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Originally posted by warmonger:
You joker, I tuned my STOCK Block duratec with stock internals to well above any normal engine and at least to levels as high or higher than any stock nissan engine can handle.
So your stock Duratec engine can handle over 400whp with no problem right? Because there are MANY turbo'd VQ30DE engines in that range with stock internals, some as high as 500whp.
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I won't say its better but it isn't inferior by any means. The SVT 2.5L engine was award winning in the years 10 best engines in those short three years it was made.
It was making 200HP out of a 2.5L when nissan was making 222HP out of a 3.0L. 
Like I said, I loved my SVTC, it had a great engine that had oil starvation problems from the outset due to a bad design of the oil pan and oil return system. Luckily mine went for 88k miles with zero internal problems, many others have no been so fortunate on this site.
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You're talking about a 3.5L in their top of the line sports car dynoing what, only 15HP more than some of our home-built enthusiast engines?
Yep, with a flatter torque curve and bone stock, not one modification as compared to your enthusiast modified engine. There are many, MANY, single and twin turbo VQ35DE's marching around now with anywher from 400rwhp to over 500rwhp in 350's with stock internals. Guys with built VQ35De's are running 700+rwhp now on TT systems. How many Duratecs are there on this site or any other vehicle site that uses a Duratec that have this much power and are still a daily driver? There are many 06 350's with mods that are closing in on 300+rwhp with bolt-on mods also.
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Go smoke some more of that Nissan tailpipe. lol
If Ford would make available some higher performance cams through their motorsports division then things might be even more dramatically in the our favor.
Instead we have to rob parts from commuter cars to NEARLY equal the motor output of a Nissan sports car motor.  Imagine if we had some race designed cams.....
And have you ever compared the dyno of a modifed 3L with the nissan 3.5L in the Altima/Maxima? The Duratec with SVT cams is so much broader and flatter.
Yeah OK, now who's smoking crack? Show me the dyno graphs...and I'm not a Nissan fan by any stretch, this is the 1st Nissan I've owned. I've owned a variety of different model cars and I can appreciate each one of them for what they are. I never said Nissan didn't have it's weak points or problems, but I would never put the Duratec engine in the same class as the VQ series Nissan engines. If you haven't noticed, the Ward's 10 best engines does not have the Duratec and hasn't had the Duratec engine on the list for several years now, but I sure do still see the VQ series engine on there, wonder why that is?   
Last edited by cjbaldw; 07/28/06 01:24 PM.
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Originally posted by cjbaldw:
Originally posted by warmonger:
You joker, I tuned my STOCK Block duratec with stock internals to well above any normal engine and at least to levels as high or higher than any stock nissan engine can handle.
So your stock Duratec engine can handle over 400whp with no problem right? Because there are MANY turbo'd VQ30DE engines in that range with stock internals, some as high as 500whp.
How many people are out there making turbo duratechs.. how many are making turbo "anything japenese because its like so sweet" yes they've seen higher numbers but they have a lot more time, money, and labor going into such applications
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I won't say its better but it isn't inferior by any means. The SVT 2.5L engine was award winning in the years 10 best engines in those short three years it was made.
It was making 200HP out of a 2.5L when nissan was making 222HP out of a 3.0L.
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Like I said, I loved my SVTC, it had a great engine that had oil starvation problems from the outset due to a bad design of the oil pan and oil return system. Luckily mine went for 88k miles with zero internal problems, many others have no been so fortunate on this site.
my car has 140,000 no problems and i drive it hard every single day, ive owned it since 98k .. so dont make it sound like every motor was a pile (i will admit there was an initial design flaw but again as warmonger stated people's perception of such issues are so biased against american automakers)
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You're talking about a 3.5L in their top of the line sports car dynoing what, only 15HP more than some of our home-built enthusiast engines?
Yep, with a flatter torque curve and bone stock, not one modification as compared to your enthusiast modified engine. There are many, MANY, single and twin turbo VQ35DE's marching around now with anywher from 400rwhp to over 500rwhp in 350's with stock internals. Guys with built VQ35De's are running 700+rwhp now on TT systems. How many Duratecs are there on this site or any other vehicle site that uses a Duratec that have this much power and are still a daily driver? There are many 06 350's with mods that are closing in on 300+rwhp with bolt-on mods also.
if this motor is sooo0o0o0ooo perfect.. why did noble choose the duratech for the M12.
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Go smoke some more of that Nissan tailpipe. lol
If Ford would make available some higher performance cams through their motorsports division then things might be even more dramatically in the our favor.
Instead we have to rob parts from commuter cars to NEARLY equal the motor output of a Nissan sports car motor. Imagine if we had some race designed cams.....
And have you ever compared the dyno of a modifed 3L with the nissan 3.5L in the Altima/Maxima? The Duratec with SVT cams is so much broader and flatter.
Yeah OK, now who's smoking crack? Show me the dyno graphs...and I'm not a Nissan fan by any stretch, this is the 1st Nissan I've owned. I've owned a variety of different model cars and I can appreciate each one of them for what they are. I never said Nissan didn't have it's weak points or problems, but I would never put the Duratec engine in the same class as the VQ series Nissan engines. If you haven't noticed, the Ward's 10 best engines does not have the Duratec and hasn't had the Duratec engine on the list for several years now, but I sure do still see the VQ series engine on there, wonder why that is?
10 best lists are created by the stem of the perception issues of poor quality american cars, the automotive media. In their eyes, if it isnt foreign it is crap. Yes there was a time not to long ago that being lazy left the big 3 significantly behind japanese cars in quality issues.. but at that time all jap cars were UGLY econoboxes. Still to this day i feel they rule that specific marketplace. If you are an english teacher who needs a vehicle to get her to class and the library, then go buy a toyota corolla as there is very strong argument this is the best car in this situation. But once you step outside of that realm, where cars have an excitement to them, i think every company is on a fairly level playing field minus the negative opinions people hold on american cars
after all of this my main point is simply this. 98% of the members on this site are ford enthusiasts. We might buy a non ford in our lives, but we don't think ford's are crap. I know you bought a nissan and now that brand is god to you, but the rest of us dont share that point of view and your arguments aren't fact based enough to win this arguement.
personally i think you car is ugly. ha! 
1998.5 Diamond White Pearl SVT (#4725)
custom exhaust/intake k&N/mod'ed y-pipe
slotted rotors/greenstuff pads/SS lines
cougar trans/FSVT shift tower/Torsen
16lb. flywheel
18" Velox VX-8's with some rubba bands
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Originally posted by cjbaldw:
Quote:
You're talking about a 3.5L in their top of the line sports car dynoing what, only 15HP more than some of our home-built enthusiast engines?
Yep, with a flatter torque curve and bone stock, not one modification as compared to your enthusiast modified engine. There are many, MANY, single and twin turbo VQ35DE's marching around now with anywher from 400rwhp to over 500rwhp in 350's with stock internals. Guys with built VQ35De's are running 700+rwhp now on TT systems. How many Duratecs are there on this site or any other vehicle site that uses a Duratec that have this much power and are still a daily driver? There are many 06 350's with mods that are closing in on 300+rwhp with bolt-on mods also.
Noble M-12, M-400 could be used as a dd.
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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Originally posted by Stylin55_oh:
If you are an english teacher who needs a vehicle to get her to class and the library, then go buy a toyota corolla as there is very strong argument this is the best car in this situation. But once you step outside of that realm, where cars have an excitement to them, i think every company is on a fairly level playing field minus the negative opinions people hold on american cars.
This brought to mind the Mondeo vs. Honda Accord, Toyota Camry, S/C Mercedes C-230, BMW 3-series sport sedan comparo that Top Gear did.
"That's it then. The Ford is the fastest."
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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Originally posted by Stylin55_oh:
10 best lists are created by the stem of the perception issues of poor quality american cars, the automotive media. In their eyes, if it isnt foreign it is crap.
BS, you are full of crap son. I've probably owned more cars than the number of years you've lived on this earth, or close to it. Let's take a look at how biased the 2005 engine list was shall we?
The Ward's 10 Best Engines for 2005: (Engine and tested vehicle)
* Audi AG FSI 3.2L DOHC V-6 (Audi A6)
* Audi AG 4.2L DOHC V-8 (Audi S4)
* DaimlerChrysler AG 5.7L Hemi Magnum OHV V-8 (Chrysler 300C)
* DaimlerChrysler AG Mercedes-Benz 3.2L DOHC I-6 CDI Turbodiesel
(Mercedes E320 CDI)
* Ford Motor Co. 4.6L SOHC V-8 (Ford Mustang GT)
* General Motors Corp. Vortec 4.2L DOHC I-6 (Chevrolet TrailBlazer)
* Honda Motor Co. Ltd. 3L SOHC V-6 IMA Hybrid (Honda Accord Hybrid)
* Honda Motor Co. Ltd. Acura 3.5L SOHC V-6 (Acura RL)
* Mazda Motor Corp. 1.3L Renesis rotary (Mazda RX-8)
* Nissan Motor Co. Ltd. 3.5L DOHC V-6 (Infiniti G35 Coupe)
So, let's see now, three out of ten are American designed engines, one from Ford (the modular V8), one from GM (I6), and one from Chrysler (the Hemi). Three are from European manufacturers, two from Audi, one from Mercedes, and four are from Japan, two of which are Honda, one from Nissan, and one from Mazda for it's rotary engine design. How exactly is that biased, it is almost equally weighted across three continents. Nice try, but I'm not buying your argument because it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.
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Yes there was a time not to long ago that being lazy left the big 3 significantly behind japanese cars in quality issues.. but at that time all jap cars were UGLY econoboxes. Still to this day i feel they rule that specific marketplace.
Nah, the Korean's own the econobox marketplace nowadays, haven't you noticed.  The Japs are increasing their market share in the bread and butter family sedan and light truck marketplace, which is why the big three are hurting so much now, because that's where they made most of their money over the past 20 years, especially with cheap gas in the SUV segment which is dying off quickly now and the Big 3 are being caught with their pants down. When gas was cheap the big 3 had control of the light truck marketplace solidly, but that is changing due to higher energy prices.
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If you are an english teacher who needs a vehicle to get her to class and the library, then go buy a toyota corolla as there is very strong argument this is the best car in this situation. But once you step outside of that realm, where cars have an excitement to them, i think every company is on a fairly level playing field minus the negative opinions people hold on american cars.
I agree that each manufacturer has niche market cars that appeal to a small number of people that provide driving excitement and decent performance. However when it comes to selling 250,000 cars in larger market segments, the big 3 just can't seem to get it right lately.
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after all of this my main point is simply this. 98% of the members on this site are ford enthusiasts. We might buy a non ford in our lives, but we don't think ford's are crap. I know you bought a nissan and now that brand is god to you, but the rest of us dont share that point of view and your arguments aren't fact based enough to win this arguement.
Yeah, OK, my Nissan is god to me. Where did I say that exactly? Did I not say that this is the 1st Nissan I've owned? The fact is the Nissan I currently own is a half decent car, but it's not all that. It's a grocery getter family sedan, just like my SVTC was. I've owned Mazda's (MX6 LS and MX3), Fords (Escort Pony, Windstar, and SVTC), GM's (Chevy Venture - soon to be a GMC Acadia probably, Camaro SS), Chryslers (Dodge Stratus, Dodge Caravan, Acclaim), Toyotas (Corolla and Camry), Hondas (Prelude and Accord), Subaru (GL), Nissan (Altima) and a few others.
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personally i think you car is ugly. ha!
Wanna race? You'll only see the taillights I promise.
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there is no way im replying to all of that .. its just too long.
i did know the list of the top 10. but i was simply stating i dont really listen to magazines for what is good and what isnt because they are biased media and i dont care what anyone else says. I read a 9 page article on toyota becoming number 2 and closing in on GM from a nonbiased stand point. It was a very entertaining read and covered everything thats been covered here. it strongly pushed the media's negative influence on american cars tho.
You are completely correct Korean cars now have the economy market but will be in heavy competition with china. these cars will be so cheap they will become throw away items like a dvd player.
My lord you've owned a lot of cars. Which was your favorite, just out of curiousity.
honestly i like your car, i just dont dig the styling all that much.
*** news on the 3.5 ***
i was told by a ford PR guy that they want to put it in the zephyr but not the milan and fusion to give the lincoln exclusivity.
1998.5 Diamond White Pearl SVT (#4725)
custom exhaust/intake k&N/mod'ed y-pipe
slotted rotors/greenstuff pads/SS lines
cougar trans/FSVT shift tower/Torsen
16lb. flywheel
18" Velox VX-8's with some rubba bands
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Originally posted by Stylin55_oh:
*** news on the 3.5 ***
i was told by a ford PR guy that they want to put it in the zephyr but not the milan and fusion to give the lincoln exclusivity.
If they're smart, they'll put it in the Lincoln as standard equipment, but charge a premium price to install it in a Ford or Mercury. They can pad their accounts a bit that way.
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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The Duratec35 is slated to go into the Fusion and Milan at a later date. Production has to ramp up on it and any issues need to be worked out of it. You don't stick a brand new engine in every car across your entire lineup at the same time. That's only asking for problems. So, for now, it'll start it's life in the MKZ (the Zephyr), the MKX, and the Edge. The Five Hundred and its' sister-cars will be getting it the following year with their redesign. It will probably take until the first refresh of the Fusion, in the 2009MY for the Duratec35 to make its' way there.
2007: Edge, MKZ, MKX
2008: Five Hundred, Freestyle, Montego, Mazda6, CX-9 (and Ford's equivalent)
2009: Fusion, Milan
With talk of Cleveland also producing the Duratec35, the schedule for the Five Hundred/Montego/Freestyle might be pushed up to a 1/2-year update, what with Ford being very explicit about its' desire to upgrade that line with a visual and power upgrade in a hurry. I doubt that'd push the timetable up on the Fusion though, since I don't know if they'd stick the new engine in there just before a revision was due.
2003 Mazda6s 3.0L MTX
Webpage
2004 Mazda3s 2.3L ATX
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Originally posted by Stylin55_oh:
My lord you've owned a lot of cars. Which was your favorite, just out of curiousity.
honestly i like your car, i just dont dig the styling all that much.
*** news on the 3.5 ***
i was told by a ford PR guy that they want to put it in the zephyr but not the milan and fusion to give the lincoln exclusivity.
Favorite? I'm not really a favorites kind of guy, I appreciate each one for different reasons. My SVTC was a daily driver, light mods, just like my Alty SE-R. I lease my daily drivers, that way I get a new one every few years and it's always under warranty. The MX-6 LS was a nice ride and I really like the styling of the Mazda, the V6 was great as well. The SVTC was my foray into the four door grocery getter market, and was a fun car to drive, probably more balanced than the SE-R, and smaller. I needed more back seat room hence the Altima. I've got about two more years with the Altima and then who knows, though I've always like the G35 coupes and the new 2007 sedan looks much better than the current G35 sedan does, so that might be where I'm headed for my daily driver in 2008 if I still need four doors. It's a ways off so it's hard to say really.
The SS Camaro was a weekend/mod car and I sold it with 452rwhp after doing a complete h/c package and complete suspension setup and so forth. That was a nice ride and a real beast, but I could never tolerate it as a daily driver. Right now my priority is saving for retirement and for my kid's educations, so having a fun car really isn't in the cards for a few years at least.
I'm all over the place in so far as what I'd consider for a fun car really. I love the new Z06 though!
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Originally posted by AliasJerkââ??¢:
I agree, they also need to get their act together with their transmissions... My brother works for auto owners insurance, they gave him an 06' Grand prix Base model as a company car, thats all they have are the 04-07 grand prix's Every single one of their fleet cars have had to have their transmissions replaced at about 30K miles. Im not exaturating... EVERY ONE
That scares the hell out of me.... mom has an 05' with 24K miles... And its been shifting hard from park into reverse if you park on an incline.
Not to hijack the thread, but as a recent renter of a new Grand Prix, it doesn't surprise me much that their ATX's are failing at an early age. Watching the ATF temperature on the Driver Information Center soar to 210 degrees F or more during an easy drive on I-20 doesn't make me think they'll be durable transmissions.
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