Originally posted by contour se driver:
Originally posted by dnewma04:
The Genesis 1 was 160k when I heard it back in 1992. The company went out of business for a few years and came back last year. The current iteration of the Genesis 1 is 135k.
Anyway,
I think it has become clear that this guy is a hoax. I will respond to anything he posts, but purely for the entertainment of the rest of the group.
Clearly i am a hoax huh? lets see, i can back up everything i am saying, I am not magazine racing like the rest of you.[/qb]
Please start to do so. We are anxiously awaiting something other then useless drivel.
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I will say the sunire, the original true sub, has deeper bass then even the 12 inch top model sub from jl.
And you say this with no technological knowledge of either. Good for you, you once again prove your blatant disregard for the laws of physics.
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There is no way to dispute that. To me loudness and excursion mean nothing if it cant do 20hz.
I have a pair of headphones that will produce 20 hz. If loudness means nothing, you can get virtually any driver to produce 20 hz. I can absolutely dispute your claims that a sunfire goes lower than the JL. The original Sunfire True Subwoofer, now dubbed the Sunfire JR, has an in room F3 of 25 hz. (F3 is the point where the response of the driver drops 3 dB and is pretty well regarded as the low end output of a given driver/enclosure alignment) A JL Audio 12W7 (their top of the line 12) in a 97 liter enclosure tuned to 20 hz gives it an anechoic (neutral environment with no transfer function) F3 of 21 hz. At the same time it is producing 114 dB with the same power that is allowing the Sunfire to reach 108 dB in room with a much easier 25 hz freq to reproduce. If the sunfire had the mechanical/thermal abilities to handle it, it would take 4800w to equal the output of the JL with 1200w. That doesn't even take into account that the power compression levels of the JL are virtually zero and would be noticeable with the Sunfire based on TC Sound's other designs.
Here is another thing you may find interesting (but will probably dismiss as merely physics). In order for a 12" driver to produce 100 dB at 20 hz, it would have to move 17mm one way. In order for an 8" to produce 100dB at 20 hz, it would have to move 41mm one way. For a 5" to play 20 hz at 100 dB, it would need to be able to move 82mm one way. This was assuming a sealed box. A ported box can change things drastically.
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You said something about cerwin vega, that brand is a serious joke. their stoker long ago took a db win, but at only 40hz. I have heard 6.5 inchers drop deeper then that, Joseph audio for one. Ever heard of N.E.A.R.? they used to use 2 5.25 to hit 20.
CV has been a serious player in the pro-audio industry for a few decades. The original Strokers were playing 20 hz bass 2 decades ago. They aren't the class of the car audio world, but the strokers have made a major impact in every application they have been marketed in. I never mentioned SPL comps. These competition have no intention of preserving musical accuracy. They are meant to see who can get the loudest at any freq below a certain cutoff (most of the organizations use 80 hz or below). Again, your point is irrelevant. At what level are the N.E.A.R. drivers producing 20 hz? Which model are you referring to? I'm sure it would be easy enough to find out the specs.
Like I said earlier, I have headphones that have measureable response down to 20hz (and below).
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I find it hilarious, no one has experience yet you jump on the post like your an engineer.
I'm not an engineer, I am a hobbyist with 14 years of audio experience, mainly in home audio.
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I would advise the two of you to actually go out and listen to some home audio, also try REL, about all their subs are around 10 inch and play 20.
I have listened to, built, designed countless speakers using anything from low end drivers to some of the best on the market. No one is arguing that a given driver is producing 20 hz, yet you are dismissing car audio products, in general, as not being able to produce 20 hz signals.
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True i have been spoiled by home audio to never really enjoy car, but if someone in the northwest doesnt believe me, you can listen to my home then ill take you to all the local stores to back up what im saying.
Great! I, too, have been spoiled by home audio. There are some excellent products in all forms of audio. I just would never be so naive to dismiss one form of audio as "sucking nuts" because it would make me sound like a uneducated, naive, immature 15 year old.
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Car audio cannot compete with home. Even focal, a sister company of JM Lab, doesnt use the same drivers. Focal is built to a lesser quality. Also i knew an owner of a audio shop, he told me he gave up car cause, it sucks nuts.
The home environment has obvious advantageous with issues like dealing with reflections, proper imaging and sound staging. But car audio has serious advantageous in bass reproduction. Far more money is being spent on car audio in recent years than there is money being spent on home audio speaker development. Luckily for home audio, some of the technology is being incorporated into the home audio field. For example, Adire Audio's XBL^2 motor design shows a great deal of promise in home audio apps even though it was introduced on the Brahma car audio subwoofer.
Focal's Audiom series of drivers were derived from the JMLabs Utopia drivers and I can promise they are made with the same quality as the JMlabs. Focal has a few different series of drivers ranging from affordable to elite.
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please reread my previous post and take a hint.
I have read all I need to know to determine that you have pretty limited technical experience and don't have the intellectual capacity to back up any of your claims with facts.
