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You still don't have to loosen the cam bolts to set the timing, I guess this only works if not very much out of time though,etc.
98.5 SVT
91 Escort GT (almost sold)
96 ATX Zetec (i brake to watch you swerve)
FS: SVT rear sway bar
WTB: Very cheap beater
CEG Dragon Run - October 13-15
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Originally posted by Kremithefrog:
...I guess this only works if not very much out of time though,etc.
Why would the engine be out of whack when changing a belt? If the belt broke, sure. If you got in there and made the dots on the belt and gears today and the belt broke tomorrow, or you tore the engine down and spun everything, you could still set the timing without the tools.
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Originally posted by PhatDoggy:
Originally posted by Kremithefrog:
...I guess this only works if not very much out of time though,etc.
Why would the engine be out of whack when changing a belt? If the belt broke, sure. If you got in there and made the dots on the belt and gears today and the belt broke tomorrow, or you tore the engine down and spun everything, you could still set the timing without the tools.
Um no.....spin the cam(s) and not the crank then your timing is off. 
Hector
2003 Rally Red Mitsubishi Evolution VIII
257HP/259TQ
2005 Lapis Blue Mazda 6s
RET: 00 Cabernet Red Ford Contour Zetec ATX SUPERCHARGED
160HP/141TQ
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Originally posted by LoCoZ:
Um no.....spin the cam(s) and not the crank then your timing is off.
OK. Call me dumb (well...you don't really have to), but why the heck would you spin the cams when doing preventative maintenance such as replacing a timing belt? Aside from breaking a belt, I can't see why you wouldn't have the opportunity to mark the gear/belt relationships like I did.
If you mark the relationship of belt to gear and spin everything you can independantly, you can still correctly time the engine without Ford's tools. Put the crank at #1TDC using the pointer on the pulley, place both cams in a postion near where they'll need to be to match up the markings, and put the belt on. Match the marks at the crank first, pull the belt tight going counterclockwise to the exhuast cam gear and move the gear as necessary to line up the marks there, then on to the intake cam gear to do the same. As long as the belt is tight between those three gears, you're good to go. I did it. It runs well. Of course all the above assumes you don't move the gear with realationship to the cam, but you shouldn't have to do that unless you put a new gear on a cam. Question comes to mind...are the gears keyed to the cam like the crank pulley is to the crank? If that is the case, even replacing a gear wouldn't change any of the above procedure.
The stumble at idle was there before I touched the car with the factory set timing, so the timing isn't a contributor. Apparently it's not an uncommon problem from the other posts I've read here.
Aside...I have a webpage that outlines the timing for the SOHC 4.6 V8 that uses a similar method - here if you're interested. Ford also says you HAVE to use their tools for setting the timing in these engines, but almost no one does. You don't need to. I've had the heads off the GT a couple of times and afterwards set the timing with no problems. Alot of people have used my page to walk them through timing their engines also, so it works. If you look at it, you'll see the similarity.
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Originally posted by Rogerm60:
Late static timing would make lower RPM range "lumpy" and unresponsive.
Static timing? If the crank and cams are in the exact same relationship to one another both before and after the timing belt change, is this affected? Not sure what you mean by static timing...
I'm assuming there is a crank position sensor (CPS) on this engine somewhere (can't seem to find much in the tiny, cramped engine bay  ). If the three rotating assemblies are correct to one another, the CPS will alert the computer as to where in the cycle those rotating assemblies are. Agreed? I'm trying to understand how the timing could possibly be off assuming the crank and cams have the same relationship to one another.
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on edit...deleted post for stupidity. 
Last edited by PhatDoggy; 09/24/03 06:01 PM.
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You hit the nail on the head.
Hector
2003 Rally Red Mitsubishi Evolution VIII
257HP/259TQ
2005 Lapis Blue Mazda 6s
RET: 00 Cabernet Red Ford Contour Zetec ATX SUPERCHARGED
160HP/141TQ
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Originally posted by LoCoZ:
You hit the nail on the head.
What nail? What head? My assumptions are correct or is there something I'm missing?
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Static timing is the relationship of the crank and cams as set by the belt.
If the belt that was on before had skipped a tooth, you are reproducing the wrong static timing with the new belt. I am not saying that this is true, only that it's the first thing I would check.
The 4.6 DOHC has chains and all sprockets are keyed - different animal.
If the new belt is a different length from the original, or if anything has moved from original, the cam pulley bolts must be loosened and timing set as per instructions or the timing may be out some fraction of a tooth.
Your problem may not be the static timing, but it should be verified first if there is any doubt.
To move on, the TPS has influence over tip in enrichment, It would be a good idea to check it's operation. On occasion I have seen bad DPFE's cause too much EGR without triggering a CEL This can easily be checked by temporarily disabling the ERG valve (remove vacuum line) for a test drive. You should also check the FPR operation with a fuel pressure guage.
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it" -George Santayana
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Well...the stumbling problem is fixed. My wife called on the way home from work tonight to tell me her car keeps stalling at lights. Tonight, I pulled the battery cable to reset the computer, and on startup all was good. No more stumbling and no more stalling. Car seems to have a little more pep too. In hindsight, I probably should have reset the computer after I cleaned the gunk from the MAF sensor.
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