CEL on, took to FORD, help!!!!!!!!

Contour Enthusiasts Group Archives

First post, but it's a duzy! I have a 98SE, 2.5 Duratec. I got a CEL weeks ago......Car would start fine, idle high and then die. I took my car to a friend who is mechanic, hooked up Snapon OBD-II computer, codes showed O2 sensors, and IAC. We got an IAC from Nappa (an Auto parts store) put it on and replaced 1 of the O2s......CEL went off. 2 days ago it got real cold, the car would not stay running w/o keeping my foot on gas. Once the car was in drive I could go, and it idled fine. I called friend and he said maybe I should take it to FORD because he really did not know what was wrong with it. I did. They charged me $93.25 to run same test on the scanner, could not provide code readings to me and proceeded to tell me I had the following problems:

IAC *(replaced less than 1 month ago), MAF sensor, UI gaskets, LI gaskets, a vaccume leak, needed new plugs an wires *(done less than 1 month ago). All said and done, $1350.00 He then told me that this may be the start of it. After they did all of this, they wanted to run the test again and said my pre cats may be bad.

Am I getting ripped? Any other car and it would be history. I LOVE this car

CAts may be under 8yr/80k FEd warranty and should be at no cost to you if you are under 8/80 on the car.

I bought this car 8 months ago, because my best friend had one, the mechanic, and I thought if i had problems, he could fix them. Car has 63,000 miles on her.

$93.25 for a scan is the first sign that you are getting ripped. If you still have a cel, get it scan and write down the codes. Autozone does it free so I've heard. My mechanic charges me 20 bucks. Take the exact codes and post them here and someone will probably zero in on the cause. In my view, if the mechanic doesn't allow you to record the codes, he isn't interested in fixing your car. He just wants to make a buck off you. John

Sir, you have been torturously raped!

That's not even remotely funny what they did to you.

Use this site, ask questions, post your data & symptoms & folks will help. This place has saved me money as well as greif & I LOVE my car. You will too if you learn from this site.

The codes I got with my mechanic are the following (and I know what they all are by the list posted on this site)

P1000
P0131
P0171
P1131
P1137
P1152
P1157.

FORD said they tested the O2 sensors individually, and they were all fine. I know you guys are great and have helped thousands of people. They have not completed the work on my car at the stealership, 'cause I told them to stop, but what do I do????????????????????????

Replace both upper O2 sensors anyway, reset the computer, and start over with any new codes that then occur.

"Testing the O2 sensors" may or may not be a valid step depending on what they actually did. Who knows? I do know that removing them and testing them with a torch is, at best, inconclusive unless they are completely dead.

With both upper sensors new, you will likely then discover vacuum leaks and a possibility of defective post-cat O2 sensor(s) problem(s).

Steve

Should I order them from FORD?(motorcraft parts) or just do after market O2's?

Autozone or Advanced carry Bosch, and I believe that's who made the factory ones. Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, I expect it. Any how if you want to get them right away and don't want go on-line. Not sure about the price savings http://www.oxygensensors.com/ or from Bill Jennings???
I've only got 49K on my 98 so-far no problems yet!

Paul
I have the understanding that P1000 means that not enough driving cycles have been completed to give the proper codes, after a PCM reset????? But then my "forgetter works better than my rememberer"!

FORD says $125.00 each installed, FORD also says BOSCHE runs hot and can trip the computer. They also told me that the BOSCHE platnums I put in would run HOT and this was bad. Are they lying to me? I thought all you guys put BOSCHE platnums in your contours

Quote:

FORD says $125.00 each installed, FORD also says BOSCHE runs hot and can trip the computer. They also told me that the BOSCHE platnums I put in would run HOT and this was bad. Are they lying to me? I thought all you guys put BOSCHE platnums in your contours

Who exactly is "Ford" that you are refering to? Is it a service writer at the dealership? Service manager? Or service technician? This would tell me a lot. If it is a service writer or some service managers, they do not know any more about your car than the average person and they make up stuff as they go. I believe you said they can't give you the codes. Ask them why. After all you paid to have them read and they should have wrote down all the codes as part of their diagnosis. Judging from your last post about bosche I am thinking you are talking to the service writer/ manager as apposed to a mechanic. Also let me try to get this straight. Are they telling you that you have a vaccuum leak that needs fixed plus faulty 02 sensors? This would be highly unlikely and basically imposable to tell unlit they fixed one problem and retested it. I think I might look for a different dealer, walk in a say

Man, just a word of advice - forget about Ford dealerships. Just forget about their existence. Contact Bill Jenkins, mention that you are from contour.org and get a discount. Then, find a mechanic or just a guy who knows our cars. Try to locate some other CEGers in your area - u might be willing to post in "Branches" section. Dealerships make more money on service than on car sales, so it's only natural they are gonna rip you off royally....

I spoke to the "service manager". I was told 3 seperate mechanics worked on the vehicle. I am supposed to call in the morning and speak to the mechanic. I told them to stop the work on Friday. Supposedly they have done nothing since then. When I called Saturday afternoon, the service manager said that the mechanics had left and he had no idea what they had done to the car. He said it was not their intention to "rip off" anyone. I just don't want them to "f@#$" with my car. I wish I had not taken it to the stealership. I really had no choice though. I could not take the risk with my 3 yr old in the car. I just do not know what to do. Should I ask for the old parts? I feel like they saw "SUCKER" when I walked through the door.

I really need some advice guys and gals. What shoul I do?

Originally posted by armace:
I wish I had not taken it to the stealership. I really had no choice though. I could not take the risk with my 3 yr old in the car. I just do not know what to do. Should I ask for the old parts? I feel like they saw "SUCKER" when I walked through the door.

You got some good advice in this thread. Find out what they've done to your car thus far. O2s would be a good start.

Post in your regional CEG & ask for a good place to take your car in your area. They might even be willing to offer a weekend troubleshoot if you buy the brew - who knows. This will at least give you a good starting point & you'll be a bit more educated & intelligent when you get the car fixed up properly.

I have to say, I got some good advice here. I will keep all posted when I call the dealership today. Thanks everyone, I love my car, and with this site I will love it more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

As for the Bosch parts, the O2 sensors are fine. I have never had an issue with them. As for the Bosch plugs, avoid them and stay with either the Motorcrafts or the Autolites.

Steve

Well..............The stealership called me this morning! The mechanic, not the service manager, said that I did have a vaccum leak, which caused the MAF to go bad. If the leak is left long enough, it will destroy the MAF. He said he always tries to clean them first. He said the aftermarket IAC was bad and was willing to show me the broken spring. He said with the vaccum leak and bad MAF, it was only a matter of time before "any" IAC would go. Still reccommended to change the fuel pump and filter. He said they ran 2 pressure tests on the vehicle, hot and cold and voth came back under pressure. I told him to skip plugs and wires, that I would do those myself, but now the price of service and labor has dropped to $950.00, down from $1350.00. He said he would get me a printout of codes as well. He reccommended NOT replacing the O2 sensors. He also said they visually inspected the Pre-cats and they look fine. They are also giving me all the old parts. Thank you guys for the help. Before I go and do anything stupid again, stealership, I will consult ALL of you.

Originally posted by armace:
He also said they visually inspected the Pre-cats and they look fine.

That's a good one!!

Why make a joke? If you know differently, explain yourself like a decent person would. I thought we were all here to help, not make fun of like little children do.

Originally posted by armace:
Why make a joke? If you know differently, explain yourself like a decent person would. I thought we were all here to help, not make fun of like little children do.

Easy, dude. Don't automatically assume everything is all about you. You'll stress yourself out doing that. I was once a novice too, so I wouldn't make fun of you. I was making fun of the mechanic because of this: Visual inspection of the outside of a pre-cat determines nothing except its got no holes in the casing. Essentially useless because it shows nothing of the condition of the actual material inside. Considering he's a pro that should know better, I found it amusing. That's all, so please relax, you're among friends.

Useful visual inspection of the pre-cat could only be done if he took some of your exhaust system appart. I would think he either would have to check for debris plugging the main cat or pulled the Y-pipe & checked the rear pre-cat only to see if it was coming appart. The front pre-cat material & packing cannot even be seen from either end so visual inspection is not possible unless he cut it open, then welded it back together for you.

My basic point is that your mechanic was perhaps snowing you a bit, unless he actually did take some of your exhaust system appart.

By the way, good to hear you've saved $400. Feels good don't it!! Let us know what issues you have left to deal with on your car because, you're right, we are here to help.

Correct me if I'm wrong but in order to visually inspect the precats, wouldn't you need to cut open the housing in the exhaust then weld it back together? Armace, I would steer clear of these "mechanics" in the future. John

I am sorry I jumped on you. I have never had the ability to consul others about car trouble. When I called back and questioned the mechanic about the precats, he said he did only look for visual damage. He said sometimes debris puts holes in them. They ran another test and low and behold, no codes. He said they also made the mistake of replacing my battery, and since I did not authorize it, they would leave it on my car at no additional charge............ha, ha, ha..........not like they didn't get their money anyway. But, I got a new battery with an 8 yr warranty. He also told me ALL parts and labor were garanteed for a year. Thanks again you guys, for all of the advice. If I have any other problems, I will consult you first!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://www.contour.org/FAQ/FAQ.php?s=probs&displayid=10

try looking in the faq for your cel codes.
p1000-obd-11 monitor testing incomplete
po131-upstream heated o2 sensor circuit out of range-bank 1
po171-system too lean-bank no. 1
p1131-lack of upstream heated o2 sensor switch-sensor
sensor indicates lean-bank no.1
p1137-lack of downstream heated o2 sensor switch-
sensor indicates lean-bank no.1
p1152-lack of upstream heated o2 sensor switch-
sensor indicates rich-bank no. 2
p1157-lack of downstream heated o2 sensor switch-
sensor indicates lean-bank no. 2
good luck! where do you live at in ohio? i live in wv and have taken my car to astorg motors in parkersburg,wv which by the way i wouldn't go there unless you absolutely had to.

I live in Westerville, Ohio, but have relatives in Marrietta, close to WV. I took my Tour to Jim Keim Ford in Hilliard, Ohio. Do not reccommend that anyone take their cars to A Stealership, unless you know and trust the people that work there! We can all learn from each other's mistakes. I want to thank my best friend Keith M for tellin' me about this site. I don't even know if he has posted here, but without him I would be lost. He is the reason I bought a Tour. He has 2 himself. He has done amazing things with his 97 se, almost turned it into an SVT. He is even talking about dropping a 3.0 into it. His audio is incredible too. May be I can convince him to put up som pics. Great friend for the past 12 years. Saved me tons of money and helped me out of some bad relationships in those 12 years of frienship.

COOOOOOL! Enjoy the car!

Tour de Mace:

I'm having the EXACT same problem with my 98 Contour LX and it is at the repair shop right now. My best friend owns a shop and has high end computer scanning equipment. (Snap On MODIS) This is the diagnosis on my car right now.

I need 2 oxygen sensors, both the upper and lower intake manifold gaskets, and my fuel filter is pretty nasty as well. I'm also having new dbl platinum plugs and a set of wires thrown on since I'm just over 70K now.

So, realistically, the diagnosis you got wasn't all that bad. As for the IAC issue, you may just have to go with what your mechanic is telling you. I had that replaced this past summer and mine is not having problems right now. Hope that helps to ease your mind on whether or not you're getting railed.

Also don't believe that B.S. about the precats unless they took them off the car and examined them thoroughly, which they didn't.

So in the long run, it's an expensive mess and it looks like many contours are experiencing these issues all at the same time, but look at the bright side... at least you can do some of your own work. I can't do anything except change a tire

However, the good news is that the extended warranty company is going to eat it big time on this one!