDII port IIRC, but you're limited to one tune.

Modular Depot does bite monkey sack when it comes to their Customer Service, but their forum is full of good info. It also has all the value files (MAF transfer functions, injector value files, ect) , software updates, ect on there too. For zetec tuners, there are lots of Focus guys on there so it would be of even more use to you guys. Since I have a duratec V6, it was only good for the general database and other things I listed above.
* I am getting all of the value files I can get my mits on, and will have them if anyone DOESN'T go through MD for their PRP.*

When teamed with a wide band O2 (SCT uses the Innovate LM1 in all their examples, and they show how to use it with the Raptor real time datalogger which was a huge bonus for me since that's what I have

) , you really do not need a dyno to tune your car. A few SCT tuners said that they can get me tuned for my "uncommon setup" over the phone, while @ idle in my driveway with said gear. It's the same software as the SCT tuners use, it's just limited to the PCM code of your car rather than all of the PCM codes from Ford

It is not VIN limited, so if you had another vehicle with the same PCM code (with a compatible SCT chip) you can tune for it aswell, I do know this for a fact

SCT also has a training manual for newb's like myself to tuning. It is very, very good and explains everything very well. Even though it was $75, it was worth every penny to me.

I'd be happy to try to answer any questions about the SCT PRP or Raptor. If I don't know, I can find out..... so ask away.

Originally posted by Pope:
try wayne with Hypillauto (or something like that) he's the guy that has been doing a pretty good hook-up for the Xcal2, he quoted me $630 a couple months ago.

Originally posted by warmonger:

I have and SFG2 return style and I was ready to buy from Wayne at Hypillauto a while back but that sort of fell through. Now I'm looking at another company and I want to make sure I'll have no issues when the first code is programmed into it.

Similar to the chip version where you buy more chips, to tune more cars with the flasher version you have to pay for a new flasher each time. So I suppose depending on the cost of the flasher vs. chips you can choose from there. I'd rather have a flasher so you don't have to worry about chip connectivity issues.

PRP + Xcal2 = $669.00 @ www.brenspeed.com 574-834-7455

I just looked into this for Tom(Warmonger), and Brent sells the Xcal2 for $369.00shipped to the lower 48 states, and $300.00 for the PRP. So $669.00 total, and he actually cares about customer service!

Mark

Don't worry, I'm seriously gonna call Brent to feel the situation out, but I'm gonna drop over $600 I need to get a good feeling. I get home from flight school late every day and right now I don't even have weekends free so it may be a week or so before I feel "Rested" enough to sit down during the afternoon and have enough time to call. Hell, I'm freekin exhausted right now!

No problem Tom, just getting the word out to everyone on CEG wanting the PRP, or any SCT products for that matter. There've been two different times that Brent didn't answer the phone when I called, and both times he was in town testing new products on the dyno. He dyno tests everything he sells.

Mark

Originally posted by Pope:
try wayne with Hypillauto (or something like that) he's the guy that has been doing a pretty good hook-up for the Xcal2, he quoted me $630 a couple months ago.

I didn't write that exactly right.... meant that he quoted me $630 for the pro-racer-kpackage Xcal2, not $630 for just the Xcal2.

Yeah, Wayne quoted me the same price for the actual product. AT that time he quoted me $30 per hour to help set it up with a base tune as well. Then recently he offered to come down to my location and read the existing tune w/chip. However, he has now raised his price to $50 per hour including his hourly travel time of 5 hours to come down.
I guess he has gotten more experienced now and can charge 66% more in just a few weeks. That's cool but I told him 'Thank you but no' as I couldn't afford that and that I was more than capable of doing my own tuning anyway. So right now I'm trying to decide what to do.

Will ADC sell the PRP? It didn't sound like they wanted anything to do with it

Ok. I ordered the Xcal2 and Pro Racer package from brenspeed this morning. The guy seemed very straightforward and willing to take the time I needed on the phone...smart considering the amount of money involved.
Should be here soon.

Awesome! You won't be disappointed Tom!

Mark

Originally posted by warmonger:
Ok. I ordered the Xcal2 and Pro Racer package from brenspeed this morning. The guy seemed very straightforward and willing to take the time I needed on the phone...smart considering the amount of money involved.
Should be here soon.

Please give a write up on it when you get it all figured out tom

New update.

I got my SCT Racer software working last night. Stupid key codes!

the activation key is like 60 characters long.

Well the software looks pretty cool, but of course there is only one computer code in my database.
My question is this. Anyone else with a different code want to send me a copy of the the stock file for their car so I can see if I can load it up?
I don't know if the software will allow it to be burnt to the flasher but it would be nice to know if I can at least look at another stock code for comparison. If it can burn a different code to the flasher then maybe all we need to do is build our own database of stock codes...for reference purposes of course...so that we can help fellow people out with details of timing and fuel.

Also have my engine back in the car, crossover pipe designed for the the weaponR stainless headers is up and it fits pretty good. Working on the last part of the up-pipe and then the down pipe this weekend. Hope to fire the beeotch up this next weekend and then begin basic tuning. IF everything works then I'll begin to develop this post with information and tips.
Swazo, we really need to talk man.

I know some of the guys on the Modular Depot forum have been able to look at PCM codes other than the ones they're able to tune for, but they have to be in a specific format. I'll look into it tonight and will let you know for sure.

Also, where do you have to go through for software updates and what not? I have access to them and a variety of needed value files, so if you need them I can get them.

It would be nice to have more tuning knowledge on CEG, so I'm more than willing to help out in anyway I can. With an avid CEGer like yourself with the SCT PRP, I'm sure it's only a matter of time

I don't have any files yet. A certain party had a bin file that I tried but it won't work in the SCT software. They know who they are.

However. Can the XCAL2 download the stock code into it? I'd like to pull whatever stock code is in my PCM and compare it to what they sold me before I flash it into oblivion. (Safety net)
Swazo, can you send me your .scv file and any .val files you have?
I'm supposed to be able to go to superchips' website or use the phone number and get support whenever I need it. WE'll see. Don't you get the same thing?

If the pcm flashes ok then I'm selling my Diablo chip tuned by streetflight along with the last generation turbo pipes (headers, crossover/up-pipe, down-pipe), possibly 36# injectors since the chip is tuned for them.

I want to talk timing for now.

I need to design a base table for my engine. I wasn't able to get the timing curve out of my chip so I don't really know where I was at. I didn't add much timing to the base that Keyser set when he was working with Streetflight so it should be very similar to that. I think it was around 20 degrees max.

The rule of thumb is to pull 1 degree per pound of boost but that is on lower compression motors.

If I can just remember what my max timing values were when I was dyno tuning in 2003 then I would know where to begin....

20 degrees flat line timing and DO NOT FORGET to set the IMRC adder to 0.

If you forget it is going to hurt.

IMRCs

Ok, I will set it there for the initial settings and then go from there.

Don't forget you'll probably have to change all your tables to compensate for the massive load differences... unless you have that part from the old chip.

Originally posted by WRX Barge:
Don't forget you'll probably have to change all your tables to compensate for the massive load differences... unless you have that part from the old chip.

So is there any correlation between boost pressure ratio and engine load?
Max load for the tables in the software is about 2.0 but enters in as 1.989 or something like that.
I'm experimenting with this setup right now. I got the car running yesterday and I entered my first tune. It seemed to flash ok but it is throwing rich codes for both banks almost immediately.
I'm addressing that issue but I don't have any practical basis for the load values.

War,

I got my SVT's laptop online, and have converted my tune so that you can check it out. I emailed it to you just a few minutes ago.

Awesome. I just checked it out and I can read your values. I'll look into saving my own the same way. I have to get up early so I'm signing off now but I'll talk more tomorrow or this weekend.

Cool beans. To save to a .val file, simply "select all values" and "save all values". If you weren't able to see the SC'd 2.5L tune, I can convert that one too.

One final thing, you can compare two tunes with the advantage software. It saves the info in .txt format, and by comparing my tune with the SC'd tune.... I can see how incomplete my MD base tune really is

For reference the stock Lightning runs at 1.6 load value.

Originally posted by Swazo:
Cool beans. To save to a .val file, simply "select all values" and "save all values". If you weren't able to see the SC'd 2.5L tune, I can convert that one too.

One final thing, you can compare two tunes with the advantage software. It saves the info in .txt format, and by comparing my tune with the SC'd tune.... I can see how incomplete my MD base tune really is

Yeah. When I looked at it that is what I thought too. It just goes to show you how fuggin lazy so many people are. I tell you when you find someone who will actually be conscientious about their work, KEEP EM. Pay them what they're worth.

If you can convert that SC'd 2.5L I'd appreciate it since I could not read it.

Originally posted by Keyser:
For reference the stock Lightning runs at 1.6 load value.

Awesome. Chris you're the man! What is the stock boost pressure that they run at?

Do you by any chance remember anything about the chip you burned for me insofar as the load values, spark timing limits, etc?

I'm building my second tune right now and I am going about it logically, but it would be very nice to see what I was at before.

1.6 load level equates to .6 bar (~9psi) of boost on top of 100% Volumetric Efficiency. Scale from there.

The important part in tuning is making sure 100% load is actually 100%. After that it's all down hill because the PCM calculates everything correctly for you.

Originally posted by Keyser:
For reference the stock Lightning runs at 1.6 load value.

.... and 2nd Gen's with a Kenne Bell running high boost can see as much as 200%

Originally posted by DemonSVT:
1.6 load level equates to .6 bar (~9psi) of boost on top of 100% Volumetric Efficiency. Scale from there.

The important part in tuning is making sure 100% load is actually 100%. After that it's all down hill because the PCM calculates everything correctly for you.

See, that is what I asked you earlier! Is the pressure ratio directly equivialent to engine load?

I started doing the scaling based on max pressure ratio but I think it won't be that simple when I think that the volumetric efficiency is definitely not linear with rpm or with boost. The factory load values are very non linear with regard to fuel and spark which corroborates this assumption. Oh well, it'll be in the ball park.

***Edit***
After some searching it appears the lightning boosts at up to 8psi stock, about 1.54 pressure ratio. That would make sense to use load values slightly higher.

I always tuned mine at 1.3 for 8psi. I never felt as though I was hitting the higher values at 1.6 on the dyno. Might just be me.

Well I'm going to have variable boost rates. I will need to plan for higher potential loads as well as those.

Originally posted by warmonger:

Originally posted by WRX Barge:
Don't forget you'll probably have to change all your tables to compensate for the massive load differences... unless you have that part from the old chip.

So is there any correlation between boost pressure ratio and engine load?
Max load for the tables in the software is about 2.0 but enters in as 1.989 or something like that.
I'm experimenting with this setup right now. I got the car running yesterday and I entered my first tune. It seemed to flash ok but it is throwing rich codes for both banks almost immediately.
I'm addressing that issue but I don't have any practical basis for the load values.

Looks like I'm a little late to answer this question.

I would however say that it's more related to density ratio then it is pressure ratio.

From what I surmise the ECU knows how much air the engine should consume via the setting saying what the engine size is. So more than 100% as stated above is a higher load.

Load values in my WRX (yeah.. I know different ECU) hit 2.4 (which with more assumptions is about 240% load.. which running 22 psi of boost could happen).

Anyway.. to sum things up.. yeah.. more boost equals higher load values which means you need to rescale your tables otherwise you'll get no real control over the higher load sites.

That is kind of what I was thinking. I spent hours yesterday doing my tune. I flashed the pcm, put in the CORRECT maf transfer function,

and rescaled the relevant load tables. The problem with that is that I had to rescale all the values since the cells values don't shift with the axis values. (some people will know what that last sentence means

)
So it seems to be running pretty nice except that when I turn on the AC it takes a while before the computer turns the compressor on. I know it is a load issue but I don't know where to address it.
Anyone know the first place to look for that one?

I don't know if it has anything to do with it but there is an area to adjust at what loads the computer is in closed loop I believe.

Not sure if that has anything to do with AC but you might want to mess with it anyway.

I datalogged some turbo cars and they seem to have some odd load values at idle and since the turbo's come on so quick the computer is rarely in closed loop unless you adjust those parameters.

Originally posted by warmonger:
I spent hours yesterday doing my tune. I flashed the pcm, put in the CORRECT maf transfer function, and rescaled the relevant load tables.

:Gulp: I thought you had the 90mm MAF. I hope that didn't mess you up there for a bit!

No, Brent supposedly loaded in the 80mm MAF transfer function for an initial tune but it was apparently for a 90mm.
I wouldn't have known that if you hadn't sent me the 90mm values though.

Also, it would just make it richer, i.e. more safe if I ran those values. NO sweat.

Found out today that even with the corrected MAF transfer function it is still trimming back around 20% fuel at cruise loads. At idle it was only around 4%. I had this issue before and I used the emanage to trim back 20% fuel on top of the chip. Then the computer learned in all its values and was fine.

AC system doesn't allways want to turn on. AFter a full throttle run on the highway and then light loads it began to work but sometimes would shut off. I'm sure it has to do with load calculations and throttle position. I'm probably going to have to change the load scaling that I used as well as trim out some fuel which ought to help with the load calcs anyway.

I'll trim the fuel

Downloaded a new program an hour ago that corrected the maf transfer function. I had to scale it in excel in a nonlinear manner, 4% leaner up to 20% at high voltages. Then I rescaled some of the load axes and adjusted the key values.

First impressions are great! It totally smoothed out the cruise and off idle. No backfires. Smoother engagement, AC appears to be working consistently now.
Even with the .3 bar spring in the wastegate now and a fairly warm afternoon I am getting wheelspin in 1st. I purposely got a lower pressure spring so that I wouldn't spin the wheels in first as much

and even with the 235/45 tires.
Oh well, it isn't real bad and it is a good start.
I've had to order two new axles because it appears that the vibration I've been experiencing under acceleration are from worn out inner CV joints. I guess all that torque just beat the crap out of them over the last two years. No torn boots and they felt fine when I checked them out of the car. Oh well, if I can get the new ones to last as long as the stock ones then I'll be doing good.

Overall I'm friggin extremely Stoked!

Good deal.. it's great seeing more people tuning their own cars.

Get some more knowledge on these boards.

War... I was planning on doing about the exact same thing on you to my contour with the 2.5L before it had an unfortunate incident with a telephone pole... glad it's working out well.

Too bad for your old car.

This is my third iteration of a custom turbo system so I have learned something each time and applied it. This is the first time I have done all the tuning myself.

Still having some issues with the AC today. The AC won't kick on unless the car has been driven and I'ved done at least a little bit of full throttle acceleration. Then when I come to a stop and idle the system begins to work normally.
I'm not sure what the deal is and I can't find a direct correlation between AC activation and load or TPS. I can find a setting for AC turn-off versus TPS for when the AC is cut out under full throttle though. I may need to turn that off and see if the ac comes on and always stays on. That would indicate tps issues though I haven't done anyting with the tps values from before.
Any ideas?

Just to throw this out there... but do you know if maybe it's an A/C clutch problem or an ECU problem.

Have you tried to see if the ECU is sending a signal w/o the clutch engaging.

Just a thought...

As far as other ECU parameters I can't think of anything off hand.

No it is not that. The system works perfectly and blows nice and cold. When I first plugged in my chip that ADC/streetflight tuned, or whenever the battery died it would do that for a short time until it learned for about 15 minutes. AFterwards it would work fine.
This time it is just more exaggerated.

There is a time delay for A/C during WOT. If your throttle postion for WOT is off the car will think it's in WOT more often and disengage the A/C. To test my theory, set the delay to 0.

I'll try it.

Originally posted by warmonger:
I'll try it.

Well?

Haven't had time. This weekend I will.