Hey guys, I've got a question. I've got a CEG'er that is wanting to buy my SVT throttle body, but I might have a problem. I've got the SVT throttle body and the plate, but am using the SVT shaft with my Mustang 65mm throttle body. I need to know if he will be able to use his stock Cougar throttle body shaft. I've also got a 3L throttle body that I could pull the shaft out of if that would possibly work. Wanted to see what you guys thought. Thanks!!
Mark
3L won't work, but he MAY be able to use his cougar shaft. Can u ask him to measure his shaft and compare it to your shaft?
Yeah, I know I said shaft like way too much.
Originally posted by MapOfTaziFoShoâ�??¢:
Can u ask him to measure his shaft and compare it to your shaft?
in seriousness:
i don't think he can use his SE parts.
a) shaft will be(should be if i remember correctly) too short by about 5mm
b) i don't believe the svt tb has the ledges and other things needed to support the style of return springs the se's use, and the side of the tb inlet would have to be tapped to make the return springs as well.
what if he used his SE TPS?!
The holes on the SE shaft won't bolt the the SVT throttle plate, and they'll be off center. I think you may be able to make the 3l TB work a bit easier since the svt tb, is a modified version of the 3L one.
On a Cougar, what you can use depends on whether it's ATX or MTX.
You need the SVT TB & TB bracket, then either a throttle cable (if it's MTX) or cruise control cable (if it's ATX). Cougar ATX throttle cable is the same as Contour SVT throttle cable.
That's from memory, and I think I'm right
but unfortunately I can't double check it since FastCougar.com (soon to be NewCougar.org) is still down
for the site changeover.
No idea on the ability to use the 3L part.
we're talking about swapping linkages, return springs and throttle shafts, not cables. Thanks for the info tho.
edit: that has to be the first time i've ever seen a newb's first post attempt to help someone, my hat is off to you sir and welcome to the forums.
But if the cable is the same...shouldn't the linkage?!
linkage and cable are totally different pete, remember the SE's have that dual spring\lever contraption and svt's are a single cam lobe the cable rides over with one spring.
I still think the SE shaft is too short. I have an se TB sitting at home in pieces, i'll try and remember to neasure the shaft tonight, perhaps someone has an SV%T sitting around they can measure.
Originally posted by pole120:
linkage and cable are totally different pete, remember the SE's have that dual spring\lever contraption and svt's are a single cam lobe the cable rides over with one spring.
I still think the SE shaft is too short. I have an se TB sitting at home in pieces, i'll try and remember to neasure the shaft tonight, perhaps someone has an SV%T sitting around they can measure.
Yeah, but why is it that the ATX SE's use a diff type of connection and longer cable?! Anyone have a picture of the ATX Tb and linkage?!?!
Originally posted by pole120:
linkage and cable are totally different pete, remember the SE's have that dual spring\lever contraption and svt's are a single cam lobe the cable rides over with one spring.
I still think the SE shaft is too short. I have an se TB sitting at home in pieces, i'll try and remember to neasure the shaft tonight, perhaps someone has an SV%T sitting around they can measure.
I have a SE TB and shaft at home but I'm 99% sure it is a good bit shorter then the SVT shaft. The SVT TB shaft (disassembled and here at work) is 5.745" long end-to-end including the tabs on each end. The shaft minus the tabs is 5.352" long.
great, if you can measure that SE, i'll do mine tonight as well if i remember.
Hmmm.. Strange.. I'm using the SVT(60mm T/B) shaft on my Mustang(65mm T/B)..
Mark
Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
Hmmm.. Strange.. I'm using the SVT(60mm T/B) shaft on my Mustang(65mm T/B)..
It does work but has just barely enough contact to move the TPS. I am also running the SVT linkage & shaft with the plate from the 65mm TB.
The 54mm TB's plate shaft is noticeably shorter then the 60mm SVT TB's shaft.
Originally posted by DemonSVT:
Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
Hmmm.. Strange.. I'm using the SVT(60mm T/B) shaft on my Mustang(65mm T/B)..
It does work but has just barely enough contact to move the TPS. I am also running the SVT linkage & shaft with the plate from the 65mm TB.
The 54mm TB's plate shaft is noticeably shorter then the 60mm SVT TB's shaft.
So do you think there's any possibility of making the 65mm shaft work with the SVT throttle body? Or would that just defeat the purpose of my using the SVT shaft on my 65mm T/B?
And I'm guessing the 3L T/B shaft would also be too short?
Mark
Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
So do you think there's any possibility of making the 65mm shaft work with the SVT throttle body? Or would that just defeat the purpose of my using the SVT shaft on my 65mm T/B?
And I'm guessing the 3L T/B shaft would also be too short?
Mark
It's too long for starters. The 65mm's shaft does not let you install the TPS. Also the slit in the shaft does not line up with the 60mm opening.
The 3L 60mm T/B shaft is just like the SVT 60mm shaft. (not too surprising) The only difference is the SVT shaft is a hair longer on the linkage side and of course the linkage is completely different.
so basically there is no TB shaft that will work with the SVT TB except for the SVT shaft?
Originally posted by pole120:
great, if you can measure that SE, i'll do mine tonight as well if i remember.
pole120...
Well here you go...The SE TB shaft is 5.892" end-to-end tabs included and 5.360" end-to-end not counting the tabs. The SVT TB shaft is 5.745" end-to-end including the tabs on each end and 5.352" end-to-end not counting the tabs 
SVT 60mm TB shaft is slightly shorter then the SE TB shaft...go figure.
Originally posted by DemonSVT:
Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
So do you think there's any possibility of making the 65mm shaft work with the SVT throttle body? Or would that just defeat the purpose of my using the SVT shaft on my 65mm T/B?
And I'm guessing the 3L T/B shaft would also be too short?
Mark
It's too long for starters. The 65mm's shaft does not let you install the TPS. Also the slit in the shaft does not line up with the 60mm opening.
The 3L 60mm T/B shaft is just like the SVT 60mm shaft. (not too surprising) The only difference is the SVT shaft is a hair longer on the linkage side and of course the linkage is completely different.
If I recall correctly that is kind of wrong...the 65mm Mustang TB shaft is shorter then the 60mm SVT TB shaft. Yes...the plate is offset differently then the SVT...shorter on one end and longer on the other. I have both at work and have been playing with different combinations. The SVT TB shaft will not work on the 65mm TB but the linkage plate from the SVT TB is needed along with some minor mods to the TB. I have been working on a custom bored out SVT TB that is ~66mm and had to make a custom shaft and plate from scratch. I'll measure the 65mm Mustang TB shaft tomorrow and post the length.
SVT TB bored out to ~66mm...bearing wells plugged and remachined out and bearings reinstalled in new location.
There's a pic of the throttle body on my ATX car... Hope this helps... If you need anything measured on it i've got two spares sitting in my closet...
"The SVT TB shaft will not work on the 65mm TB"
ys it will
Y@KSVT has it in his car right now...don't you?
Originally posted by 99cougar:
"The SVT TB shaft will not work on the 65mm TB"
ys it will Y@KSVT has it in his car right now...don't you?
no...it will not work correctly, the tab does not stick thru far enough to properly connect to the TPS. Also the o-rings/groves just barely catch the edge of the bearings that may lead to a possible leak. You need to use the SVT linkage plate on the 65mm TB shaft for it to work correctly.
no I don't have one on my car right now
Here are accurate measurments of the SE 54mm, SVT 60mm, & Mustang 65mm TB shafts.
SE 54mm: 5.368" (5.865" end-to-end, tabs included)
SVT 60mm: 5.368" (5.760" end-to-end, tabs included)
Mustang 65mm: 5.192" (5.584" end-to-end tabs included)
They are not interchangable do to the spacing of the o-rings/groves on either side of the plate and the offset of the plates as well.
Here are some pic's of the TB shafts w/end linkage plate and TB plates. In the same order as they are listed above.
SVT 60mm TB shaft (black one) & Mustang 65mm shaft...Mustang TB shaft is a good bit shorter then the SVT TB shaft.
With the TB plate slots lined up you can see how the SVT TB shaft (top) will be too short on the TPS side and too long on the linkage side.
SVT 60mm TB shaft (top) & Mustang 65mm TB shaft (bot) with linkage plates removed
SVT TB linkage plate ready to go on Mustang TB shaft
SVT TB linkage plate installed on Mustang TB shaft
now it will work in the Mustang 65mm TB with some monor mods to the Mustang TB housing around the spring retainer tabs.
Good info Scott!! This could make for a possible sticky?!
Anyway, I'm going to take a look when I get home, and see exactly what I did. I swear I remember using the SVT shaft and having to dremel out some of it to fit the 65mm plate. Maybe I did, maybe I didn't.. Maybe I fugged something up, and that's causing my intake leak.
Maybe I should have passed on that last hit of crack, cause I can't remember what I did!!
Mark
Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
Good info Scott!! This could make for a possible sticky?!
Anyway, I'm going to take a look when I get home, and see exactly what I did. I swear I remember using the SVT shaft and having to dremel out some of it to fit the 65mm plate. Maybe I did, maybe I didn't.. Maybe I fugged something up, and that's causing my intake leak. Maybe I should have passed on that last hit of crack, cause I can't remember what I did!!
Mark
thanks...been messing around with these for a while 
You do have to dremel or grind away the swaged end of the TB shaft to separate the linkage plate from the shaft. You then need to drill out the end and tap it so you can put in a screw to reassemble as shown in my last pic. I'm sure some may have fugged it to make it work but I'm trying to do it right. I just don't like fugged stuff on my car if I can avoid it 
i def say stickie his pics and info...we're never going to get anything like he's given again.
Just for reference, Mark and myself both used the SVT shaft with the 65mm TB.
Originally posted by beyondloadedSE:
Just for reference, Mark and myself both used the SVT shaft with the 65mm TB.
Not saying it isn't posible but it is borderline. The shaft o-ring seals are right on the edge of the TB opening and the tab for the TPS just barely sticks out past the housing...barely making contact with the TPS. I'll post more pic's tomorrow with both shafts installed in a Mustang 65mm TB to better show the differences I have described.
Originally posted by Y2KSVT:
Hmmm.. Strange.. I'm using the SVT(60mm T/B) shaft on my Mustang(65mm T/B)..
Mark
The distance from the side of the throttlebody housing to the end of the shaft where the fulcrum lever sits is about 34mm I think. Shaft diameter is 10mm. This is the important part for the SVT springs to be used.
Obviously the cougar sports a smaller diamter plate so you will probably find that the shaft is overall shorter.
If the cougar MTX uses the same type of TB linkage then you can make this thing work.
Too bad you didn't just contact me to make you a 70mm TB or convert your 65mm over to full SVT linkage.
So what do you need right now? If you have a fully working 65mm TB that you want to keep working but you need an SVT TB shaft for your SVT TB and then you want to put his linkage on the end of the shaft.
Wouldn't it be easier for you to put your SVT TB back together stock then take his cougar MTX TB in trade, then build your 65mm from that?
The absolute best way is to utilize the 65mm shaft and just extend the length correctly before installing the SVT lever.
That is what I do when I convert over the 70mm TB. I've just built two new 70mm TBs, one for Fastcougar who actually has it back already.
Anyway, by having the exact shaft length on the larger TB you get a perfect bolt up without having to bend the cable brackets or have the cables coming out at an angle.
I could have swore that the reason I used the SVT shaft was because of the direction that the SVT cables opened the throttle body. I'm pretty sure that the SVT opens one way, when the 65mm T/B opens another, which is why I had to swap the shaft out.
I guess I'm not seeing exactly what you're getting at Tom. What do you mean by extending the shaft?
Mark
Originally posted by warmonger:
The absolute best way is to utilize the 65mm shaft and just extend the length correctly before installing the SVT lever.
That is what I do when I convert over the 70mm TB. I've just built two new 70mm TBs, one for Fastcougar who actually has it back already.
Anyway, by having the exact shaft length on the larger TB you get a perfect bolt up without having to bend the cable brackets or have the cables coming out at an angle.
Tom, are you making new shafts the correct length ? I have made one but not a real easy task to get the tabs on both ends at the correct angles. Or do you cut the end off at the lever and make a small spacer to go in between...use a long screw to hold the lever on and spacer? I understand exactly what you are saying about the length of the shaft for the SVT spring and propper location of the linkage lever just wondering how you are doing it?
Originally posted by scottd60:
Originally posted by beyondloadedSE:
Just for reference, Mark and myself both used the SVT shaft with the 65mm TB.
Not saying it isn't posible but it is borderline. The shaft o-ring seals are right on the edge of the TB opening and the tab for the TPS just barely sticks out past the housing...barely making contact with the TPS. I'll post more pic's tomorrow with both shafts installed in a Mustang 65mm TB to better show the differences I have described.
Some more pic's showing the differences between the shafts installed...
SVT 60mm TB on top Mustang 65mm TB on bottom...notice the TPS tab sticking out on the left on both. Also they are aligned with each other (4 TB mounting holes) to show the difference in the linkage plates/springs as well.
Distance between the linkage plate and the housing on the SVT TB (1.2455")
Distance between the linkage plate and the housing on the Mustang TB (0.8325") a difference of 0.413"
Mustang 65mm with SVT 60mm TB shaft, spring and linkage plate installed. Notice no TPS tab sticking out on the left. However no linkage clearance issues on the right.
no TPS tab...SVT 60mm is shaft too short on this end.
Mustang 65mm with Mustang 65mm TB shaft and spring(SVT spring is too big), SVT 60mm linkage plate installed. Notice TPS tab is sticking out on the left. However there is linkage clearance issues on the right.
TPS tab is where it should be to work correctly when using the Mustang 65mm TB shaft.
The tab on the SVT linkage plate needs to be trimmed down to clear the TB housing. Some trimming of the TB housing on the bottom tab to the right of the adjustment screw needs to be done as well.
If the 65mm shaft is extended to the proper length on the linkage side as Tom mentioned everything should line up and work the same as the stock 60mm SVT TB.
Hope this helps clear up some of the questions when doing this upgrade
I lengthen the shaft with an additional piece. I actually will weld it on and the shape the new slot/tab myself to the correct angle. Then I'll tack weld the linkage lever on. If need be I make a new thottle stop.
If you host it I'll send you a comparison picture of one I did last week.
gimme an email.
Originally posted by warmonger:
I lengthen the shaft with an additional piece. I actually will weld it on and the shape the new slot/tab myself to the correct angle. Then I'll tack weld the linkage lever on. If need be I make a new thottle stop.
If you host it I'll send you a comparison picture of one I did last week.
gimme an email.
Got it...I have put the shaft in a lathe and drill/tap the end and use a screw/lock washer to attach the linkage lever. Works very good but the shaft is still short as mentioned. I have the tools and ability to make completely new shafts but it is a PITA to do. The entire shaft needs to be turned down do to it being an odd diameter so starting with larger dia. S/S stock is necessary.
Sure I'll host it...sent you a PM with e-mail
Thanks,
Originally posted by scottd60:
The tab on the SVT linkage plate needs to be trimmed down to clear the TB housing. Some trimming of the TB housing on the bottom tab to the right of the adjustment screw needs to be done as well.
Anybody have pictures of their T/B with this modification? This seems to be easier than extending the length of the shaft, as I'm still having a tough time picturing that.
Mark
Not really. Extending the shaft is easier because it DOESN'T require the exact same 10mm diameter shaft. You can use 3/8" shaft which is a heck of a lot easier to get because only the springs ride on it with the plastic bushing. If you don't weld it on like I do and then smooth out the welds then you could bolt it together as scott is doing.
any more info on this. i used the search button. pics would be helpful
This is based 100% off of memory, and is for an SVT application.
The 65mm T/B swap is pretty easy. Once you have it apart, and start putting it back together, you'll see what needs to be ground off.
1. Remove TPS
2. Remove 2 screws holding the plate into the shaft.
3. Remove plate from shaft.
4. Remove shaft from T/B
5. Rotate shaft 180 degrees and insert back into T/B
At this point, you'll have to rotate the shaft as if it would with the throttle cables turning it. This will tell you what needs to be ground/cut off.
6. Grind the tab on the T/B that has the stopper on it. If you are looking at the opening of the T/B, as if standing at the driver's side of the car, the tab will be at the lower right corner of the T/B. You'll need to grind that down, so the cam/spring have enough room to rotate at WOT.
7. You'll need to also cut off one of the cam tabs. I believe this cam tab is on the bottom of the cam, if looking at the opening of the T/B from the driver's side of the car. Otherwise, the shaft won't open all the way.
8. Reinstall the plate, once you know that the shaft will rotate 90 degrees(WOT) when installed onto the UIM.
9. Reinstall the screws that hold the plate into the shaft.
Just make sure you wind the spring around so there's tension. Otherwise, you might get some throttle hang.
10. Install T/B onto UIM.
11. You'll need to bend the top cam tab up a little bit, so it hits the UIM, unless you want to fab up a stopping tab so the T/B doesn't open past WOT. I just let it hit the UIM.
12. Install the SVT TPS onto the newly modded 65mm T/B.
Sorry I don't have any pictures. You can PM me if you have any questions.
Mark