I'm Pissed at Ford and SVT!!

hetfield, bing bing bing bing...we have a winner.. right on the bullseye!

eric

Originally posted by hetfield:
By advertising, they're turning SVT vehicles into a consumer item that everyone has, not something special that separates you from the rest of the crowd.

They were always a consumer item. I paid money for mine. It wasn't given to me because I'm cool. I'm a consumer. The only way I can see SVT/Ford "selling out" if they turned SVT into a decal/apearance package with no performance advantage. Oh well, splitting hairs.

have you looked at the economy? There are new SVTs sitting on the lots up here in MI... they would be stupid not to try to sell these vehicles the best they can, ie advertising.

OMG people...cry me a [censored] river...This is about as bad as the SVT Focus babies crying because they put Sonic Blue on Mustangs when it was supposed to be exclusive to SVT....whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

Gawd, this is the most ridiculous post/thread ever!

What cave have you been living in? Everyone moans that the C-SVT would have sold more if it was marketed better. Now they are promoting it and SVT is tarnished? What do you think SVT is some esoteric Grunge Rock band that should never "sell out"?

Not advertising makes it "special", yet if a car fails they say "it wasn't adverstised enough"?

Well, I say "don't let the door hit you on the way out" if this make you so upset you are "Done with Ford". Get Real, even other car makes have to advertise their "Special enthusiast" cars. Waht the hell is an S$ anyway

SVT needs to make money for the company, Ford isn't a charity giving away cars for free.

Originally posted by FocusTour:
Gawd, this is the most ridiculous post/thread ever!

What cave have you been living in? Everyone moans that the C-SVT would have sold more if it was marketed better. Now they are promoting it and SVT is tarnished? What do you think SVT is some esoteric Grunge Rock band that should never "sell out"? Not advertising makes it "special", yet if a car fails they say "it wasn't adverstised enough"?

Well, I say "don't let the door hit you on the way out" if this make you so upset you are "Done with Ford". Get Real, even other car makes have to advertise their "Special enthusiast" cars. Waht the hell is an S$ anyway

SVT needs to make money for the company, Ford isn't a charity giving away cars for free.

I know you just didn't ask what the "hell is an S$ anyway"

The ignorance behind the origin of this post just adds to the obsurdity of this post.

-Mark

Originally posted by WorldTour:
The ignorance behind the origin of this post just adds to the obsurdity of this post.

-Mark

the more you know the more your realize you don't know.

Originally posted by FocusTour:
Gawd, this is the most ridiculous post/thread ever!

C'mon now, there are much more ridiculous posts than this one. Don't make me bus' out the links on yo azz!

Originally posted by FocusTour:
Everyone moans that the C-SVT would have sold more if it was marketed better. <snip> Not advertising makes it "special", yet if a car fails they say "it wasn't adverstised enough"?

I personally have complained that the Contour was not advertised enough. Not the SVT Contour, mind you, just the plain-jane one. And the only reason I've complained is that Ford said it stopped making them is because they didn't sell very well (again the non-SVT 'tour) and I maintain that if they had been marketed properly to the right group, sales would have been higher. Then again, its possible that even with advertising that they wouldn't have sold enough. There's also the underlying political issues between Ford US and Ford UK that many believe was the real demise of the Contour in the US.

Originally posted by FocusTour:

SVT needs to make money for the company, Ford isn't a charity giving away cars for free.

You're quite right; they're not a charity. That's why SVT versions cost quite a bit more than their original counterparts. You paid extra to have the privilege of owning a more exclusive car, and that extra price was supposed to cover Ford's overhead in making the modded vehicles.

We just had some service people die over in Iraq and someone has to lose sleep over an insignificant car commercial?

What is an S4?

Keeping talking... with every word on the subject you put forth, you just prove your ignorance more & more.
-Mark

Originally posted by FocusTour:
We just had some service people die over in Iraq and someone has to lose sleep over an insignificant car commercial?

What is an S4?

um dude..I think your taking this a little too serious when you start bringing that stuff up

who said I lost sleep?

Originally posted by FocusTour:
We just had some service people die over in Iraq and someone has to lose sleep over an insignificant car commercial?

What is an S4?

Audi S4, awesome cars. A chip in those things works wonders. I wouldn't mind having one

Audi S4 (or S4/R4 if you get the after market performance package) is a kick ass 4 door sedan. Turbo.....now if you get the inported R4 kit, it turns it into a twin turbo corvette eater ( i ahve seen it done). they are gret cars and highly reliable!

But back to the post....things change, we adapt...now get over it...nuf said.

Roz

EDIT: Focustour...this post is not directed to you...but any one who thinks of rediculous threads like this.

Originally posted by mklaro:

Originally posted by FocusTour:
We just had some service people die over in Iraq and someone has to lose sleep over an insignificant car commercial?

What is an S4?

Audi S4, awesome cars. A chip in those things works wonders. I wouldn't mind having one

Actually I now sense the sarcasim in that post.

I hope he was sarcastic.. if not

Our car is gone because they didnt advertise , yes silly advertisements. GM , dodge , chevy ect advertise the hell out of their performance producs , why shouldnt ford?

Originally posted by FocusTour:

Get Real, even other car makes have to advertise their "Special enthusiast" cars.

You know, now that you've mentioned that, for the life of me I can't think of any current "special edition" cars that I've seen on TV. I'm not disagreeing with you, I'm just drawing a blank. Do you have examples? The one big absence in my mind right now is the SRT-4; I can't remember seeing one advertised on TV.

Um...wait .. has the INTEGRA TYPE R ever been advertised?...seriously.

eric

If you start looking for the ads youll see em. Not only TV but magazine ect. The integra has the benefit of Rice.

Now what do you mean advertised...TV...radio....magazines....I will answer as all of the above.

I ahve seen/heard Camaro SS, chevy extrems, mustang cobras,focus SVT, lightning i ahve seen once....the others i ahve seen no more than 3 times...with the exception of the focus (4 times last night alone.) Now to break it down....majority was radio and magazines....and the cobra was on TV.

Roz

Well, I guess I would exclude car-oriented magazines because they are targeting the enthusiast crowd (the people who would typically buy a special edition car). TV to me is the most mainstream consumer advertising.

I also have to admit that I only pay attention to commercials that are truly funny and make me laugh. Most TV advertising makes me feel like these companies are insulting a person's intelligence, so for the most part I flush out crap like that to make way for my schoolwork

I was talking specifically about the R, and mostly TV. Roz how do you like your headers?

eric

Quote:

No, he's mad because SVT modded vehicles were originally a small, exclusive segment. They weren't advertised to the general public because they were meant for enthusiasts. By advertising, they're turning SVT vehicles into a consumer item that everyone has, not something special that separates you from the rest of the crowd. That part I agree with him on.

Holy crap a business trying to increase sales!

bkent, no offense but I really think your missing the point.

I dont think he is. Without more sales Ford is falling behind in the game. Theyve started to come back , if they can endorse the Focus SVT so they can compete with the import crowd all the better for them. I dont see many Cobra or Ligtning commercials. Advertisements also do not increase production numbers.

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
bkent, no offense but I really think your missing the point.

No, I think you are...SVT is a business. Their sole purpose on this earth is to make money.

If SVT was a business out to make money why do they make all the SVT's in Limited Numbers? WOW..they are really going to break the bank with 10,000 cobras..

I think your right.. they tried to break the bank in 1999 with the SVT contours when Ford produced just under 3000 of them..give me a break ..

eric

Its a business , while I understand you wanting to keep your SVT and other SVTs relatively rare , I do too, you dont see the bigger business picture , and so your view is flawed. I understand why you feel this way but it just doenst work out.

Originally posted by 21psi2300:

No, I think you are...SVT is a business. Their sole purpose on this earth is to make money.

No, Ford is a company. SVT is a team of engineers and designers within Ford who are charged with the task of taking regular production vehicles and modding them. Note that the 'S' stands for Special, as in unique or different. As for their sole purpose:

Taken from http://www.svt.ford.com:

"The Ford Special Vehicle Team was established in 1991 to 'Polish the Ford Oval by creating low-volume, factory-produced vehicles designed for those select few whose idea of driving is a high-powered, passionate experience - not just a means of getting from point A to point B.

In a move to support this spirited enthusiasm, Ford Motor Company carefully integrated the wide array of talent in the company into a small, cross-functional group of engineers, product planners, and marketing people, housed together under one roof with a common mission: to create vehicles specifically designed to meet the unique needs and desires of the knowledgeable driving enthusiast."

The low-volume term is the key thing. I understand Ford needs to advertise their products to keep them competetive, but the issue at hand is if they're advertising SVT cars, will those models continue to be "low-volume" cars "designed to meet the unique needs and desires of the knowledgeable driving enthusiast," or will they become mass-produced mass-marketed junk?

The SVT Focus has to compete with the advertised Si's, SER's, Type-S's and the like... THEY HAVE TOO!

At least it wasn't a "Focus Nation - represent" commercial (for those not in the know i'm making light of the "Civic Nation" commercial.

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
If SVT was a business out to make money why do they make all the SVT's in Limited Numbers? WOW..they are really going to break the bank with 10,000 cobras..

I think your right.. they tried to break the bank in 1999 with the SVT contours when Ford produced just under 3000 of them..give me a break ..

eric

you're sadly mistaken if you think that SVT does not try to make money for Ford. if they were in the red each year they'd be done for.

and your limited numbers argument is faulty.

Originally posted by DimitriPopov:
Its a business , while I understand you wanting to keep your SVT and other SVTs relatively rare , I do too, you dont see the bigger business picture , and so your view is flawed. I understand why you feel this way but it just doenst work out.

were're talking SVT not FORD.

Originally posted by bigMoneyRacing:

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
If SVT was a business out to make money why do they make all the SVT's in Limited Numbers? WOW..they are really going to break the bank with 10,000 cobras..

I think your right.. they tried to break the bank in 1999 with the SVT contours when Ford produced just under 3000 of them..give me a break ..

eric

you're sadly mistaken if you think that SVT does not try to make money for Ford. if they were in the red each year they'd be done for.

and your limited numbers argument is faulty.

why is my limited numbers argument faulty? I believe SVT's #1 priority wasn't profit.

As an aside, the SVT webpage is pretty darn cool... you can compare up to three different SVT vehicles. Lots of juicy info!

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
I was talking specifically about the R, and mostly TV. Roz how do you like your headers?

eric

The headders were great up until they got stolen....i was changeing the gaskets in my yard and someone snuck into my back yard and stole them while i went to pick up lunch.

But since im going with the turbo they come with heardders so it was 600 dollars wasted n-e-ways. For n/a cars and if your not going forced induction or if your just going to use Nitrous...they are great.

Roz

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:

why is my limited numbers argument faulty? I believe SVT's #1 priority wasn't profit.

Unfortunately I don't think we'll ever know the numbers for sure. As I stated before, SVT's are sold at a premium that should cover the overhead of the specialized parts that went into the ~4000 vehicles made in a given year ('99 Cobra SVT production was 4000+ for example), but 4000 vehicles in a year is a small number; maybe they made money, maybe they lost money.

If anyone can produce financials for SVT in a recent fiscal year I'll buy all that person's drinks at the national meet (if he/she's over 21 of course

). No, I'm not kidding.

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
why is my limited numbers argument faulty? I believe SVT's #1 priority wasn't profit.

Of course! That's why the 1999 and 2000 SVT's weren't decontented as compared to the '98s and ever earlier Contours...

Its a tricky thing to discuss SVT's #1 priority, because ultimately it all comes back to making a profit.
The best way I've heard it put, is that SVT's existence is to "Polish the Ford Oval." And SVT does whatever is necessary at a given time to "polish the oval" or make it look better. Part of that is making great cars in somewhat limited numbers, and part of that is making profit on those cars. The bottom line is that if SVT isn't good for Ford's bottom line, SVT goes away. I don't think any of us want that to happen.

Originally posted by Rara:
The bottom line is that if SVT isn't good for Ford's bottom line, SVT goes away. I don't think any of us want that to happen.

Well put. I didn't like seeing the Focus commercial on TV, but like I said in my first post, just be happy SVT is still making cars for us to buy

Ok, I really need to find something to do here at work and stop feeding this thread.

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
If SVT was a business out to make money why do they make all the SVT's in Limited Numbers? WOW..they are really going to break the bank with 10,000 cobras..

eric

It is about making money. As Rara states, it adds polish to the whole company.

We are not talking about huge direct profits off of SVTs. Its about advertising the best product you have in that particular model and hoping, if nothing else, that people will be more interested in the model.

Its not about selling FSVTs, only 4788 were made in 2002. Its about giving people a more positive feeling about the Focus (and Ford in general) and maybe, just maybe they might buy an SVT or one of the many other Focus configurations.

By the way, has anyone happened to see the Dodge PVO commercial with ALL THREE of their products in the SAME commmercial? Damn you PVO!!!! Your now dooomed!

Ever think that the reason why you are starting to see more SVT Advertising is because FoMoCo as a whole has taken notice of the SVT product line and is pushing it forfront.

The fact is the more profit SVT makes, more money is able to be reinvested in future products.
Profit is #1 because bigger profit allows for better future products.

-Mark

Just because they advertise the FSVT, that doesn't diminish the "uniqueness" or the "exclusiveness" of the FSVT. They still only produce limited numbers of these vehicles. IMO, the only bad thing that might come from advertising them is that they might be harder to find if you're in the market for one because more people know about them and buy them.

Now if they started to produce SVT models in a lot higher volumes... that would be a different story!

Ok--here's my take on the subject... The FSVT is obviously not targeted at the same people that buy the Cobra or Lightning (V8 american muscle) yet the SVT fans are the ones that know about it. Ford/SVT know that many car "enthusiasts" are, for lack of a better term, narrow minded (i.e. someone that hates Hondas just because they are Hondas, or a Ford fan hating Chevy's for no reason...). They are aiming this car at import tuners. Primarily they only look at imports, even though this car is targeted at that niche. These people wouldn't look at Fords products enough to discover the FSVT, so if Ford advertises it, they get their word across, and these cars wont sit on lots and sell for $15K like they have been.

I say let them advertise....right now the economy needs all the help it can get...and look at it form this point of view....

People will see the SVTs and go in to the dealer to find out how much they are...they will go...ahhhh can't pay that...and they will go andbuy a GT, regular Focus, Mustang or something or other.......I think FoMoCo is just trying to get people into there show rooms....the more people, the more chance they have of selling a product.

I am pissed at people that complain when a company trys to promote a product that is good but might be in budget trouble and facing possible cuts.

I would rather have something mass produced and mass marketed as long as it is good...heck it isn't like the build quality of the contour was any better because it was limited production, it isn't like the resale was any better because it was limited production, it isn't like I got any better factory service because it was limited production!

Look at the S4, M3, S2000, Z4, RX8, 350Z...all of these are mass produced, mass marketed cars but yet I still have a good deal of respect for them and their resale is far better than the contour and I would bet any SVT.

I really get turned off when I hear people [censored] and moan about how SVTs won't be for *enthusiasts* only anymore, really who cares, I could care less if everyone and their brother had the same car as I did as long as it was made well. If you are only interested in SVT because of the *exclusivity* factor then I suggest you save up and buy a ferrari or something truly exclusive.

Advertising != not for enthusiasts

(before some idiot comments, != means not equal to)

This is the stupidest thread in history of CEG.

yeah...I'm fairly certain that the M3 is a limited production car...don't you think?

limited production yes, but the comment was mass marketed... which it is.

-Mark

Maybe I don't watch enough TV...(which probably is a good thing)...but i don't think I have EVER seen a commercial for BMW's M series production line. Wouldn't that be the equivalent to our SVT? And I have never seen a SVT specific commercial...i have seen the FSVT used in FORD commercials...that is much different. I believe they are using the top-end products to bolster sales in all configurations of the cars.

The bottom line here is that as long as production numbers don't go up (which i personally think they will) then we should be happy that more people know about SVT. Higher resell values and more hot girls knowing we are driving the cream of the crop!

Fletcha:

What is your take on the PVO Nascar commercials? The ones with the Viper, Truck, and Neon.

Um its Flecha not Fletcha first of all,

Was dodge taking a stance about not marketing those cars to begin with? Just asking, do they state that somewhere?

I'm just thinking in the past to see if I remember a Type R commercial or an M3 commercial.. can't seem to think of one or Impala SS or WS6 commercials.. you get my drift.

But if you stating your about something then stick with it, if you don't then don't state it at all.

sellouts

eric

This is stupid, but I must say the S4's are SWEET!!! I almost bought one but am scared if the twin turbo's go. Are they ever fast though, WOW!!!!

Just because they are advertising it doesn't mean it isn't exclusive, just hopefully better known. Does the fact that BMW sells a zillion M3s make the car any less appealing?

Not to me but maybe to some.

The question is whether Ford will make more of the SVT product line due to higher demand or whether they will hold the line on production. This is the issue that makes it "exclusive".

Heck I wish Ford had upped the marketing ante on the SVTC then maybe they wouldn't have had to dump the price just to move them off of the lots, maybe my resale value wouldn't be d!ck like it is now.

It should also be noted that the development costs of the SVT line is not solely recouped by the sale of the SVT vehicles. It isn't quite so black and white. Ford on the whole benefits from the research efforts of SVT when they apply concepts and methods to other platforms and vehicles. They also utilize SVT as "halo" cars, not necessarily intended to be profitable on their own.

On top of which as a Ford shareholder I have no issue with my company promoting any of their products or doing whatever it takes to sell more cars.

J1MO

Like I said if I wanted exclusive I wouldn't be driving a Ford in the first place, or at least not a current production model...I would opt for either a very expensive and rare car or I would buy something vintage and fix it up.

I do agree though that Ford was stupid for saying they would never market SVT, why any company would make such a claim is beyond me...in the end it is all about making money and offering a good product.

Buying a Ford for exclusivity is almost like buying a Rolex watch for exclusivity...sure a Rolex is nice but tons of people have them and they market the bag out of them, thus they are not "exclusive" however many still relate them with being *quality* items.

I would rather have ford market them, sure exclusivity is nice, but I like it when people recognise something as nice if they are an enthusiast or not...maybe then the resale wouldn't suck nuts like it does now.

Tons of people have Rolex's

where do you live Beverly Hills off Rodeo Drive? Tons is quite a but, I live a hop skip and a jump from Naples, FL and I don;t see that many Rolex's. Naples, FL highest per capita Millionaires in the country.

eric

Ford SVT simply changed their mind and policy for a buck=sellouts..

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:

Ford SVT simply changed their mind and policy for a buck=sellouts..

Want me to call you a whambulance?

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
Naples, FL highest per capita Millionaires in the country.

I suppose that has nothing to do with the amount of cocaine there either.

cocaine is everywhere except Atlanta. Naples not Miami.

unfortunately no, and naples is the cocaine capital of america.

Originally posted by ATL-SVT:
unfortunately no, and naples is the cocaine capital of america.

LMAO

please elaborate, where did you get your info from?

nevermind, I know your messin with me, time to get off work anyways..1/2 days on fridays..

http://www.geocities.com/grantorino.geo/heroin072900.htm

just playin man, that statement was based on nothing.

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
Tons of people have Rolex's where do you live Beverly Hills off Rodeo Drive? Tons is quite a but, I live a hop skip and a jump from Naples, FL and I don;t see that many Rolex's. Naples, FL highest per capita Millionaires in the country.

eric

Ford SVT simply changed their mind and policy for a buck=sellouts..

Hey Eric,

Watches are another hobby of mine and Rolex is one of the brands which I like, but when compared to other high end watch brands Rolex is pretty pedestrian, they are one of the largest if not the largest luxury watch producers in the world making about 800,000+ watches/year and they sell out of every single watch every year. They are sold in many malls and other fine jewelers in the world, but there are many other brands for the same or more money that are far more "exclusive" than Rolex could ever be, I am talking brands that produce maybe 100,000/year and only sell half of them because of a lack of recognition.

Sure they are not as common as a Timex or a casio but they are very popular and relatively speaking "all over the place". Many people who are into watch collecting often refer to them as the Lincoln or Caddilac of watches simply because of who the popular models appeal to and the sheer volume they sell (others refer to them as the Mercedes of Watches but that is because of their unchanging and dated design).

Also they did a few surveys that even if people are millionaires the last thing they usually spend money on is a high end watch or other luxury personal items, generally it is people who are not millionares who are into that sort of stuff either because they just like them or they want to put off an image of being more successful than they are. I have heard that many millionares wear rather cheap accessories but have nice houses, decent cars and have alot of money invested and or in other things. Also it depends on how people in your area prioritize things, here on the upper east coast nice watches are everywhere, especially in Boston, New York and Conneticut, whereas when I was living in DC seeing anything other than a Timex was a rarity (Although DC especially Tysons corner had some really high end shops, most likely from the tech boom).

Like I said with Ford, I have no problem with them selling out as long as the quality is the same, however I can see how some might since they publicly stated they wouldn't (how stupid was that?!)..but for all these people who post on here saying they bought a Ford for its exclusivity, well they really need to get a grip...the base of the car is still a contour, we are not talking about a rare shelby or a ferrari here but instead a pretty low budget econo car, sure it is nice that they added some performance to it and made it in limited numbers, but I would be more concerned with performance for the money than any level of exclusivity.

i ran across this post from way back, doing my required newbie searches. i saw an SVT focus commercial yesterday.

Originally posted by bigMoneyRacing:

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
If SVT was a business out to make money why do they make all the SVT's in Limited Numbers? WOW..they are really going to break the bank with 10,000 cobras..

I think your right.. they tried to break the bank in 1999 with the SVT contours when Ford produced just under 3000 of them..give me a break ..

eric

you're sadly mistaken if you think that SVT does not try to make money for Ford. if they were in the red each year they'd be done for.

and your limited numbers argument is faulty.

It has been said in interviews with John Colleti that SVT was supposed to make fun cars and not lose money. Which is not the same as MAKING money..directly. I believe SVT was supposed to be a HALO brand..so that plain jane Mustang, F150, Contour, Focus owners could have a bit better performance impression of there cars...polish the oval as Rara said. So the goal is really Ford TOTAL profit more than direct SVT profit...ie. SVT could break even or lose money if it's "image" help Ford increase profits overall..

I totally disagree with you! I wish Ford did more SVT commercials to show off the lightning and Cobra. I want everybody to know just how bad a$$ SVT vehicles are and to beware if they see one on the road. I think Ford should show off their SVT's and brag, it's something the company is very proud of. It makes regular Ford owners feel proud and special to be associated with such an elite vehicle team. Also, I hear Ford is having trouble selling all the Focus SVT's, so doesn't it make sense to advertise? Ford SVT is always going to be a limited production elite group, no matter if it's advertised nationwide or not! And SVT vehicles aren't that difficult to aquire, you don't have to be a VIP or somebody special. BTW: I AM SICK AND TIRED OF PEOPLE WHINING AND COMPLAINING ABOUT THEIR CARS, PROBLEMS, AND PERFORMANCE ON THIS SITE. ITS CONTOUR ENTHUSIAST SITE NOT FOR CRYERS AND WHINERS WHO REGRET BUYING THEIR CAR AND ABSOLUTELY HATE FORD. ARENT HAPPY? DONT LIKE FORD? SELL UR CAR, BUY SOMETHING ELSE, AND GET OUT!!!
I'M SICK OF THIS $HIT. THESE THREADS ARE FILLED WITH 70% FORD HATERS AND 30% REAL SVT ENTHUSIAST WHO WANT TO LEARN MORE AND SOLVE PROBLEMS THEY ARE EXPERIENCING.
I WISH ALL THE MOLES IN HERE WOULD LEAVE!

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
oh yea since I'm done with FORD, S4 I here ya and comin your way.. that's what I'll get when I actually saw an S4 beat the livin Krapola out of a SC lightning with just a chip!

eric

Hey DIP CHIT..How much does an S4 weigh, how much does a lightning weigh? I Have seen near stock lightnings running mid-high 13's and with mod's down in the 12's. What kind of ET does an S4 turn, about 13.4 or so! How many other
production trucks run as quick as the lightning? Very few!!!The S4 cost a few thousand more than a Lightning also
You are just an a-hole who hates Ford.

If you are done with Ford please drop you account with CEG...I don't like listening to your negative slandering bull crap!

I agree to a point. Why bother having a higher end "niche" car if nobody knows about it? And if there is a higher demand than product, then several things happen -- resale stays (artificially) high and there's more, for lack of a better word, jealousy for having a cool car out there.

BMW doesn't whore their M-series because auto enthusiasts already know about them. Ford's SVT and Daimler-Chrysler's SRT aren't as widely known, so there must be some whorage to get the word out.

Why bother being elitist if nobody knows that you're elite to begin with?

Originally posted by hetfield:

Originally posted by Frank Grimes:
Let me if I got this right: You're mad at a global manufacturer for advertising their products?

No, he's mad because SVT modded vehicles were originally a small, exclusive segment. They weren't advertised to the general public because they were meant for enthusiasts. By advertising, they're turning SVT vehicles into a consumer item that everyone has, not something special that separates you from the rest of the crowd. That part I agree with him on.

I think it's just the opposite. I think the "enthusiast" market has expanded, and Ford sees an opportunity to get the word out to the "new" "enthusiast" masses via more mass-market (and expensive) media. It would have been a waste of money 10 years ago.

And I wouldn't be worried about losing your exclusivity. Half the people out there still think your car is a Taurus.

Originally posted by BURNTU2:

Originally posted by FlechaAutoSports:
oh yea since I'm done with FORD, S4 I here ya and comin your way.. that's what I'll get when I actually saw an S4 beat the livin Krapola out of a SC lightning with just a chip!

eric

Hey DIP CHIT..How much does an S4 weigh, how much does a lightning weigh? I Have seen near stock lightnings running mid-high 13's and with mod's down in the 12's. What kind of ET does an S4 turn, about 13.4 or so! How many other
production trucks run as quick as the lightning? Very few!!!The S4 cost a few thousand more than a Lightning also
You are just an a-hole who hates Ford.

If you are done with Ford please drop you account with CEG...I don't like listening to your negative slandering bull crap!

I hate to say it man, but your are an A-hole. Too much anger in your system and you seem to be just lashing out at people. Yes an S4 can beat a Lighting with just a chip, 4wheel drive off the line and the extra boost with the chip and the Lighting lighting his tires off the line it can happen dude. I wouldn't doubt that at all.

Originally posted by Frank Grimes:

Originally posted by hetfield:
By advertising, they're turning SVT vehicles into a consumer item that everyone has, not something special that separates you from the rest of the crowd.

They were always a consumer item. I paid money for mine. It wasn't given to me because I'm cool. I'm a consumer. The only way I can see SVT/Ford "selling out" if they turned SVT into a decal/apearance package with no performance advantage. Oh well, splitting hairs.

mine was given to me cause i was cool. . . .

BURNTU2

I dont know who the FOCK you are but you need PROZAC!

how old are you 10?

Please don't wake me up again! This discussion is so boring!

fwiw, the lightning now holds the world record for being the world's fastest production pickup truck. A bone stock lightning clocked at 148mph at Ford's Michigan Proving Ground last month.