Sunroof Gear Update - CEG Archives

Originally posted by holycowSVTpaul:
Also, this gear is gonna be plastic, not metal, right?

They will be made of high strength plastic resin. Here is the guys website www.odometergears.com

Preventetive maintenance should help increase the life expectancy of the gear as the increased resistance from an unlubed track will increasse the strain put on the gear.

Thanks,
Rick

What type of lube would be appropriate here? Can I just put some white lithium grease on the track?

I would think white lithium would work just fine. Basically something that will stay in the track rather than a spray lube.

Rick

How can I tell if my gear is stripped or melted. My sunroof motor works but the sunroof doesn't move. I mean it will open but then it won't close without me giving it some manual labor. It won't prop up at all. Where are the gears located so that I can check them out?

Originally posted by ABeeSVT:
How can I tell if my gear is stripped or melted. My sunroof motor works but the sunroof doesn't move. I mean it will open but then it won't close without me giving it some manual labor. It won't prop up at all. Where are the gears located so that I can check them out?

The motor unit is located under the dome lights.

Good news, I have the test gear in hand and should have some feedback in a day or two on it.

Thanks,
Rick

AWESOME!!!!

Here is a quick question: Can this mold be filled with wax? If so, a metal gear could easily be made from a wax one. That would be nicer (and more permanent) than another plastic one.

I'm guessing it probably could, but these gears are lifetime warranted anyways, so I don't see the real need for the more expensive metal one.

Thoughts?

Rick

perfect logic buckshot

Let's get this cracking!! The sun's coming out....the lady's are wearing less clothes!!

Originally posted by Chris Hightower:
Here is a quick question: Can this mold be filled with wax? If so, a metal gear could easily be made from a wax one. That would be nicer (and more permanent) than another plastic one.

When I originally started talking to him about the gear we discussed a metal one. The problem with that is the worm gear on the motor shaft then becomes the weak link. Plus he will guarantee the gear for life.

TR

So how long until these things are up for sale? How long of a test are they going through?

I'm hoping to have final approval and pricing next week for everyone. After that I'll open up the buy and start taking orders. Lead should only be about 2 weeks or so after the order is placed.

Thanks,
Rick

So what were the results from the test gear?

Sorry, I got buried this week at work so I haven't had a chance to test it yet. I should get to it this weekend for sure.

Thanks for your patience.
Rick

Well, the first test gear wasn't quite right so the manufacturer is building another one which I should have on Wednesday. I'll update you as soon as that happens.

Thanks,
Rick

Great. It may take a couple of tries before he gets it right. It's a complex little gear.

TR

Any update on this? My second set of gears just went TU. I dont know if it is just because of the lack of humididty and excess of heat here in Nevada but these gears just suck. I am still under Fords ESP, but my deductable is 100 bucks. If I can get a set that wont wear out and has a lifetime waranty then I would rather do that.

Still waiting the next test gear to arrive. Should have more info sometime next week.

Thanks,
Rick

Thanks Rick

put me down for one man i need an addy to sen check or money order which ever u woudl prefer
tim send me a pm if you would

I just found this site. Wonderful! 97 Contour GL
I have had trouble with my moonroof motor gears forever. I have replaced units a few times. Let me ask a dumb question. Is the moonroof the same as the sunroof? Will the same part work? Mine slides back and can pop up. I never know how particular their terminology gets.
If it is the same, I would love to be able to fix it cheaper than the replacement motor.

Thank you.
Bee
97 Contour GL

Originally posted by BeeJay:
I just found this site. Wonderful! 97 Contour GL
I have had trouble with my moonroof motor gears forever. I have replaced units a few times. Let me ask a dumb question. Is the moonroof the same as the sunroof? Will the same part work? Mine slides back and can pop up. I never know how particular their terminology gets.
If it is the same, I would love to be able to fix it cheaper than the replacement motor.

Thank you.
Bee
97 Contour GL

Yep sunroof = moonroof in this case.

Yep, same thing. And as you can read from this thread, it is a common problem. The guy trying to fabricate the gear has some other projects he is trying to finish right now, but he will start working on the gear with some new stronger resins in the next week or two.

TR

any news on the pricing yet so i can get a check out to you or how is it gonna work?

Thank you so much svtcanuk and texasrealtor. I will want a few. I still have the last broke motor and the broke one in greenie. This is such a good thing. Thank everyone involved.

Bee
'97 Contour GL

Originally posted by SVTCANUK:

Originally posted by BeeJay:
I just found this site. Wonderful! 97 Contour GL
I have had trouble with my moonroof motor gears forever. I have replaced units a few times. Let me ask a dumb question. Is the moonroof the same as the sunroof? Will the same part work? Mine slides back and can pop up. I never know how particular their terminology gets.
If it is the same, I would love to be able to fix it cheaper than the replacement motor.

Thank you.
Bee
97 Contour GL

Yep sunroof = moonroof in this case.

Technically, (or, from a marketing standpoint) a moonroof is usually a glass panel, whereas a sunroof is metal or otherwise opaque and matched to the car body.

But, in everyday use they seem to be interchangeable, and their mode of operation is basically the same.

Originally posted by BeeJay:
Thank you so much svtcanuk and texasrealtor. I will want a few. I still have the last broke motor and the broke one in greenie. This is such a good thing. Thank everyone involved.

Bee
'97 Contour GL

Welcome to CEG!

Have you thought of contacting WEBASTO since they are the manufacturer of the roof ?
Webasto offers a lifetime warranty on their aftermarket roofs,
and they are made with the same materials used in the FORD roofs...

http://www.webasto.us/home/en/homepage.html

Pete...

Originally posted by RoadRunner:
Have you thought of contacting WEBASTO since they are the manufacturer of the roof ?
Webasto offers a lifetime warranty on their aftermarket roofs,
and they are made with the same materials used in the FORD roofs...

http://www.webasto.us/home/en/homepage.html

Pete...

I contacted them months ago....they told me I was SOL and needed to fork over $260 for a whole new unit

Now that's how ya keep your profits up. Just manufacture a substandard unit you have to replace several times.

I contacted Webasto via E-mail and got the call yesterday. Webasto has two diffrent divisions, aftermarket divison and wholesale parts division. The feeling was that the aftermarket division was not able to help me and that the junkyard was the best bet. I told him to pass the notice along to the wholesale division in hopes of finding a cool customer sevrvice manager. It probably won't happen. But if they see enough intrest they might be able to help. I need something soon, my 4 year old daughter is getting downright angry at me for not having the sunroof fixed.

I spoke to Jeff on the gears yesterday. He is finishing up a large parts order right now and also has one of our gears at a tooling shop to see what tooling will cost him. We should have an update in a week or two.

Thanks,
Rick

Originally posted by Buckshot77:
I spoke to Jeff on the gears yesterday. He is finishing up a large parts order right now and also has one of our gears at a tooling shop to see what tooling will cost him. We should have an update in a week or two.

Thanks,
Rick

Thanks Rick for doing this and keeping us updated.

Any word?

Haven't checked in for a little while and goodness gracious....sounds like we're really onto something here.

Keeping my fingers crossed that this second fabrication will be the one.

Definitely put me down for one....quite possibly two.

Thanks for the great work thus far.

Haven't heard anything from Jeff for over a week. I'll check with him later on this week and see what's up.

Thanks,
Rick

OK, I just got off the phone with Jeff. Basically we're down to our last test material and after that it's back to injection molding and tooling which is big $$$ ($8-10K). So, basically unless this last material works out and proves to be strong enough we'd need to generate sales of 100+ pieces to get the price down under $100 each.

Jeff and I haven't given up on it yet, but it's not looking great.

Thanks,
Rick

Originally posted by Buckshot77:
OK, I just got off the phone with Jeff. Basically we're down to our last test material and after that it's back to injection molding and tooling which is big $$$ ($8-10K). So, basically unless this last material works out and proves to be strong enough we'd need to generate sales of 100+ pieces to get the price down under $100 each.

Jeff and I haven't given up on it yet, but it's not looking great.

Thanks,
Rick

Got my fingers crossed. Really dont want to fork over 200+ more dollars only to have it fail again later.

Originally posted by Buckshot77:
OK, I just got off the phone with Jeff. Basically we're down to our last test material and after that it's back to injection molding and tooling which is big $$$ ($8-10K). So, basically unless this last material works out and proves to be strong enough we'd need to generate sales of 100+ pieces to get the price down under $100 each.

Jeff and I haven't given up on it yet, but it's not looking great.

Thanks,
Rick

Rick, Just keep us posted on results. Thanks for your time and patience.

Ok what's the latest on this??? It's summer now and I want my moonroof to work. Also, has anyone thought of just having someone machine a brass ring to fit over as an insert over this plastic gear so the worm gear won't slip?? I'm not talking about maching a whole new gear from scratch, but why not a brass slip ring that could be epoxied over the existing gear?? I'm not a machinist but I don't think that would be too costly.

Haven't heard anything for a bit. He was going to work it in as he had time and some extra funds available as he's been doing all the test pieces out of his own pocket. I'll give him a call next week and see if there's been any headway.

As far as a slip cover, there is no room for one without machining down the existing gear first and then it would still be costly to do something in brass, this is a very difficult gear.

Rick

If the gear doesn't work, another option would be to try to fabricate a manual crank.

i had a manual crank (for my power sunroof) and can get pics for ppl that want them... but man sunroofs have to be POWERED

The he11 if I'm hand cranking my moonroof!

Any updates?
THX!

I'd like to know what's going on with this.

I'll see if I can contact him for the status on the gear.

TR

I just dropped Jeff an email this morning. My guess is since this is an out of pocket experiment for him, it's most likely an as time and profits allow type thing so I wouldn't be too heartbroken if he hasn't had time for us yet.

Rick

Originally posted by holycowSVTpaul:
Ok what's the latest on this??? It's summer now and I want my moonroof to work. Also, has anyone thought of just having someone machine a brass ring to fit over as an insert over this plastic gear so the worm gear won't slip?? I'm not talking about maching a whole new gear from scratch, but why not a brass slip ring that could be epoxied over the existing gear?? I'm not a machinist but I don't think that would be too costly.

Machining a gear or a sleeve, the costs are about the same.
Both require setup and blueprints and that is where a lot of the $$$ goes.

I talked to Jeff and he hopes to try a new prototype gear next week using his new injection machine and the harder resin. Keep your fingers crossed.

TR

so any word on the results?

Well, give me the guys number so I can call him. I was an Expediter for 4 years. I can make anybody do anything. I want my moonroof to work. Summer is almost over.

Originally posted by holycowSVTpaul:
Well, give me the guys number so I can call him. I was an Expediter for 4 years. I can make anybody do anything. I want my moonroof to work. Summer is almost over.

LOL ya, mine has been broken for some time now too, I wish I could use mine. This 120 degree weather sucks. I used to keep my roof cracked a bit when parked to let some of the hot air out, but I cant do that now

Quote:

Well, give me the guys number so I can call him. I was an Expediter for 4 years. I can make anybody do anything.

WTF? Have you read the post? This guy is doing us a favor. It's a side job for him. The LAST thing we want is someone calling and harassing him.

Texasrealtor and Buckshot both talk to him every once in a while, if it happens it happens. Mine has been broken for a year, suck it up and wait guys. Either that or put some leg work in and find someone else to make one.

Originally posted by JonnySVT:

Quote:

Well, give me the guys number so I can call him. I was an Expediter for 4 years. I can make anybody do anything.

WTF? Have you read the post? This guy is doing us a favor. It's a side job for him. The LAST thing we want is someone calling and harassing him. Texasrealtor and Buckshot both talk to him every once in a while, if it happens it happens. Mine has been broken for a year, suck it up and wait guys. Either that or put some leg work in and find someone else to make one.

I know the guy is doing us a favor. I have been watching this forever. I was concurring with him on how it sucks to not have a sun roof. If I wanted it THAT bad I would just pay for another POS OEM one

It wasn't directed at you thejms, what holycow wrote just kinda pissed me off. I'm not feelin like spendin 200 on an OEM unit either.

Hey buddy, F*** you a$$hole. Sh!t or get off the pot.

Hey, attacks from either side won't be toleraterd. As stated earlier, this guy is doing the gears at his own cost and on his own pace so unless you want to pony up and buy 200 gears to make it worth his time, then wait patiently like the rest of us.

If the jabs continue I'll ask the moderator of this forum to lock the topic.

Rick

I agree, lets all be patient and stick our heads out the windows to cool off a little. There's no need to call anybody to try to get it done faster, besides he could say here you go and give us gear that is just as strong as the factory one, we don't want that. Let him take his time and make a gear that will last.

And an " Expediter " where I work washes cars, picks up trash, mops floors, and brings me lunch cause I'm too busy to get it myself.

Originally posted by SVTGT350:
besides he could say here you go and give us gear that is just as strong as the factory one...

At the moment, that seems to be the challenge, as nothing he's come up with so far can match the factory gear for strength or durability. He's working on it, but if anything what we're seeing is that the factory gear isn't bad because of its material strength. (Maybe bad for another reason). The biggest potential advantage here is that we might be able to save some money by replacing gears only rather than the whole motor. I'm not expecting a miracle.

Call me a pessimist (sp?), but has anyone else thought that the next weakest part might start breaking after this gear gets fixed?

Originally posted by Bronco_II:
Call me a pessimist (sp?), but has anyone else thought that the next weakest part might start breaking after this gear gets fixed?

Coolant Pump !!

not to sound like a broken record - any updates? This idea sure beats a whole new motor.... THX!

I spoke to Jeff a couple of weeks ago. He has not forgotten CEG, he is just really busy with other projects. He is actually working on a gear similiar to ours, so hopefully he can work out the durability issues for ours at the same time. I'll keep everyone posted.

not pushing, just curious...... any word?

yes...

there is no word.

Originally posted by chikmagnet340:
not pushing, just curious...... any word?

Word. He is waiting on a new superhard resin that he hopes will do the trick.

keep us posted as we anxiously await!

After being reminded of this, I got to thinking and an obvious thought occured to me....If room permits in the housing, why not just make a grille type vent in the side of the housing and splice a computer cooling fan into one of the wires nearby? That's if space allows it though...any thoughts?

Originally posted by JonnySVT:
After being reminded of this, I got to thinking and an obvious thought occured to me....If room permits in the housing, why not just make a grille type vent in the side of the housing and splice a computer cooling fan into one of the wires nearby? That's if space allows it though...any thoughts?

I think I have a headache

Originally posted by TexasRealtor:

Originally posted by JonnySVT:
After being reminded of this, I got to thinking and an obvious thought occured to me....If room permits in the housing, why not just make a grille type vent in the side of the housing and splice a computer cooling fan into one of the wires nearby? That's if space allows it though...any thoughts?

I think I have a headache

Why so?

Just installed the "new superhard resin" gear for the sunroof from Jeff. Seems to be working fine for me. Only time will tell I suppose on how long it will last. Just thought I would update.

Excellent !!! Jeff told me he sent you one to test. Keep us informed.

So a production prototype has been made? I'd be in on this if it pans out. . .

So far so good with the new gear. I opened/closed my sunroof several times today without incident. I don't want anybody to pee themselves yet because I have tested about six different resins for Jeff in the last 6 months or so. This latest rendition seems to be the most promising as earlier samples quickly failed within just a few opening/closing cycles. I will continue to test this gear for the next few days and keep everybody posted. I feel pretty good about this one.

Originally posted by BlackOnTan:
So far so good with the new gear. I opened/closed my sunroof several times today without incident. I don't want anybody to pee themselves yet because I have tested about six different resins for Jeff in the last 6 months or so. This latest rendition seems to be the most promising as earlier samples quickly failed within just a few opening/closing cycles. I will continue to test this gear for the next few days and keep everybody posted. I feel pretty good about this one.

Good work young Skywalker!

Does anybody have a dimentional drawing of the gear that they could email me? The reason why is, I'm a distributor for Parker Hannifin. They special make non standard items all the time and I'd like to send them a drawing to get a quote to see if they could make the gear cost effectively. I could get it made in brass. I'm sure they could do it. They are not the run of the mill machine shop. I'm sure they could do it. Somebody please humor me. Who has a drawing?

send to holycowpaul@yahoo.com

thanks,

Doubt it; it has been tried by many differnt gear and machine shops. Extremely hard gear to duplicate........

Get me the drawing... I have better connections than you. Anybody have it? I'm confident I could get it done affordably.

Why are you coming out, all of a sudden, to make this gear after all of the hard work and trials of the manufacturer? Its been at least 6 months, and now you want to 'steal' his work and his sales. Sounds like what someone tried to do to a member of FCO, concerning his 6 speed trans ideas.

Alright finally some light at the end of the tunnel....at least we can be assured that R&T will be done right.

thanks guys

Umm it's been months, what ever happened with this thread?
Last I heard the latest gear seemed to be working well and that we'd be updated.

I think I'll just buy a new motor from Ford and spray a coating on the gear to help strengthen it.

Why not make a new gear with that program that Brad Noon posted about?

www.emachineshop.com ,suprisingly easy to use

I haven't talked to Jeff since last fall. I left him a message and sent a couple of emails, but no response. Last I heard, he sent BlackonTan a prototype "black resin" gear to test but the track on his sunroof got messed up and he couldn't test it. I'll keep on it now that Spring is here.

yeah my sunroof motor went too, as well as my blower motor so my heat and ac only works on high, but then again i have 21 miles left on my warrantee and it goes for the final free fixes tonight and when i get there there will be 3 miles left...talk about close call.

Just got an email from Jeff:

Hey Bruce,

Sorry about that. I started to write back the first time and got busy.
Then I just forgot.

There might be a new resin I am going to try and also I have another
avenue I am looking into. I may try and have the tooling made overseas.
I am researching a company that a local industry uses. This will mean
that they make the tooling and I run the parts here. I will have to
see. I need to send them a part. Stay tooned. Give me a call anytime. I
am always happy to talk with you.

Jeff

There will be no group buy discount due to developement costs. Please see new thread on common interest forum. A guaranteed gear will be available in June.