H&R OR EIBACH ? - CEG Archives

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Then go to accessories, check out that lowering kit.

Eibach's for a soft sprung drop.

H&R's for a performance drop.

I would not consider Eibachs a real "performance" spring. I would chose BAT over Eibach personally.

BAT's a moderate drop with performance between Eibach and H&R

Bilsteins is the best performance strut. They will not give the "rated" drop from the respective spring because of the very aggressive valving. Keep that in mind.

Koni is the best overall (i.e. compromise) strut since you can adjust them to be softer and give a more cushy ride.

If all out performance is your goal then get the Bilsteins.
If you need to have some comfort (the Bilsteins are really a race strut in street clothing) then the adjustability of the Koni's is a must. Nothing else has the ability to do it besides the Koni either.

I personally love the Bilsteins but they do transfer ever transition and bump directly to you. No compromise. I am sure some would not like them.

For comparison - The Euro struts are a nice upgrade from stockers.
A slight upgrade over SVT/early SE struts.
They have nice ride quality and average life. From the posts and info so far they have below average life with any lowering spring though.

My choice would be Bilstein and H&R's for the best performance.

However you said big drop and soft ride. (good luck!)

That would be Eibachs (softest spring) and Koni's set on soft. Though any stock strut would be soft but of course wear very fast!
You can't have a good performance strut and a soft ride without adjustability. Always a compromise somewhere. Even with adjustable struts.
I just chose mine to be losing some ride quality for performance.

I have BAT struts and an Eibach kit sitting next to me right now. I plan on getting it in finally in the next few days.

I have Bilstein's and Eibach's. Rather stiff but good cornering ride. Rear dropped noticably, the front not so much. If I had it to do over, I'd get whatever gave me a somewhat softer ride and more drop in the front.

Originally had Konis/H&R's
Ride was firm but I didn't like the raked look I got from the springs. the rear end just sat too high for my tastes.

Now running Konis/GC's
Extremely firm ride,every little bump,crack,and pebble is felt with this setup. I love this setup.

why not give Spax and Eibachs a try?

or even B+G springs?

Originally posted by DemonSVT:

However you said big drop and soft ride. (good luck!)

II hear you... we ALL want it ALL, isnt it?

By the way, thanks for putting the time into your answer. It is really useful. I appreciate that.

Originally posted by RyeLou:
I have BAT struts and an Eibach kit sitting next to me right now. I plan on getting it in finally in the next few days.

Please, let us know what u think about the setup.

Also, what made you chose BAT Struts + Eibach over BAT KIT ??

how much for your setup? I think BAT kits costs approx $600.

Again... let me know what you think once you install the new suspension !!

Later

BB

Demonsvt you said
"I personally love the Bilsteins but they do transfer ever transition and bump directly to you. No compromise. I am sure some would not like them. "

That is the combo I was considering of which BAT is out of stock spring as well. Is the ride really that harsh. I drive here in NYC where even the milled and repaved roads are bumpy (fixed on the cheap with lowest bidder contract).

And I have read that the KONI softest setting really is not that soft. I thought that the spring determins how soft the ride is more so than the strut?

My only problem with an adjustable rebound strut like KONI is that I will muck thing up.

Demonsvt which set up absorbs bumps the best and the worst.

Originally posted by contour_phoenix_when:
Demonsvt which set up absorbs bumps the best and the worst.

Either BAT springs or Eibachs.

BAT springs are a progressive spring that's main goal is eliminating that horrid lift & dive associated with any stock spring (yes even SE & SVT)
They do this very well.

They are a nice set the greatly improves all the good aspects of the stock setup while retaining nice ride quality. They give a moderate drop (about 1") and give a very solid feel to the car's handling.

Eibachs are a drop spring that focuses of maintaining maximum ride quality. However their trade off is performance.

They give a nice ride quality. Even when loaded. Their compromise is that initial feel is soft though. (something I despise but I am trying to be objective here.

)

Their drop is in the 1.5" range. The still exhibit a little lift and dive from what I have seen or felt driving. It is minimal but there because they cater to ride quality.

They would be the best choice for wanting the most drop and saving the most ride quality.

Strut wise I would recommend Koni's because you can set them to soft and they can handle lowering springs.

Otherwise a Euro strut and change them fairly often comparably.

That's all keeping your goal in mind of the most drop and the softest but capable strut.

Spax are pretty good. On good roads, it's almost like a stock ride, and they perform well.

I have the Koni/Eibach combo, since my SVT is a daily driver and has been for the last 55-months I've owned it, I wanted better performance without sacrificing ride quality. I have had this set-up for 23-months now.

Bay Area of Cali was rated 2nd worst in the nation for road quality. Its a rough world out here and I haul clients around every so often.

Konis on soft and Eibachs gives me a nice drop, front could be a 1/4inch lower for my taste. Ride is controlled with lift and dive noticeably reduced. They do firm up when going into a corner hard, thats the progressive nature of the spring.

its a great all-around choice and you can always give the Koni's a twist for a firmer rebound, and track days if your so inclined.

All in all its a great set-up with no bounciness and a comfortable ride.

Thanks again for the post Demon !!

Everything is clear.. I just want to ask you two things:

I am buying the BAT struts... (want to keep costs low and it seems BAT struts are the best deal for the buck) i am just debating on which springs to buy.

1. Either Eibach OR BAT springs will almost ride the same way? BAT would be a little more towards performance, is that it? And eibach would have a nicer drop, correct? So basically is a compromise between a greater DROP versus a bit better performance ?

2. Which one would you recommend for a daily driver? (no races or anything like that)

Thanks again

BB

If cost is a worry for you, why not buy the Spax struts? They're a little cheaper, and AFAIK are built to the same specs as the BAT and Bilstein struts. I and others that use them have yet to find anything wrong with them. I'm sure the BAT struts are good too, but they just cost a bit more.

Originally posted by Kremithefrog:
If cost is a worry for you, why not buy the Spax struts?

Cost is indeed a worry.

I didnt know about these Spax struts actually.

Who sells them? how much??

Are you running them with what springs?

Originally posted by BBorges:

Originally posted by RyeLou:
I have BAT struts and an Eibach kit sitting next to me right now. I plan on getting it in finally in the next few days.

Also, what made you chose BAT Struts + Eibach over BAT KIT ??

how much for your setup? I think BAT kits costs approx $600.

When I purchased them they didn't have the BAT springs available. They were sold out everywhere I checked. I have a friend who loves his Eibach Pro Kit (although it is on a different car..) but it at least made me feel comfortable that I was buying a quality product. I don't take my car to any tracks so I was looking for something that gave me a small drop but would keep the ride quality close to stock. I drive ~30k a year between work/school/personal, so I didn't want to have something too over the top. All of the above, and my CSVT has over 115k now on the original suspension, so I figured anything I got was going to feel better than what I'm now used to.

Originally posted by BBorges:

Originally posted by Kremithefrog:
If cost is a worry for you, why not buy the Spax struts?

Cost is indeed a worry.

I didnt know about these Spax struts actually.

Who sells them? how much??

Are you running them with what springs?

BAT sells them. They are $87.50 rear and $97.50 front.

I'm running them with roush springs, about equal or a little less to BAT springs in drop and probably close in performance as well.

Originally posted by Kremithefrog:
I and others that use them have yet to find anything wrong with them. I'm sure the BAT struts are good too, but they just cost a bit more.

I have issues with them. I had the Spax struts installed for a little over 10 months and 7000 miles. Something about the ride didn't feel right. When I took them off to install the replacement SVT stockers, each rear Spax strut had rust pits on the rods. While the pits are in the area where the rubber bumper sits and do not come in contact with the inner seals of the strut, it certainly shows a lack of quality of their hardening process. The original SE struts went through 6 winters and 60,000+ miles and the rods still look new. The paint quality of the originals also look much better than the Spax. If you look at them side by side, the Spax struts have more rust on them, they look like the 6 year old struts.
The front struts, when you compress the rod of each, one of them will go to full extension 2X faster than the other. I sent these back (the two fronts) to Bat about 2 months ago and have yet to hear from them.

no problems with my spax struts .I,am running a very
xtreme set-up.Spax and intrax springs.This is a weekend car
and performance comes before comfort.Lets say!don,t try
to drink coffee and drive with these springs

I like the bat struts but I feel as if they do not have enough rebound dampening. I would love to be able to tweak the suspension with adjustable struts. But for now I will be concentrating on finding a stiffer spring for the rear while retaining the roush springs on the front.

Originally posted by RyeLou:
I have a friend who loves his Eibach Pro Kit (although it is on a different car..) but it at least made me feel comfortable that I was buying a quality product.

I agree the quality is very good on the Eibach products. That's why I can recommend them even though I don't like them myself compared to the other options for our platform.

I even put an Eibach Pro-Kit (struts & springs) on the wife's 02 Z24.

Completely transformed the car from the typical GM body roll 4x4 machine to a taut handling sedan. (Well light years better then a GM product

)

Now the Z24 was much worse off in the handling department then any Contour so it was a much more dramatic change.

Also the rated drop was 1.5 & 1.7"

I got a good 2" drop. Actually a little more. (the wheel gaps were 3.5" & 4" and are now 1.3" and 1.8") (oops

The blackeye is because it's not my ride)

It sits noticeably lower then my SVT with H&R's and Bilsteins.

That irks me a bit now...

The best thing about it is it actually handles and rides better the more weight you put in it. That normally is backwards of what a performance lowering spring does.

H&R's over Eibach springs anyday. I HATE the "dead body in the trunk" look All the Eibach equipped car have.
But GC's on Koni rule ALL.

Either BAT or H&R. Dislike the sagged arse look as well.

No rust in georgia, so I won't have that problem.

My '95 SE has 137,000 miles on it (EEK!) and I was thinking of getting new struts and springs. Obviously, the life left in this car is limited, although it IS doing quite well. Tire Rack has KYB shocks for a really good price ($55 each, I think) and was thinking of pairing those with H&R springs. Does anyone have any experience with the KYB's, especially when paired with lowering springs? Thanks for any info!

~Steve

KYBs are essentially stock replacements, not meant for lowering springs. Try Spax, Bilstein, or Koni, you can find them at batinc.net. If you're going H&R, I would say the latter two, not Spax.

Hey I emailed sp motorsports and checkout the response I got from them. Notice how they rank the stiffest to softest springs some what different demonsvt's ranking.

And for the best ride in NYC they recommend the bat kit.

Boy sometimes I wish I could try all the spring strut combinations out there myself on my car before purchasing.
But the question remains who would pay for all those installs?

here is the response below

"Q1. Are all the below kits in stock?

A1. We have the Bilstein struts, H&R springs, and Eibach springs in
stock. We don't have the BAT springs, but should have them by late next
week.

Q2. Which of the below springs offers the least sporting rate? If I am
correct the H&R spring is the most sporty and the Eibach is the least
sporty and the BAT spring is in between correct? I live in NYC the land
of potholes.

A2. As a rule, the "shorter" the spirng, i.e., the lower it drops the
vehicle, the stiffer it will be. Since we are only talking about a few
tenths of an inch from the least drop (BAT) to the most (H&R), the ride
difference is negligible (in my opinion), but if I had to rank them from
stiffest (sportiest) to softest, it would be H&R > EIbach > BAT.

Q3. Are the three different springs of a progressive rate design or
linear?

A3. All of these springs are progressive rate springs, as you will find
in nearly all aftermarket street springs.

Q4. I do load my car from time to time with people and stuff in the
trunk will any of these springs pose a problem with a loaded car or
worded differently will any of these springs effect the total weight
that can be put into the car?

A4. If you stay within the load limits of the car as specified by Ford,
you should be OK. Of course, the lower the spring is, the less travel
you have to complete compression and encountering the bump stops, but if
your struts are new, you should still be OK.

Q5. Lastly is there any other questiojns I should ask about springs
before choosing them?

A5. The only other thing to possibly consider is the lifespan of the
spring. The BAT springs are essentiall OE Ford of Europe springs,
meaning, they will eventually begin to sag like any other stock spring.
As aftermarket springs, the Eibachs and H&Rs will last a very long time.
I have personally put more than 180K miles on a set of Eibachs on my
SHO and they still have not sagged. We're big Eibach and H&R fans here.

Another point is that we like the BAT Euro struts better more the
Bilsteins for overall ride quality. Again, these are OE Ford of Europe
struts, and will eventually wear out, but the combination of these with
any of these springs produces a gratly improved handling Contour that is
not too stiff.

Bilstein Struts (f/r) + BAT Sport Springs
95-00 Contour & 99-02 Cougar (941-K400B) .... $699.00 kit

Bilstein Struts (f/r) + Eibach Pro-Kit Springs
95-00 Contour 99-00 Cougar ONLY (941-K400BE) .... $743.00 kit

Bilstein Struts (f/r) + H&R Springs
95-00 Contour (941-K400BH) .... $709.00 kit
"

comments please

contour_phoenix_when,

speaking of trying all combinations, I'm going to put BAT kit the weekend after. you are more than welcome to stop by say 3 weeks from now and I'll give you a relatively comprehensive demo... which is to say I won't drive to Brooklyn, thank you very much

. I'm 15 minutes away from Lincoln tunnel.

Originally posted by alex_96GL:
contour_phoenix_when,

speaking of trying all combinations, I'm going to put BAT kit the weekend after. you are more than welcome to stop by say 3 weeks from now and I'll give you a relatively comprehensive demo... which is to say I won't drive to Brooklyn, thank you very much . I'm 15 minutes away from Lincoln tunnel.

Hey alex... are installing them yourself or u paying someone??

I got a quote from the closest stealership and there is no way in hell I'm paying THAT. I can't imagine trusting any of the local shops w/ that kind of job either. So I figured I stop being a coward and do it myself. And then one kind CEGer offered to stop by and give me a helping hand

so I hope it will be fun.

Well... now u have a third person.

As matter of fact, I am also buying my suspension any time soon.. and i have anotehr CEG (Brapple from the CT forums) that offered to help me. And besides him I have another friend that has experience with cars.

Basically i was planning on doing the rear end first in few hours and the front end following week.

Let me know if u need some manuals/help or anything.

bborges792hotmail.com

Later

You did not say what ford was asking for for the install.

Well, I would not do the install my self because I feel ther are other suspension componenet that need to be inspected by a trained eye that knows what to look for to determine what else might need replacing while the parts are out. I have a torn boot on the passenger side axel. So I was planning to replace that one as well during the springs and strut install. Parts alone will cost 1300 bucks so far. CUrrently when turning and hitting a bump at the same time I get a metal rubbing on metal sound which I think might possibly be a bushing on a metal component failing. So I would need a suspension tech guy able to spot the causes of these noises to talk a look at it while the car is both assembled and disassembled.

Actually I was looking this weekend to take the car to a tires and suspension place, FIRESTONE maybe, to determine through checking what else needs replacing.

SO I have asked this question before and I will ask it again. While replacing the struts and springs what else should be check for possible replacement while the springs and struts are off?

Originally posted by contour_phoenix_when:

SO I have asked this question before and I will ask it again. While replacing the struts and springs what else should be check for possible replacement while the springs and struts are off?

Same thing here.

I've been reading about some parts that should be greased every so often (which explains why i have so MUCH suspension noises at 120K miles and I never did any lubing).

so.. what else should be checked/greased while struts are out?

Phoenix, I know for sure the rear sway-bar is something I have to do. I've read the contours have weak swaybars and most positively at 120K miles I need a new one.

Re: price
stadium ford in Rutherford NJ service dept opened the book and showed me the times. for all 4 corners it amounts to 5.5 hours @ $85 per hour. plus alignment $75 flat which I will obviously do anyway. you do the math

Re: other parts need replacement

from my experience, OEM rear sway bar bushings are shot at 60K, same goes for links. these are easy to do. front bushings are probably also shot, but they are PITA to replace and it will take a long time and shop will charge you for that.

I have SVT swaybar w/ about 20-30K on it. Both stock sway bars were rusty. '98 looked much worse than '96 for some reason. sway bar brackets definitely don't age well

somebody else w/ more front suspension exposure will hopefully chime in too
from what you are describing I would take a long hard look at the A-arms too.

85 * 5.5 + 75 = 542.5 for the install

reliable speedshop did mine for $80. look around.