With gas how it is, are you driving slower?

Originally posted by Kremithefrog:

Originally posted by Mystique97:
My mileage has kinda increased since I started putting Citgo in it, one day I was looking for the cheapest gas, and Cigo here was cheapest, filled it up with that, got about 40 more miles to the tank then I did on Sunoco. With Sunoco, I got around 220 on a tank, and with Citgo, I go about 260+, and that is with like 12.XX gallons. So I'm sure I can get like 300 if I go the extra couple gallons. No my driving habbits haven't changed much, just a little bit.

For a zetec, that really really really sucks. You might wanna do a tune-up/make sure everything is working right.

I'm plainin on it. I also noticed a decrease in power too since day 1 of owning the car (or I'm used to the "power" it has). So I'm sure the plugs are starting to get gunked up. It has about 75K on it right now. May also change the fuel filter too.
I still get awesome gas mileage on the highway, of course I do drive strictly city, about 98% of the time, and I drive hard too.

I've filled up once since I got the car back. I've always been a semi-conservative driver (speed counts only in the twisties for me

), but after spending ungodly amounts of money fixing it up and now worrying about the ATX I'm taking it slower than usual regardless of gas prices.

I did, however, get up to 90 today (haven't done so in months, I usually linger around 75-80 with speed limit 65), right on I395 by exit 6 where there is typically a speed trap .. and stupid me, the officer was there with his gun once again .. scary moment as he got in his car and got on the highway right after I drove by ...

im driving like 30mph in 5th gear..yea thats right!

Originally posted by CSVT1214:
I still drive like an idiot too. I wish I could resist, but with a new 3L, it's near impossible for me to do it.

I have been trying to shift before the secondaries kick in. Does not seem to make much difference compared to my usual 5k shifts.

Damn straight. I drive by hardly opening up the throttle up at all, which leads to slow acceleration and hopefully increased gas mileage. I'll find out tomorrow when I fill it up for the first time in over 3 weeks. I also cruise in the highest gear possible, as long as I can do so without applying much pressure at all to the throttle. Usually that means coasting around in 4th gear at 25 mph and 5th gear at 35 mph, as long as I don't have to go up any hills. Basically, I try to drive with the throttle as near closed as possible, and the RPMs as low as possible. I'll also coast in neutral or with the clutch in while going down hills.

I hate driving like this. I know it's saving me money, but I feel restrained and I don't want my secondaries to get gunked up

a few things to note:

driving belowe the "bulk" of the powerband (lower than about 2K) is a waste of time... There is more strain on the transaxle to pull a car that low in the rpm range, and in turn uses more gas.

Also.. coasting in neutral or with the clutch in uses more gas than leaving it in gear and "engine braking" down a hill.

In neutral, you are still pumping gas through the injectors (idling)... in gear, it will actually shut off the injectors and stop using gas at all.. Coasting in gear is the most efficient means of operating the engine that is possible.

You will see the best mileage staying between 2K and 3K (power band and secondary operation, respectively).

Ray

i'm addicted the the sound of my BOV

~Andrew

Originally posted by Ray:
In neutral, you are still pumping gas through the injectors (idling)... in gear, it will actually shut off the injectors and stop using gas at all.. Coasting in gear is the most efficient means of operating the engine that is possible.

No kidding? Wow, that's good to know.

Originally posted by Ray:
You will see the best mileage staying between 2K and 3K (power band and secondary operation, respectively).

Yup, that's where I've been doing most of my revs lately. Shifting in that range through first and second and then if I need to get speed on, using third in the torquey 2K-4K band to get into cruising speed and sometimes I'll skip fourth altogether. Also, when I did my intake manifold cleaning, I did that little pre-98 trick of resetting the LIM throttles' stop to crack 'em open a little more at rest, and I do notice a bit more midrange oomph before they go full open.

Originally posted by Ray:
In neutral, you are still pumping gas through the injectors (idling)... in gear, it will actually shut off the injectors...Ray

This probably doesn't apply to us ATX drivers, does it?

Edit.
Before warming up, in shifting between D and N, the revs go down in D and up in N (which is what you were saying for the MTX). After warming up, the revs "appear the same" (according to the tachometer) except that the engine "sounds" different when it is in D.

Yes, been driving slower and not opening up the secondaries. Shifting early. Not going over 70. It sucks but I was able to get 26.7 MPG on the last tank. Usually around 23. Is it worth it. Maybe not.

Rich S

[IMG]C:\DOCUME~1\atroiano\LOCALS~1\Temp\MXLibDir[\IMG]

Originally posted by SILFROSvT98:
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Sorry, didn't work. Let the flaming begin.

I see no reason it wouldn't apply, though I can't speak specifically, as I am not sure.

You're still in a gear... you're still loading the engine down if you coast in that gear... so shouldn't it still shut off the injectors?

Unless the ATX just lets it "free-spin" when it senses the engine load, etc.. As I said, I am not sure, but I would imagine the same results.

Ray

Originally posted by Ray:
Unless the ATX just lets it "free-spin" when it senses the engine load..Ray

Okay, understood everything you said until this. This went over my head. Maybe I need to get lunch as the old grey cells ain't working too well now.

I dunno.. Torque converter disengaging the transaxle, or something. (not an ATX guy)

Ray

I'm tryin not to let the secondaries open up as much, if it can be helped. I do go above 4000, but not for as long as I used to (don't want carbon build-up). My last tank was about 27.5 mpg, but I don't like drivin' like a grandma to get it, LOL.
Scott

Originally posted by Jeb Hoge:

Originally posted by Ray:
In neutral, you are still pumping gas through the injectors (idling)... in gear, it will actually shut off the injectors and stop using gas at all.. Coasting in gear is the most efficient means of operating the engine that is possible.

No kidding? Wow, that's good to know.

I've been coasting a lot in neutral recently, there are lots of hills around here. I find I can coast a significant percentage of my drive to work (like maybe 20%?)

To add another twist to the neutral question, if you coast in gear you'll go slower and have to get back on the gas earlier. If you coast in neutral you can go quite a bit further and faster. But how much gas does idling use?

A full tank can idle (from full to empty) for about 10 hours. Of course, this was in a Lincoln Continental that was left running at the airport long-term parking.. but still.

Ray

Originally posted by Ray:
In neutral, you are still pumping gas through the injectors (idling)... in gear, it will actually shut off the injectors and stop using gas at all.. Coasting in gear is the most efficient means of operating the engine that is possible.

OK how would the MTX computer even know whether the car was in gear or not? I dont know about ATX but this sounds false to me ...

Originally posted by akrump47:

OK how would the MTX computer even know whether the car was in gear or not?

Maybe .................. Neutral Position Switch?

I'm sorry you feel that way.

I believe it would be from the extreme vacuum produced when engine braking. Has nothing to do with "detecting" that the car is in gear... being in gear creates that drag, which creats that vacuum.

Here's another link, for those that are less than inclined to believe me.

Link

(psst... check the sig... LOL)

Ray

Originally posted by Ray:
Here's another link, for those that are less than inclined to believe me.
...(psst... check the sig... LOL)

Ray

"check profile BIO for AIM CEG list!".

Ok, Ray. What has this got to do with believing you? Now, I am less inclined to believe you.

I KNEW when I posted that that YOU (of all people) would be the one to point it out... I knew it..

lol

Ray

OK I understand now - thanks for the link Ray. My foot is in my mouth

I tend to engine-brake when slowing anyways and now I'll do it even more!

Originally posted by akrump47:
OK how would the MTX computer even know whether the car was in gear or not? I dont know about ATX but this sounds false to me ...

A while back I read some extensive details about the engine computer in my '88 Thunderbird. It determined that you were coasting in gear based on the throttle position sensor, idle air control position, and engine RPM. If the throttle was closed, IAC closed, and the engine was above 1700 rpm or so, it'd deduce that you are coasting and shut off the injectors.

This was also verfied by the instant MPG readout on the trip computer, which would quickly go past 200 and then read "----". If I put it in neutral, it would drop to ~70-80 mpg or so at highway speed.

Another interesting tidbit: evidently the computer could also figure out that you were attempting to push-start an MTX car, and adjust the timing to make it easier to start.

And that was 80s technology (probably developed in the late 70s!)--makes me wonder what kinds of cool stuff our far more modern computers must take into consideration!

Haven't done anything different. Just cost me $42 to fill my tank with regular.

Originally posted by Ray:
a few things to note:

driving belowe the "bulk" of the powerband (lower than about 2K) is a waste of time... There is more strain on the transaxle to pull a car that low in the rpm range, and in turn uses more gas.

Also.. coasting in neutral or with the clutch in uses more gas than leaving it in gear and "engine braking" down a hill.

In neutral, you are still pumping gas through the injectors (idling)... in gear, it will actually shut off the injectors and stop using gas at all.. Coasting in gear is the most efficient means of operating the engine that is possible.

You will see the best mileage staying between 2K and 3K (power band and secondary operation, respectively).

Ray

I have found that shifting below 2K RPMs gives me the best mileage. The faster I can get the car into higher gear, the better. I could be wrong, but I try to keep it under 2K, and it seems to pay off.

I do believe the bit about engine braking a down a hill. Since I live on a hill and drive around a hilly area, I will try doing this more often. Does it cause a lot more stress on a transmission to downshift it?

What I really don't understand is in the 626, when I let off the gas pedal at speed, the RPMs drop all the way down, then kick back up slightly to its idle speed of around 650. It feels like it's being thrown into neutral every time, and I understand the bit about the gears reversing (It clunks), but I wonder why my Contour doesn't do it so abruptly? The 626 will just fall to idle and stay down there as you slow down. I usually take the O/D off and sometimes even put it into 2 down the one steep hill. It seems to really help, but is that very bad for it? Btw, the 626 actually has the same CD4E trans. It's a 99 auto with a brand new trans.

I don't see how anyone can shift under 2k, except maybe shifting into 4th or 5th on a downhill. It feels waaay to much like I'm bogging it if I shift that low.

I shift between 2500 and 3000 rpms, and occasionally I run it to 4k to keep my secondaries from gunking up. I get good gas mileage, and try to avoid slowing down and/or downshifting and such when cruising, and I get pretty stinkin good gas mileage.
That's how I usually drive, and it may or may not be the best way.
-Peter

I don't "shift" because it's an automatic. I should clarify that, sorry. I couldn't imagine shifting under 2K either, but the automatic is much lazier.

No.

Originally posted by Majisto:
I don't "shift" because it's an automatic. I should clarify that, sorry. I couldn't imagine shifting under 2K either, but the automatic is much lazier.

That makes sense, I didn't think about it that you could have had an auto. Yeah with an auto it's alot different.

Originally posted by LocoSCZ:
No.

Yes it is. I think the CD4E shifts quickly, but I mean to say it's easier to keep it at a constant RPM than a standard. I'm not saying it's a bad transmission. Lazy shifting was the old Buick Century.

I don't think that Hector was replying to you, Majisto.

lol

Ray

Originally posted by Majisto:

Originally posted by LocoSCZ:
No.

I think the CD4E shifts quickly, but I mean to say it's easier to keep it at a constant RPM than a standard. I'm not saying it's a bad transmission.

No.

Originally posted by Majisto:

Originally posted by LocoSCZ:
No.

Yes it is. I think the CD4E shifts quickly, but I mean to say it's easier to keep it at a constant RPM than a standard. I'm not saying it's a bad transmission. Lazy shifting was the old Buick Century.

I drive just as fast.

Originally posted by Ray:
a few things to note:

driving belowe the "bulk" of the powerband (lower than about 2K) is a waste of time... There is more strain on the transaxle to pull a car that low in the rpm range, and in turn uses more gas.

Also.. coasting in neutral or with the clutch in uses more gas than leaving it in gear and "engine braking" down a hill.

In neutral, you are still pumping gas through the injectors (idling)... in gear, it will actually shut off the injectors and stop using gas at all.. Coasting in gear is the most efficient means of operating the engine that is possible.

You will see the best mileage staying between 2K and 3K (power band and secondary operation, respectively).

Ray

That's an interesting bit to note about coasting in gear. I will keep that in mind and see if it has any noticeable impact on my gas mileage next time I'm at the pump.

As for shifting below 2k rpm... I didn't say that anywhere. I usually shift around 2500-2750, the main difference being that I open the throttle up less, which means it takes longer for the car to get up to speed. Of course, fast acceleration = gas hog, and that's what I'm trying to avoid. Notice that I said a combination of keeping the RPMs low and opening the throttle as little as possible. Regardless of RPM, you're not bogging down the engine in any gear until you have to open the throttle more than you should. As long as you're not driving uphill, there's no reason why shifting at 2k wouldn't be a viable and effective option in terms of gas usage for the CSVT. For example, there are several streets around where I live where I can drive 25 mph in 4th gear because they are all fairly flat. The engine is running at well less than 2k RPM, but it's providing just enough power to propel the car while I'm just touching the throttle. If at any point I need to open the throttle up further for any reason, it's a logical step to downshift to 3rd first, especially if I'm coming up on a hill.

Totally agreed. If you are only depressing the gas pedal enough to "just get moving" (as in when you take off from a stop) then you obviously aren't bogging the engine by being below the powerband.

Its as you stated, when you try to press the gas pedal too far and you are too low in the rev-band to accelerate at the pace which your gas pedal is dictating. THAT is bad on the drivetrain.

Ray

Yup, exactly. I had just wanted to point out that it is possible to drive below 2k RPM without bogging down the engine, which is the only way to do it if you want to conserve gas. Given your response, I was afraid that I had given the wrong impression with my first post about that particular driving habit, and I just wanted to clarify.

Edit: Apparently my improved driving habits have paid off a little, because this weekend I filled up after a lot of highway driving and calculated 29.6 mpg, the highest I've seen yet on my stock SVT (the previous high was 28.5).

nope, i'm driving the same still averaging 18mpg on my gto.

I have slowed down significantly. Usually I will cruise in to work with the rest of the traffic around 75 - 80 mph. I usually get about 20 mpg. However, I have recently slowed to 60-65 and now get 26 mpg. Of course, I practically get ran over every day.

i would shift around 2K maybe 2500 when normal driving, but then again the 3L makes more power down low then the 2.5L....lots of it

*whine* I really, really wanna just spool it up on the way home today but I'm just over 1/4 tank left and it needs to last me.

Easy answer...NO! I cruize the freeway around 80-85 mph, not braggin' its just this car is so damn smooth on the freeway its very natrual, kinda like the CSVT at speed

Gas here in SE MI is about $2.80 something for premium, so it looks like its trying to come back down to something "normal". The other thing is that my car gets 23 mph with mixed driving and 28-29 on a straight freeway trip and thats going 70-75 mph, very comparable to the CSVT yet once again, amazing!

Nope. I'm mostly on the highway these days at ~ 80mph.

I just filled up yesterday. 375.1 miles / 13.18 gal = 28.46 mpg

Not too shabby.