Contour Enthusiasts Group Archives Forums Modifications Zetec Maintenance Optimized Zetec TB before and after pics

Yes, providing good dyno results are the result. Waiting for the replacement TB to send to D Davis for the one I screwed up before he dynos.

Hi folks. This is my first message on this bb, hopefully not the last!
My question is what sort of power gains are there to be had with a throttle body optimisation? I do understand that no-one has dyno-ed with one yet, how much does one grin when flooring it I guess would be what I'm looking for!!
Looking forward to hearing back from you all.
David.

White 1996 Mercury Mystique ATX Zetec. K&N open element on MAF, resonator offed and Flo-Pro muffler "Looking for more, and then some!"

were still waiting for d davis to get to the dyno for us to see.

Not to disagree here, but JohnZX2SR is onto something here. His approach is different, but it's still very valid esp. in regards to the knife edge vs. rounded edge on the leading edge of the butterfly. Think of how air accelerates around a wing...

Also, the smooth vs. dimpled surface argument is a bit different in this example than when we talk about porting cyl. heads which is where the "golf ball" analogy comes up most often. Smooth intake ports are not desirable due to fuel "sticking" and "puddling" to the smoother surface - not being suspended in the air like it should be for good combustion. In a non-fuel environment like a TB a smooth surface might not be a bad thing.

John also has the flow #'s to back up his claims along with what appears to be the technical background.
And despite popular opinion in this thread, I don't think that he came in here bashing Brad or Brad's work. He just was presenting his solution to the problem. Who know's if Brad's optimization is the best or most complete solution anyway? It's based on sound principals (hell I did most of what he did to my TB) but so are John's. Let's have a dyno shootout! I'm sure Brad's TB's are still under development, as he's only worked on a handfull so far. Rome was not built in a day..it takes time to perfect anything good.

I know Brad has financial interests here and I'm not trying to steal his thunder but sometimes people have to ask questions in order for progress to be made. That's what Brad has done in the past (look at his remarkable track record w/the Contour) and I would expect no less of him now. Just don't be blind to another viewpoint here, thats all.

Oh, and I John isn't a troll. A troll is someone who makes some outragous claim (hooks the bait) in order to reel some suckers into a flame war. I saw nothing of the sort in Johns post.

Whew, rant off I guess...

We never had an issue over the throttle plate leading edge, we had an issue over the "leading edge" of the TB entrance, which isn't a leading edge at all, it's a transition. Time for some over simplified bnoon drawings again...

The transition shown here shows a way similar to what he was talking about. Shown in red are turbulent areas. The air speed slows down by this turbulence.



This is my way of running things in my car. There is still some areas of turbulence at the connection, but the knife-edge transition speeds up the air entering the TB.



As far as flow numbers go, flow benches are one of the easiest pieces of equipment to make numbers on. Bigger hole = bigger flow numbers comparatively. I want dyno numbers man...

The golf ball sure doesn't have fuel puddling issues when flying through the air. I wonder how the airflow is still improved on it then? :p

I hardly ever get into a flame war. Most of my posts are good hearted in nature and I'm always open to new ideas. Just post up information that means something to the rest of us as I'm going to be doing as soon as DDavis can make it to the dyno. I've already got dyno numbers on the Duratec optimized TB's, the gains are there. With the amount of material I removed from the Zetec TB's, I'd be really surprised if the Z's gains didn't out do the D's in this case.

I know you're not one to bash Brad but I noticed some of the others getting on John's case while rushing to defend you. A carefull re-read after some sleep (man what was I doing up at 4:20 mtn time last night?) shows that you are right-I was confusing the leading edge of the butterfly vs. the leading edge of the TB housing. I did the same thing you did there on my TB

I guess what promped me to chime in was how some of the others just blindly ignored his points and started calling him a troll

Don't worry Alex. It seems to happen quite a bit to those of us that have been around a while and try to do things for the group. Someone comes in with a new idea and other people seem to think it negates the hard work we've put in getting to the same place. We all just need to chill out sometimes and fight our own battles guys n gals. Sticking up for me is something nobody needs to do, troll or not. Especially when all we were doing was hunting for answers here.

There's 144 dimples on a golf ball, just FYI.

WTF!? You actually took the time to count them all out. :p

WOW! And the smoke is clearing......and the dust is settling........I think its time to order pizza! How bout you guys? Brad, you up for pizza? I could use a good pizza right now....

Good! Looks like a couple grins out there! Both sides of the fence - Keep up the good work!

Hey could you guys help me? I am gonna put a 351 in my Mystique. Any takers? :p

Smile kids
I'm out
Rich