Change of plans - JRSC SVT Supercharger!

will you be using the stock TB or going for a 65mm one?

In normal applications a bigger TB doesn't really do much. However, in the JRSC's a bigger TB does make big gains, so go with the biggest that fits.

the throttle response is a lot better too

Originally posted by d c:
will you be using the stock TB or going for a 65mm one?

I already have a FC 65mm TB. It's just been sitting in a box. I keep forgetting to order a Focus throttle cable.

BTW, I've also been toying with idea of using a 4.6L Mustang 70mm TB. It's the same one that Ford Racing uses on the FRPP intaks manifold. If you're gonna go big, why not REALLY big?

Originally posted by pre98zetec:
what do lifters have to do with it's ability to make power?

I'm wondering that too. If anything, the boost will help push the valves open.

I'm not going over the stock rev limiter either. Is this some old school V8 myth?

BP

Originally posted by ButtonPuncher:

Originally posted by pre98zetec:
what do lifters have to do with it's ability to make power?

I'm wondering that too. If anything, the boost will help push the valves open. I'm not going over the stock rev limiter either. Is this some old school V8 myth?

BP

The down side to hydraulic lifters;

Hydraulic lifters have a greater chance of floating at high RPM's and under high power applications ("valve floating"). The chances of floating goes up with wear on the lifters. this means that you have to back off the power a litle bit at high RPM's. Shouldn't be pushing the Zetec past 7K RPMs much anyway, so it shouldn't be a problem.

I'd suggest solid lifters if you're going big power and/or high RPM's.

I wouldn't even push 7K rpms boosted. It's not just the valvetrain, it's the Rods. The stresses on stock rods, under boost, are approximately 30% more at 3000rpms, even with double the HP. At 6000rpms, though, the stress are multipled so it's not double the stress it's like tripled or more.

That's why I like turbo's cause you get all the boost down low, in my setup anyway, where the rods can handle the stress easier, but the JRSC only gives full boost up high where the stresses are much higher. On the upside, I hear it can be easier to tune a SC since the main power is in the upper RPMs so timing and fuel is easier to dial in right.

Meh.....hit 7000-7500 rpms a lot when I had my car.

Yeah, but you really didn't have any power.

Daaaaannng.

Yeah, the JRSC is going on my daily driver. I'm leaving the rev limiter set to stock. I do have a spare engine but I want to keep that for my big-boost turbo project.

Originally posted by Seawulf:
Yeah, but you really didn't have any power.

So that is why I UPGRADED!

Originally posted by ButtonPuncher:
Daaaaannng.

Thats gonna be sweet, considering the only s/c'd zetec atx contour has prolly been parted out by now

have fun with it!! Can't wait to see it finished!!

Originally posted by Frosty:

Originally posted by ButtonPuncher:
Daaaaannng.

Thats gonna be sweet, considering the only s/c'd zetec atx contour has prolly been parted out by now have fun with it!! Can't wait to see it finished!!

Sweet project.

There was another member on here that had a JRSC installed on his Zetec ATX, but I think he was banned a while back. I think his name was Chris.

AFIAK, Hector's ATX Zetec was sold and is now gone. The guy that bought it used the name image4you2see on the CEG. He hasn't posted in 9 months.

There are a couple Mondeo's in the UK running M45 JRSCs. Both Percybigun and d c have one. I wish mine was going in a Mondeo.

There was a guy with the CEG name "zetectour" aka "ZetecChris" asking about stuff. But that was also months ago. I also checked and he has posted in 9 months.

Originally posted by Frosty:
Can't wait to see it finished!!

Yeah, even though I've been on the CEG 3-4 years, I've never been to a SE-WI G2G. It'll be cool to show up with something really unique.

Not too further burst your bubble either BP, but I think you'll have a harder time making this work than Hector had. The SVTF kit was engine specific and I've never heard of people buying one for the regular Zetec. Otherwise, nobody would have bought one of the regular zetec kits.

A Mustang magazine did a custom install on a Focus of the SVTF blower and had to fab up a whole new intake manifold for it. I fear you'll have a hard time doing the install.

From what I've heard, the intake ports on the SVT are bigger and the bolts for the intake manifold are a little off. The Focus guys have to file out the holes on a SVT manifold to make it fit on a regular Zetec. These sound relatively minor. I'll know more when the supercharger gets delivered. (the pic above is from the sale on the focus forums)

If I have to port my head to make it work, no biggie. I'm already prepared for having to do some weird crap with the accessory drive. The Focus has a two-bolt style mount for the alternator and I think it's smaller. I also don't know if the idler bracket that they supply is going to work at all.

Oh yeah, the SVT Focus also doesn't have EGR. I think that why the normal Focus guys also stay away from it. That and the Powerworks supercharger is MUCH better. Intercooled M62.

It's going to be a fun weekend digging into all of this stuff.

...that's if it shows on Friday...crosses fingers...

BP

Good luck with the install. If you can and don't mind, post pics of the progress, I love seeing that sort of stuff.

The EGR is a good point. Take lots of pics. This is a topic where the more detailed posts the better.

I can't wait to see this.....like I have said before this was definitely in the plans when I had my car.

Good luck and if you need any help....just ask.

I'll defintiely post detailed info about my progress. I have a tendancy to document stuff anyway because of my crummy memory.

BTW, Hector, I found out that the ouput window and bolt pattern is VERY similar for the M90. I doubt that the nose drive would swap over though. Just a possible upgrade option...

Originally posted by ButtonPuncher:
I'll defintiely post detailed info about my progress. I have a tendancy to document stuff anyway because of my crummy memory.

BTW, Hector, I found out that the ouput window and bolt pattern is VERY similar for the M90. I doubt that the nose drive would swap over though. Just a possible upgrade option...

BP

M62 should do you good for your daily driven ATX.

Oh yeah, I know. Just thinking about changing the big boost project from turbo to super. Exploring my options...

Grr anyone run past a deal like this let me know! I been looking for an affordable Jackson Racing charger for so long. Rawr. Mainly to see what it can do in a MTX ;-)

Originally posted by Seawulf:
That's why I like turbo's cause you get all the boost down low, in my setup anyway, where the rods can handle the stress easier, but the JRSC only gives full boost up high where the stresses are much higher.

I don't know if that is quite accurate. I think the JRSCs & other screw type blowers provide full boost at relatively low RPM up to redline - Lower than a turbo from what I've read. So the issue is relatively moot in this case.

The centrifugal SC units have relatively linear boost curves by comparison, so maybe that is what you're thinking of...

Every single JRSC dyno chart I've seen, the TQ is much lower than the HP. On a turbo car, the TQ is almost always higher. The Zetec isn't a good breather in the upper rpms, so in order to have such power gains in the upper rpms you need a FI method that keeps building up. A big turbo will do that as well, but so does the SC's.

Granted a SC is always making boost, but it won't make full boost til the redline. I get full boost at 2700rpms. My dad get's full boost at 2500rpms. A JRSC doesn't get full boost til past 5000rpms. That's why the TQ is lower, yet the HP keeps building.

Actually I'm toying with an idea to get around that limitation...

I'm going to split the manifold in half and plumb it to an intercooler. Once I have a way to cool down the hot air, I'm gonna throw the small pulley on. I'll connect a boost controller to the bypass valve and voila! Full boost at low rpms from a JRSC!!

I theory this isn't efficient because the JRSC draws more power the faster you spin it, but by using the bypass valve to limit boost at high RPMs, it will reduce the load.

I saw a Honda guy do this with a Rotrex supercharger. It was weird because as he would get into the higher rpms, you could hear a bunch of air venting limiting boost.

You also get the best of both worlds, no lag, controllable boost.

BTW, I know that the bypass valves operates on a vacuum. I'm just going to get a large vacuum resovoir and connect that between the bypass valve and the boost controller.

Originally posted by ButtonPuncher:
Actually I'm toying with an idea to get around that limitation...

I'm going to split the manifold in half and plumb it to an intercooler. Once I have a way to cool down the hot air, I'm gonna throw the small pulley on. I'll connect a boost controller to the bypass valve and voila! Full boost at low rpms from a JRSC!!

I theory this isn't efficient because the JRSC draws more power the faster you spin it, but by using the bypass valve to limit boost at high RPMs, it will reduce the load.

I saw a Honda guy do this with a Rotrex supercharger. It was weird because as he would get into the higher rpms, you could hear a bunch of air venting limiting boost.

You also get the best of both worlds, no lag, controllable boost.

BTW, I know that the bypass valves operates on a vacuum. I'm just going to get a large vacuum resovoir and connect that between the bypass valve and the boost controller.

BP

You get no lag......trust me.

Basically it depends on how much boost you push. If you push 10psi, you'll get around 5psi instantly, then it slowly builds to full boost.

Originally posted by Seawulf:
Basically it depends on how much boost you push. If you push 10psi, you'll get around 5psi instantly, then it slowly builds to full boost.

I hit 5psi instantly and was at full boost before 5000 rpms a 7-8 psi.....and stayed there until I let off the gas. Looking at old vids I took I never lost full boost....even between shifts on my ATX.

Boost builds just as quick as my Evo....just not as much.

That makes sense. Boost is just a function of how efficient the engine is. If I threw a 2.4" pulley on, I could probably hit 10psi almost instantly. But then it would explode.

Check out what new toys I just got from Northern Tool...

They had the 750# engine stand on sale for $41 and the 1500# hoist on sale for $90. What a deal!

BTW, the supercharger should be here on Monday. Oh yeah.