anyone see this? - CEG Archives

somebody buy this thing NOW!

buy it now = $1,500

if I had any clue about turbo...I'd be alllll mine.

Looks like a stock manifold with a adapter and a $30 probe intercooler. From what I have read 27# injectors are not near large enough for the low fuel pressure that the Zetec's run off of.
Just like 99% of every turbo kit there is no good fuel managment included, so keep that in mind.
But that T3 look's nice.

And ya, that manifold is not interchangeable from aZetec to a SOHC CVH (1.6, 1.9 and 2.0).

27lb injectors would only be good for 170whp, but yeah fuel managment is a whole other deal.

I wouldn't go for it. When my dad designed my turbo system he found the stock manifold would not be usable cause then the turbo downpipe would be too close the the power steering pump and AC compressor.

Even then with my new log manifold and 3" downpipe with a severe 90deg angle down to the exhaust there is barely a milimeter of clerance from the downpipe and AC compressor, barely enough to squease it in and out.

I wouldn't pay that much money for a kit that uses the stock exhaust manifold, period.

27lb injectors are rated for alot more than 170 hp....our stock injectors are rated for that.

http://www.rceng.com/technical.htm

Go here and fill in the blank. Actually now that I go back and check the site I see that the HP is at the crank, so 27lb/hr injectors will only support 170 Crank HP.

Stock injectors will only safely support about 150 hp. Seems like the 27s should do more but that's also counting the difference in NA HP vs FI HP.

EDIT: Remember, we got an I4 so that also means 4 injectors.

Originally posted by Kremithefrog:
With a little hard work and determination, it could work.

i agree...that would be sweet!

Originally posted by Seawulf:
http://www.rceng.com/technical.htm

Go here and fill in the blank. Actually now that I go back and check the site I see that the HP is at the crank, so 27lb/hr injectors will only support 170 Crank HP.

Stock injectors will only safely support about 150 hp. Seems like the 27s should do more but that's also counting the difference in NA HP vs FI HP.

EDIT: Remember, we got an I4 so that also means 4 injectors.

Please think about what you are talking about......SVT Contours have 19lb injectors which can handle over 200hp. Every Focus guru has said the stock injectors on the Focus can handle about 175 hp. Now with the whole FI thing.....for example the Jackson Racing S/C puts down about 40-45HP to the wheels which would put it OVER 150HP and no injector upgrade. How is that possible?

Originally posted by LoCoZ:
How is that possible?

Magic

I said SAFELY. Foci running 140whp or more on stock injectors like the JSRC are doing so at the limit of injector duty cycle, i.e 100%. Max safe duty cycle is 85%. I'd also be hardpressed to find many Focus gurus who'd recommend maxing out your injectors.

Secondly, the SVT contour has SIX injectors we only have FOUR. So More injectors more horsepower.

Originally posted by Seawulf:
I said SAFELY. Foci running 140whp or more on stock injectors like the JSRC are doing so at the limit of injector duty cycle, i.e 100%. Max safe duty cycle is 85%. I'd also be hardpressed to find many Focus gurus who'd recommend maxing out your injectors.

Secondly, the SVT contour has SIX injectors we only have FOUR. So More injectors more horsepower.

ANd who blew up their engine.....exactly.

Go read through some of the Focus websites and forums.

Originally posted by LoCoZ:

Originally posted by Seawulf:
I said SAFELY. Foci running 140whp or more on stock injectors like the JSRC are doing so at the limit of injector duty cycle, i.e 100%. Max safe duty cycle is 85%. I'd also be hardpressed to find many Focus gurus who'd recommend maxing out your injectors.

Secondly, the SVT contour has SIX injectors we only have FOUR. So More injectors more horsepower.

ANd who blew up their engine.....exactly. Go read through some of the Focus websites and forums.

and don't forget all those modded SVTs putting down even more power still with the stock 19# injectors.

Originally posted by LoCoZ:
ANd who blew up their engine.....exactly. Go read through some of the Focus websites and forums.

And I am still driving the car with boost, so I know what I'm talking about. My engine did not blow for lack of fuel it blew for too much timing. I've also been on the Focaljet for well over a year so, and somebody point to another zetec cougar/contour owner with a turbo on these board, otherwise I am the resident turbo'd zetec expert and I KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.

Let's look at OEM specs:

Focus has 4 19lb/hr injectors and it's rated at 130hp
Cougar has 4 19lb/hr injectors and it's rated at 125hp
Focus SVT has 4 30 lb/hr Injectors and it's rated at 170hp

I'll take your word that the SVT Contour has 19s(SIX vs our FOUR)and in order to put down 200hp it only need 16s.

Again, go here http://www.rceng.com/technical.htm

Type in 200bhp, 6 injectors, .45 on fuel consumption, 85% on max inj duty cycle, and 50 psi on fuel pressure. These are all conservative figures.

Using the fuel calculator, it says these injectors at these settings will support these crank hp figures.

4 19lb/hr inj= 150hp
6 19lb/hr inj= 230hp
4 30lb/hr inj= 235hp
4 27lb/hr inj= 215hp

These are all for .45 fuel consumption for Naturally aspirated engines. At .65 for turbo engines....do the math your self. I'm tired of doing all your work for you.

Brapple, sorry for helping to hijack your tread, but as you can see there is some seriously good info here, inbetween the BS and namecalling. As the ONLY TURBO'd ZETEC COUGAR on the boards, I'll answer any question as best I can and if I don't know I'll say so.

EDIT: Just noticed, you got a ATX Loc...LMAO

Originally posted by Seawulf:

Originally posted by LoCoZ:
ANd who blew up their engine.....Focus has 4 19lb/hr injectors and it's rated at 130hp
Cougar has 4 19lb/hr injectors and it's rated at 125hp
Focus SVT has 4 30 lb/hr Injectors and it's rated at 170hp

WRONG!!!!

silly kids.... talking about stuff they are compleatly clueless about

ALL Zetecs EXCEPT for the SVT focus has 15# injectors

a non SVT duratec comes with 17# injectors cougar and contour 170hp at crank
SVT contour 19# injectors and that with 200 crank hp

but what do I know.... I was on here BEFORE neco/focaljet or any of the other cougar/focus/ or ZX2 websites even existed.... and been looking at them since their beginnings... I was one of the original member of a Zetec mailing list years ago too.

Quote:

I've also been on the Focaljet for well over a year so, and somebody point to another zetec cougar/contour owner with a turbo on these board, otherwise I am the resident turbo'd zetec expert and I KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.

Quick, catch him! His big head is floating a way!!!!!!!!!

Dude, chill out! If you knew what you were talking about, your motor wouldn't have blown! So

I turbo'd my car, totally custom one of a kind made from scratch system.

I wanted more hp so I took it to the only prefessional tuner who would chip my car and after TWELVE hrs on the Dyno and 50 dyno runs we got tired and screwed up and blew the motor.

I have sinced swapped a used motor back into my car and I'm just waiting for a working chip from StreetFlight to run 200whp at 9psi.

I have been there and done that and know what to do and more importantly WHAT NOT TO DO. Do not cut corners. Do not do things just to see what would happen.

Who else on these boards has a Cougar/Contour Zetec engine, turbo'd on the road RIGHT NOW. The closest guy right now is TurboTom.

My car is back on the road and boosting doing a LEAN 150 whp and 175 wtq on stock fuel and computer

So again untill you do better, kiss my ass.

This kit on Ebay is JUNK and not worth the money.

And 15lb/hr injectors would only support 140crank hp. Once more for the cheap seats. Zetecs have only FOUR injectors, V6 Contour/SVT Contours have SIX injectors. More injectors= more hp.

So you're saying with all (few) my mods, I should get bigger injectors since I should have over 140hp at the crank? I find that hard to believe.

It depends on your injectors.
If you have 15lb/hr injectors. Yes.
19lb/hr injectors. No.
Though I do question you having that much HP with those mods listed in your sig and a ATX. And remember I say safely, i.e. 85% duty cycle not 100%. You can squease more HP by maxing out your injectors.

I still don't buy that our zetecs have 15lb/hr injectors. My injectors on my 2000 Cougar, returnless fuel system are 19lb/hr. I'd lay money on it.

Return style fuel injectors are different but I don't know their numbers. Dude, these ain't my figures, it's the calculator on the bottom of that page I posted and I've gotten a second opinion on the Focaljet forums that supports my assertions.

Do I need bigger injectors? I have a little more than 170hp at the crank. And how often should I change my underpants?

Dude, the atx isn't gonna affect my crank HP. The mods do affect it, I'd think with a chip, UDP, intake, no muffler, optimized TB, I should have atleast 10 more ponies. Soon I'll have cam gears as well which alone can add 10whp.

What are we injecting again? I thought these cars were carbuerated?

IF your injectors are only 15/lbhr you can only run a max of 150 crank HP at 100% duty cycle according to the fuel calculator on the LINK I POSTED EARLIER.

If you have a return fuel line, as earlier model Contours have then you could up the fuel pressure to support more HP. The ideal thing though is to get bigger fuel injectors and keep fuel pressure stock. All my figures are based on 50psi in the fuel rail.

When TurboTom on the Focaljet forums posted saying you needed 42lb/hr injectors to safely run 200whp everybody scoffed at him and now it's common knowledge you need 42s to run that HP on STOCK FUEL PRESSURE.

This stuff needs to be common knowledge over here too.

I wonder how sleeperZ's car or Darrel's even managed to run with the power they had and stock injectors. Granted sleeperZ is upgrading his fuel system (but due to more modifications) and Darrel's car is dead (due to a non-fuel related issue) for the time being. Unless you're right about the 19lb/hr injectors being stock.

Depends on the year model and if it's return or returnless fuel system. I don' know offhand their setups but I said it's doable at max % of the injector. The only problem is wearing the injector out sooner than they should.

I have a fuel rail and injectors off a return contour and the injectors look different from my Cougars returnless-style injectors. Also my Dad's Focus has the same exact injectors as my Cougar.

It would be my experience to SAFELY run 170ish HP at the wheels on a Zetec with boost that a set of 36LB injectors would be needed UNLESS you have the ability to increase fuel Psi

Tom

Wow then I should have blown my engine a long time ago.

121Hp at the wheels figures out to be a little over 150 at the crank on a ATX. Guess I am playing on borrowed time.

Who cares about flywheel numbers most of the time they are made up numbers like you did im talking AT THE WHEEL this is the only place that HP/TQ numbers realy mean anything

121HP is such a low HP number for the Zetec i would not think blowing your engine would be an issue

Tom

cliff note.....this kit is crap

just save up and get it done right, by Tom

Originally posted by 1turbofocus:
Who cares about flywheel numbers most of the time they are made up numbers like you did im talking AT THE WHEEL this is the only place that HP/TQ numbers realy mean anything

121HP is such a low HP number for the Zetec i would not think blowing your engine would be an issue

Tom

What can I say...I have a crappy ATX.