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Just got a call from the Ford tech. Pre-CATs are toast! Quoted 1500 dollars to fix. Both banks are bad.
Any idea how difficult an install would be? Best place to get parts?
Just any advice about similiar problems and fixes!
Car info: 2000 Duratec SE 58,000 miles
I asked about emissions warranty in California FOrd only covers it to 36k. I have FORD ESP and that warranty will not cover it. Is this BS?
Thanks for the help folks!
You guys are great!
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Gut them...Or if you can't do it yourself, get some from Buckshot for $80...Install will run you around $300, but its cheaper than $1500...The best part is they will never go bad again, because they will be gone! Plus its a nice performance gain, and you will still pass inspection...My $.02...
Wait, you are in Cali, I don't know if you will pass inspection there...Ask someone from your state, they should have a better idea.
Last edited by FreeProjectPat; 12/22/03 10:49 PM.
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Best to check your warranty pamphlet, but it's my understanding that you're covered for 7yrs/70k miles for catalytics in California vs 8yrs/80k miles for the rest of North America.
98 Mystique LS v6 atx 163,000km
97 Contour LX v6 atx 163,000km
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Originally posted by albertucsb: I asked about emissions warranty in California FOrd only covers it to 36k. I have FORD ESP and that warranty will not cover it. Is this BS?
Thanks for the help folks!
You guys are great!
BS - Cali state mandated emisions is something likee 6/60 or 7/70 for cats and the like. Federal emisssions (may or may not supercede californias?) is 8/80.
Either way you ARE covered for pre-cats. Call back and mention that you will call the Ford Customer Asssistance Center, file a complaint with the local BBB and of course report them to the Department of Consumer Affairs, Bureau of Automotive Repair.
complaint form here:
http://smogcheck.ca.gov/stdpage.asp?Body=/consumer/filecomplaint.htm
main site here: http://smogcheck.ca.gov/stdhome.asp
97 Contour SE MTX
K&N 3530, UR UDP, 19# Injectors, mystery mod, FMS wires, Fordchip.com chip, SVT: TB, Flywheel, clutch, exhaust
04 Grand Caravan SXT
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Here's the applicable warranty for a 99. 200 should be similar (From warranty pamphlet from ford) You are covered under Federal Emissions Warranty. D=So technically, you don't have a Manufactureres Warranty. But either way, Ford pays and repairs. Don't let them bully you.! Quote:
EXPLANATION OF CALIFORNIA EMISSIONS WARRANTIES Your Warranty Rights and Obligations (Applicable if your vehicle is certified for sale in California and registered in California, Massachusetts, or New York.) The California Air Resources Board and Ford Motor Company are pleased to explain the emission control system warranty on your 1999-model vehicle. In California, new motor vehicles must be designed, built, and equipped to meet the Stateâ??s stringent anti-smog standards. Ford must warrant the emission control system on your vehicle for the periods of time listed on pages 16-17, provided there has been no abuse, neglect, or improper maintenance of your vehicle. Your emission control system may include parts such as the carburetor or fuel injection system, the ignition system, catalytic converter, and the engine computer. Also included may be hoses, belts, connectors, and other emissions-related assemblies. Where a warrantable condition exists, Ford Motor Company will repair your vehicle at no cost to you including diagnosis, parts, and labor. Manufacturerâ??s Warranty Coverage For 3 years or 50,000 miles (whichever first occurs): 1. If your vehicle fails a Smog Check inspection, all necessary repairs and adjustments will be made by Ford to ensure that your car or light truck passes the inspection. This is your emission control system PERFORMANCE WARRANTY. 2. If any emissions-related part on your vehicle is defective, the part will be repaired or replaced by Ford. This is your short-term emission control system DEFECTS WARRANTY. For 7 years or 70,000 miles (whichever first occurs): 1. If an emissions-related part listed on page 19 with coverage for 7 years or 70,000 miles is defective, the part will be repaired or replaced by Ford. This is your long-term emission control system DEFECTS WARRANTY. 16 If Gross Vehicle Weight rating is over 14,000 lbs.: For 5 years or 50,000 miles (gasoline powered engines and vehicles) or 5 years or 100,000 miles (diesel powered engines and vehicles) (whichever first occurs): 1. If an emissions-related part on your vehicle is defective, the part will be repaired or replaced by Ford. This is your emission control system DEFECTS WARRANTY. Ownerâ??s Warranty Responsibilities As the vehicle owner, you are responsible for the performance of the required maintenance listed in your ownerâ??s manual. Ford recommends that you retain all receipts covering maintenance on your vehicle, but Ford cannot deny warranty coverage solely for the lack of receipts or for your failure to ensure the performance of all scheduled maintenance. You are responsible for presenting your vehicle to a Ford Motor Company dealer as soon as a problem exists. The warranty repairs should be completed in a reasonable amount of time, not to exceed 30 days. As the vehicle owner, you should be aware that Ford Motor Company may deny you warranty coverage if the vehicle or a part has failed due to abuse, neglect, improper maintenance, or unapproved modifications. If you have any questions regarding your warranty rights and responsibilities, or if you want to report what you believe to be violations of the terms of this warranty, you may contact the Ford Customer Assistance Center at 1-800-392-3673 (FORD) or the California Air Resources Board at: State of California Air Resources Board Mobile Source Operations Division P.O. Box 8001 El Monte, California 91731-2990 17 WHAT IS COVERED? The parts on the following list are covered by the Defects Warranties that apply to every California 1999â??model vehicle, regardless of the GVWR* of the vehicle. * Gross Vehicle Weight Rating List of Parts Covered by Defects Warranties ² Air/Fuel Feedback Control System and Sensors ² Altitude Compensation System ² Catalytic Converter ² Cold Start Enrichment System ² Cold Start Fuel Injector (2) ² Controls for Deceleration ² Distributor Assembly ² Electronic Ignition System ² Exhaust Pipe (Manifold to Catalyst) ² Electronic Engine Control Sensors and Switches ² Exhaust Gas Recirculation (EGR) Valve, Spacer, Plate and Associated Parts ² Exhaust Heat Control Valve ² Exhaust Manifold ² Fuel Filler Cap and Neck Restrictor ² Fuel Injection System (1) ² Fuel Injector Supply Manifold ² Fuel Sensor (2) ² Fuel Tank (non diesel only) ² Fuel Tank Pressure Control Valve (2) ² Fuel Vapor Storage Canister, Liquid Separator and Associated Controls ² Ignition Coil and/or Control Module ² Intake Manifold (1) ² Intercooler Assembly - Engine Charger ² Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL) System ² PCV System and Oil Filler Cap ² Powertrain Control Module ² Pulsed Secondary Air Injection Valve/Secondary Air Injection Pump and Associated Parts ² Spark Control Components ² Spark Plugs and Ignition Wires ² Synchronizer Assembly ² Throttle Air Control Bypass Valve ² Throttle Body Assembly (MFI) ² Turbocharger Assembly ² TWC Air Control Valve ² Volume Air Flow Sensor (1) Coverage for diesel engines is for five years or 100,000 miles. (2) Flex Fuel Vehicle only. 18
My name is Richard. I was a Contouraholic.
NOW: '02 Mazda B3000 Dual Sport, Black
BEFORE: '99 Contour SE Sport
Duratec ATX Spruce Green
PIAA 510's, Foglight MOD, K&N Drop-in
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Here is the low down. I have spent past 3 hrs with 4 different dealer ships and ford customer relations. I hope this helps all you cali owners.
All dealerships checked my vin- I have a 2000 duratec auto. The part number for the pre-cats DO NOT fall under the CA mandated extended emissions warranty of 5 yr - 70k miles, just 3/50. They showed me the books, I donot have the part number but unfortunately CA contour owners are OWNED by friggin cali mandate. I was told I could register the vehicle in Nevada, and roll it into cali and get it fixed under federal 8/80 warranty.
So 2000 contour owners are SOL. So are Windstar owners with the 3.8. So folks I am bummed, but I have seen the ford warranty booklet pre cats are good for 3/50. Not more not less.
A silver lining for me at least- I think I tripped the CEL lightby dumping in fuel system cleaner. I have no symptoms of a precat failure, great gas mileage and no deterioration in power, not that auto duratecs feel all that fast. I have a gut feeling it isn't a burnt out cat, but gutting the pre-cats seem like a great alternative!
Thanks for all the help guys!
Oh- any cali owners with gutted pre-cats? Let me know how smog inspection went.
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Cripes I meat 7/70 not 5/70 in the earlier post, and CA mandates override federal law.
sorry for the error.
-thanks
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Looking at my latest warranty info (for a 04 dodge, but should be similar for ford).
Under Federal Warranty: parts covered for 8/80 - catalytic converter, PCM.
Under ssection 5.3 California Emmisions warranty, section C: parts covered for 8/80 (says see federal emisions warranty) - catalytic converter, PCM.
So, at least with dodge the federal 8/80 supercedes californias 7/70 - but even if Ford for some reason only gives 7/70 in CA you'd still be covered with your mileage.
EDIT: Just read your posts: Wow, looks like Ford really does like to screw you on warranty. Exactly the reason I'm driving a new Caravan (7/70 powertrain, follows federal emmissionss limits even in CA and generally seem to care about keeping customers happy) instead of a Windstar / Freestar .
Last edited by ScottK; 12/23/03 05:17 AM.
97 Contour SE MTX
K&N 3530, UR UDP, 19# Injectors, mystery mod, FMS wires, Fordchip.com chip, SVT: TB, Flywheel, clutch, exhaust
04 Grand Caravan SXT
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Originally posted by albertucsb:
Oh- any cali owners with gutted pre-cats? Let me know how smog inspection went.
I've smogged my car twice here in CA. 1st with gutted main cat nad good precats, results were passing but very close to the failure limit. Close enough that I got "invited" to a test only station for my second time around.
For the second test I had gutted pre-cats and a brand new main cat in place and passed with flying colors at a test only station. Pre cats only realy do anything in the ffirst few minutes before the main cat heats up.
97 Contour SE MTX
K&N 3530, UR UDP, 19# Injectors, mystery mod, FMS wires, Fordchip.com chip, SVT: TB, Flywheel, clutch, exhaust
04 Grand Caravan SXT
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Will not having a pre-cat (ie gutted) trigger the CEL light? Is there a faq or how-to on how to gut a pre-cat and is removal+installation a [censored]?
I'm sure I can get a shady muffler shop to do the install. Well I will definitely give buckshot a message!
Thanks!
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