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Originally posted by CRZYDRVR: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Plus, for all the people that say DOHC is the future in drag racing, why is it that top fuel and funny cars are making gross amounts of power by using those "old" pushrods? I dont see them using VETEC anytime soon.
They already do...case in point Toyo Tires Sport Compact Nationals ( feat. in SCC) Winnerof Modified Class was Papadakis in his FWD 4 cyl Civic...@ 8.44; Hod Rod class..another Civic 8.87..all motor, a neon that ran 11.0..
Please, that is not what Im talking about. Top fuel cars are THE fastest form of drag racing around. Any VETEC there?? Any DOHC motors there?? Nope, just a lot of pushrods and a whole lot of power DOHC motors cant come close to. A Neon that ran an 11 (which probably took a LOT of mods) is not what Im talking about.
How much of that Neon is left? Is the interior stripped? Is it using race gas? Nitrous? Both?
Lets get in one of my buddies Mustangs, put regular gas in it, turn on the A/C as we drive the car to the track, run the same time, then drive home.
The Neon that ran an 11.0, that is very cool, and I will give respect to the guy that built it. He did a lot with a small motor. But I still prefer the Mustang, because you can enjoy the car without having to drive all the way to the track just to use it. And still run the same 1/4 mile time.
Not trying to start a fight, but I dont see the point in comparing V8 engines to small, fuel efficient 4 cylinders. They both have their own strenghts.
BTW, HP/L DOES NOT mean anything.
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How else would you rate a motor?? WOW 500 Hp in a 8.2 liter 10 cyliner (viper, maybe be 8.3, dont remember). Such high technology when it is the same spefic output of the zetec motor in our contours!
The true test of a motor is how it performs. HP/L be dammed, if the car is fast, thats all that matters. It doesnt matter if the motor displaces 10, 5 or .5 liters.
Power is power.
HP/L is what the guys in the little cars brag about after they picked on a V8 car and got stomped.......
So much for your fantastic HP/L.............
-Ken V.
1998.5 SE Praire Tan Zetec ATX
psycho_bass@hotmail.com
Roush springs Roush rear sway bar BAT struts 17" Millie Miglia HT3 and a ton of subtle asthetic mods
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ok contourpower lets clear up your first misconception...i think your gsr times are a little bit off...with the minor mods listed i seriously doubt they will run 14.1 stock....i seriously doubt a cai,and exhaust will drop more than a whole second off of the time  second my lx with a simple drop in k&n filter,and removed silencer would still be considered stock...i mean damn that only adds a total of 5 hp. maybe.....even with the stock silencer and filter i still would've been running low 14's all day long..... third the other guy with the stang with the minor mods....30 horsepower?????come on a k&n and mufflers would only maybe add 6-8 hp if your lucky,no way in hell 30 hp...you shouldn't believe the overinflated numbers manufacturers give to their products....so that 8 hp gain he got is only good for maybe a tenth in the 1/4,which still makes his car a 14 second car even bone stock...whether you want to believe it or not 5speed fox stangs ARE 14 second cars stock period.........and your friend with all the mods apparently cant drive because with the mods you list his car is easily a mid 13 second car...i bet i could turn mid 13's in it.... those 8 second hondas you mention are also basically pro stock drag cars,not really a good example for this discussion,because there were stangs 10 years ago running 8's with full interiors.....and some of the pro 5.0 cars now are well into the 7's if not the 6's by now... and what do you mean how else can you rate an engine except hp per liter....who cares if you have 100 hp per liter,and your car is 1.8 liters that's still only 180 total horsepower big deal.....and you say anyone can put a big v8 in a car and make it fast....so anyone can take a little no torque motor and add 30 lbs. of boost and go fast too...but again add that much boost to a v8,and it is still superior to the smaller motor,so what's your point.....hp per liter don't really mean squat if the total output is still weak.... and while i don't particularly care for gm f-bodies i can admit that they are some fast cars...you should stroll around on svtperformance.com,and look at what some of the guys are running over there...there are alot of fbody guys on there too....and there are plenty of ls1 camaros,and firebirds,running low 13's basically stock...and true while its not god's gift to the automobile,neither is honda and their vtec and their hp per liter....but i will guarantee that 90% of the ls1 cars on the road right now will hand 90% of the ricers(oops i mean honda drivers  their a$$ all day long)
new,new ride!
'99 svt
black/mnb
'95 mustang gt sold!
'98 svt #800 sold!
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Originally posted by chrisilversvt:
....so anyone can take a little no torque motor and add 30 lbs. of boost and go fast too...but again add that much boost to a v8,and it is still superior to the smaller motor,so what's your point.....
http://www.turbomustangs.com/
Chris Hinds
AIM:CJ111010
1998 Contour GL Duratec 5-Spd
#565/????
15.610 @ 89.62mph
And I payed for it all myself
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Originally posted by chrisilversvt:
...i think your gsr times are a little bit off...with the minor mods listed i seriously doubt they will run 14.1 stock....i seriously doubt a cai,and exhaust will drop more than a whole second off of the time
It was I who put out those figures on the last page. I've watched ITR's with intakes run 14.5's and I've watched ITR's with those basic power upgrades (i/h/e) and slicks hit 14 flats and heard of them doing even better than that at other tracks.
My question is this: are you saying that these cars with half the displacement should be running the same times as these big muscle cars? I think your argument of "why do you have to trailer these 10 second 4-cylinder cars to the track" holds little water. A streetable Honda nearing single digit quarter mile times is just as impresive as your ten second Mustangs. It's just not practical to expect these imports to be on par with your big-motor automobiles without other considerations.
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VTEC. Try to at least sound educated. 
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This all goes back to the beginning of the post. HP/L is only relevent to N/A not to any type of F/I. If you took a 10 sec. small displacement motor and a 10sec. big displacement motor and ran a 6 month daily driver test or any other endurance type test and the results would be in favor of the larger displacement motor. You cannot get reliability out of a small displacement motor that is N/A netting power of 10sec. proportions. The only way to have a streetable 10 sec. small displacement motor is to have F/I. Anytime you don't NEED the power you can turn the knob down or button which ever you prefer (Boost Controller). At that point you could drive around w/ half of your max power so that you won't run into your problems. (maybe not half but you should be able to make sense of what I am saying).
'00 svt #1485/2150
Precision SC6152E .63 a/r, PnP Heads, TiAL 38mm Wastegate, Blitz BOV, HKS EBC, and HKS TT, Koni's Front/Rear, 19" Centerline RPMs, SPEC Stage 5 Clutch and Flywheel, DMD, Intrax, LoTek w/ Water Temp, Oil Press., EGT, Boost Gauge
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I'd rather have that, anyway.
I'm an angry gumball.
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Originally posted by cfcsvt:
This all goes back to the beginning of the post. HP/L is only relevent to N/A not to any type of F/I. If you took a 10 sec. small displacement motor and a 10sec. big displacement motor and ran a 6 month daily driver test or any other endurance type test and the results would be in favor of the larger displacement motor. You cannot get reliability out of a small displacement motor that is N/A netting power of 10sec. proportions. The only way to have a streetable 10 sec. small displacement motor is to have F/I. Anytime you don't NEED the power you can turn the knob down or button which ever you prefer (Boost Controller). At that point you could drive around w/ half of your max power so that you won't run into your problems. (maybe not half but you should be able to make sense of what I am saying).
N/A : Naturally Aspirated (IE: Not supercharged or Turbocharged)
F/I : Fuel Injected (Can be Port Injected, Throttle Body Injected, All injectors fire at same time or Sequetial firing of injectors.
My Contour is N/A and F/I
N/A and F/I are not mutually exclusive.
Did you mean S/C : SuperCharged or T/C : Turbocharged?
FWIW Honda S2000 is N/A and makes 120 HP/L. So N/A can be made High Performance.
The only number that might be an indicator of performance is lbs/hp. A 200 HP car that weighs 2500 Lbs. (12.5 lbs/Hp)is faster (acceleration) than a 300 Hp car weighing 4000 lbs (13.3 lbs/hp) all other things being equal. In addition, frontal area and Cd determine top speed more than HP. Since it takes 4 times the HP to go twice as fast, a smaller car (size, not weight) can go faster with less HP than a larger, similar car.
Since hp/lb, Cd, frontal area and rolling resistance are the items that determmine performance (for the most part, I am leaving out suspension qualities and handling issues), The car with the least Cd and Frontal area with the most Hp/Lb is always the fastest, regardless of American or Imported.
Since all the above posts generalilzed, I felt free to do the same. 
My name is Richard. I was a Contouraholic.
NOW: '02 Mazda B3000 Dual Sport, Black
BEFORE: '99 Contour SE Sport
Duratec ATX Spruce Green
PIAA 510's, Foglight MOD, K&N Drop-in
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Quote:
F/I : Fuel Injected (Can be Port Injected, Throttle Body Injected, All injectors fire at same time or Sequetial firing of injectors.
I think by F/I he meant Forced Induction.
1998 T-Red CSVT
#3710/6535
Born on 9/23/97
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I think there's 2 different meanings of F/I floating around this thread that are causing confusion:
Fuel Injected
And
Forced Induction
NEW: '05 Black Hemi Magnum
SOLD:'99 Silver Contour SVT (no mods)
R.I.P. '92 SHO
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