|
|
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,100
Addicted CEG\'er
|
Addicted CEG\'er
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,100 |
What's that? Someone questioned Demon? uhohhh.. stand by to stand by.
I mean.. C'mon.. I know NOTHING about the Zetec, and I would take his word, only because of the IMMENSE collection of posts in his name that state VERY knowledgeable and hard-to-know facts. His statements have yet to lead anyone astray, and I would bet my paycheck on his advice, before most others (with exceptions: Terry, Warmonger, and the like are equally as impressive..)
If you actually DOUBT his ability, do a quick search on his posts, or hell.. look at his pic in the "name to a face" thread... Does that LOOK like a guy with anything better to do than know all about our cars? (j/k... no offense Demon...)
LOL
To reiterate: You are wrong, and Demon(and everyone else) is right.... Thank you for playing..
Ray
'99 CSVT - Silver #222/276
In a constant state of blow-off euphoria.
Originally posted by Kremitthefrog:
I like to wear dresses and use binoculars to watch grandmas across the street.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,291
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 2,291 |
Originally posted by midnghtflm:
To reiterate: You are wrong, and Demon(and everyone else) is right.... Thank you for playing..
And so it begins...
Any bets on how long before this one gets locked as well?
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 729
Veteran CEG\'er
|
|
Veteran CEG\'er
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 729 |
what i was saying was... i dont know whether or not its true, but at least i support the fact that he beat a z24...... I am not being confrontational, but i do believe that some peoples pretentious attitudes towards fellow contour owners is Ghey..... We are all supposed to be helping eachother out here, not supporting you napolean complexes..... IMHO!!!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,506
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 3,506 |
Im sorry, but i can't believe a fully automatic ztech beat a cavalier mtx. 1) Cavalier is lighter and comes with more horse power.
2) the atx already draws more power and torque than an MTX
3) having a stright pipe for exahust in my experience can cause loss of power in lower rpm in a 4 cyl. Which means only his upper band will get power...true its nice, but by the time you get the power, the cavalier is already at his peak and maybe past and getting ready to shift. Im my experience, back pressuer is a good thing on a 4 cyl.
These are the 3 main factors you have to look at. I can see if it was MTX vs MTX and maybe then the story might be believeable. but even then the guy in the cavalier would have to make a mistake or know not how to drive to lose.
Im not trying to "put down" a fellow contour driver, but im sure that we these 3 points, you can understand why its so hard to believe. an intake and exahust will only give you so much. and even if the cavalier had an intake and exahust too, you'd be right back where you started if both cars are stock.
Roz
3.0 SVT hybrid...all the fixens...Track/Race ready very soon!!!!!! 20,000 + miles
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 9,602
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 9,602 |
I have nothing against the Zetec.
Now I dislike most slushboxes, but that is nothing new and not just a Contour ATX related hate either. (though the Contour has a particularly sh~tty unit!)
My orignal statement was that even modified a Zetec ATX does not stand a chance against a 2.4L J-body. MTX or ATX. Then I posted "magazine" times for stock versions of both. (yes bench racing, but accurate enough for comparisson & to show even stock it's ~1 second faster than a modified ATX) I even backed the Ecotec numbers up with the closest thing I could find quickly. (google search) 17 flat in a grand ma (3150lbs vs 2600lbs Cavalier) Even not taking into account a better launch that would make a stock ATX Ecotec Z24 ~16.5
Then I backed it up with my personal experience with 2 different 3rd gen 2.4L ATX's.
I still state the only way any N/A Zetec would beat a Z24 (equal drivers) is if the Z24 badges were put on a non 2.4L Twin Cam or 2.2L Ecotec. Even a driver missing a shift in the MTX would still be running 16.5-17 flat.
Like I've said before the ATX is brainless to drive and extremely efficient. Even stock it shifts at the 6500rpm redline and power loss is minimal for a slushbox!
Heck I've missed a shift & hit redline on the same run in my SVT and still run 15's (the ugliest 15.8 @ 94 you've ever seen   )
2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,516
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 1,516 |
Originally posted by DemonSVT:
I still state the only way any N/A Zetec would beat a Z24 (equal drivers) is if the Z24 badges were put on a non 2.4L Twin Cam or 2.2L Ecotec. Even a driver missing a shift in the MTX would still be running 16.5-17 flat.
I totally agree on that statement. That's probably what happened
Mazda 6S, V6, Speed Yellow
5 Speed, Sport package
Bose audio
Painted 'stash and HIDs!
w/Injen 1/4 14.750 @ 94.94
Former car:
99 Contour SE Sport Black MTX V6
SVT plastic...
1/4 - 15.012 @ 90.58 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,465
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,465 |
Originally posted by rozwell911:
3) having a stright pipe for exahust in my experience can cause loss of power in lower rpm in a 4 cyl. Which means only his upper band will get power...true its nice, but by the time you get the power, the cavalier is already at his peak and maybe past and getting ready to shift. Im my experience, back pressuer is a good thing on a 4 cyl.
These are the 3 main factors you have to look at. I can see if it was MTX vs MTX and maybe then the story might be believeable. but even then the guy in the cavalier would have to make a mistake or know not how to drive to lose.
Im not trying to "put down" a fellow contour driver, but im sure that we these 3 points, you can understand why its so hard to believe. an intake and exahust will only give you so much. and even if the cavalier had an intake and exahust too, you'd be right back where you started if both cars are stock.
Roz
Like I said I being a MTX owner.... and I have dual exaust with one muffler before split... see sig for dyno numbers... and I make 80% for my TQ at 2600RPM like I did when I was bone stock.... no lose of power down low here
and as I have said before at Route 66 in Joliet Il. NHRA track and a good one at that... which has a good amount of recods set there. best I have seen a current gen Z24 and non Z24 is low 17's both ATX and MTX. well maybe by some freak of nature their engine is effected more my heat and humidity but I find that hard to believe casue as I'm running 16.8,16.9 and a few 17.0's and one 17.2 (missed second) the best any of them that were there was a low 17 outside of one that was with a big bottle in the trunk that ran a 15. to believe a time someone posts on the web is very had to do being that I could go to another track not that far away from my house and run upper to mid 15's at about 85-90mph and I could have video and a time slip to show for it too. would you buy that based on the hp and TQ numbers in by sid I think not.
2003 Subaru WRX some mods
Even if you don't have the answer, you certainly have to admire the problem.
aka ZetecRacing
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 9,602
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 9,602 |
Originally posted by ZetecRacing:
would you buy that based on the hp and TQ numbers in by sid I think not.
Absolutely NOT!
dynoed at 114.2whp and 124.4wtq
Stock 2.4L MTX's dyno around the 130's (~126-130/~138 on average) and weigh around 2600lbs. ATX's about 5 less each respectively and weigh ~30lbs more.
Even the lightest stripped down Zetec probably tips the scale around 2800lbs plus.
So significantly less power and over 200 more lbs.
So "by the numbers" - I don't see. I'll never see it.
It just does not make sense "by the numbers" unless it was a misbadged 2.2L POS (110HP/115TQ) Remember the old LS's (2002 or older) has the 2.2L stock. All RS's have this POS 2.2L as well.
Only a true Z24 or a specially optioned & ordered LS 4-door had the 2.4L DOHC engine.
2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,465
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,465 |
guess they some how bought the 2.4L badge for the top of the motor then. casue all of them had 2.4L DOHC motors under the hood.
2003 Subaru WRX some mods
Even if you don't have the answer, you certainly have to admire the problem.
aka ZetecRacing
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 17,248
CEG road warrior
|
|
CEG road warrior
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 17,248 |
Originally posted by DemonSVT:
Originally posted by ZetecRacing:
would you buy that based on the hp and TQ numbers in by sid I think not.
Absolutely NOT!
dynoed at 114.2whp and 124.4wtq
Stock 2.4L MTX's dyno around the 130's (~126-130/~138 on average) and weigh around 2600lbs. ATX's about 5 less each respectively and weigh ~30lbs more.
Even the lightest stripped down Zetec probably tips the scale around 2800lbs plus.
So significantly less power and over 200 more lbs.
So "by the numbers" - I don't see. I'll never see it.
It just does not make sense "by the numbers" unless it was a misbadged 2.2L POS (110HP/115TQ) Remember the old LS's (2002 or older) has the 2.2L stock. All RS's have this POS 2.2L as well.
Only a true Z24 or a specially optioned & ordered LS 4-door had the 2.4L DOHC engine.
Well then you are more small-minded than I would have ever believed. Every Z24 I have ever seen has never ran lower than a 17. I beat a few at the TRACK, with my crappy Zetec ATX with mods. I have yet to lose a Cavalier, maybe yours is just special!  I'm done, you said it was impossible for a Zetec to go 140 (I wish I had a closeup of the screen when at the dyno), now we can't beat a Cavalier, oh well. And that is with my low 121 hp and 121 tq to the wheels.
Hector
2003 Rally Red Mitsubishi Evolution VIII
257HP/259TQ
2005 Lapis Blue Mazda 6s
RET: 00 Cabernet Red Ford Contour Zetec ATX SUPERCHARGED
160HP/141TQ
|
|
|
|
|
