|
|
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,066
Hard-core CEG\'er
|
Hard-core CEG\'er
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,066 |
Exxon's profit margins are slightly above 10%. That means they sold about 80bn worth of gasoline.
That's pretty low margins for any industry. For comparo's sake, Microsoft makes 30%-40% profit margins off it's software.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,066
Hard-core CEG\'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG\'er
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,066 |
Originally posted by Stazi:
My main point is that I'm not satisfied to just go "Oh well I guess I'll just pay $3 a gallon and not question it"...to me it not fully justified. When I cam to the US 6 years ago gas for $0.98 a gallon and in 6 years it is not 3x that - tell me what intelligent person wouldn't question that??? Maybe I am not as heavily invested into the economic data available to fully appreciate the possible explanation for this price increase, but my engineering brain just say "somethig aint right here - let's find out why" which cause me to look at root-cause-analysis. I'm not happy about paying this price for gas and I want to know why...and the excuses I heard so far aren't "doing it" for me...
Well there's a war going on and the US is sabre-rattling Iran.
China is growing 10% every year, and more and more chinese want to drive. Same with India.
The US is selling more SUV's than ever before and mileage ratings aren't getting better.
Chad, Congo, Venezuela are in very precarious political situations.
Basically supply could at the drop of a hat, be severely cut and that's why the price is so high.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,066
Hard-core CEG\'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG\'er
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,066 |
Originally posted by Stazi:
India and China although becoming HUGE industrial nations, are WAAAAYYY behind the US in terms of oil usage due to the fact that hardly ANYONE in either of these two countries can afford to own/use cars. The "family vehicles" in China and India and the rest of Indo-Chine usually is a 125cc scooter - hardly compares to the oil consumption of the US, so I don't see them sucking up the oil the US was looking for.
Stazi:
Quote:
Although US oil consumption is triple that of China's -- 20.4 million barrels per day to 6.5 million barrels in 2004, use in China has more than doubled, Brown said.
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/english/doc/2005-02/17/content_417043.htm
Add about 0.650bpd per year for China and in a decade, they will be nearly using as much oil as the United States.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,882
Hard-core CEG\'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG\'er
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,882 |
Anyone care to do the math and figure what Microsoft's profits would have been if they'd moved the same volume of software that the oil companies moved in oil? I'm sure it would error out most calculators!
Personally, I think bio-diesel is the way to go. You can make 20 gallons of it yourself with 2 gallons of ethanol, some lye, a few other minor additives (off the hardware store shelf, btw) and used frying grease.
Because it uses less ethanol, and the grease is a waste product of our MILLIONS of restaurants, it's win-win. Waste products are recycled, it would take less of our cropland for the ethanol portion (since it's roughly 1/10th of the recipe), and it would free us from crude oil dependency. It's not rocket science, you can make it in your garage for about 80 cents to a dollar per gallon.
If you want to be free of the system, you can't count on the system to help you achieve your goal. If you don't want to pay $3-$3.50 per gallon, do something about it yourself, rather than complain about large corporations doing what any company wants to do, i.e. make a profit. Trade your vehicles in on diesels and make your own fuel.
BrApple-its all in the way it is presented...but everythign on my resume is all me
TexasRealtor-I hope you spelling improves on your resume.
MxRacer-ladies and gentlemen, welcome to ironyville. population, texasrelator.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 3,143
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 3,143 |
Originally posted by ODC:
Exxon's profit margins are slightly above 10%. That means they sold about 80bn worth of gasoline.
That's pretty low margins for any industry. For comparo's sake, Microsoft makes 30%-40% profit margins off it's software.
Comparing Microsoft with Exxon (or any petrol company) is absurd, they aren't in the same industry, have totally different cost structures and don't have similiar products just to start. Not to mention that the demand for gas is largely inelastic and that gas is a commodity....
"Bros before Hoes" <-- More men need this mentality.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,718
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,718 |
Originally posted by MxRacer:
here's some bloody math for you....
exxon, just ONE of the companies, "only" had a 7% increase in earnings.
how much did that amount to? $588,000,000. say it with me.... five-hundred and eighty-eight MILLION dollars in ADDITIONAL PROFIT... thats just an increase... just in one year... just for ONE company.
those poor companies are only making single digit gains...
again, your argument is crap, JATO.
it's looking like a load of rhetoric. and i thought you were better than that. 
Ok, Einstein, take a look at last year's 10K statement for Exxon and look at their cost structure.
Then get back to me. It's not sinking in that it takes BILLION dollar investments and there exists a BILLION dollar cost-structre to get oil out of the ground and turn it into gas.
Checked the going prices for oil rigs lately? Google is pretty much retard and shmuck-proof, so do a search. Some of the larger rigs run $350 MILLION and are often insured way over that amount...
So, all of that profit may buy two additional rigs for Exxon if they need replacements and given the current hurricane concerns, you can bet insurance is going to be sky-high on these puppies.
So, what was that crack about "rhetoric"?
JaTo
e-Tough Guy
Missouri City, TX
99 Contour SVT
#143/2760
00 Corvette Coupe
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,718
Hard-core CEG'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 3,718 |
Originally posted by Pete D:
Originally posted by ODC:
Exxon's profit margins are slightly above 10%. That means they sold about 80bn worth of gasoline.
That's pretty low margins for any industry. For comparo's sake, Microsoft makes 30%-40% profit margins off it's software.
Comparing Microsoft with Exxon (or any petrol company) is absurd, they aren't in the same industry, have totally different cost structures and don't have similiar products just to start. Not to mention that the demand for gas is largely inelastic and that gas is a commodity....
Margins are margins and profit is profit; no, MS is not a commodity-based company, but for people screaming about the amount of money being made (a few pennies on the dollar) in gas sales vs. at least HALF of a dollar going to the bottom-line on SW, it again BEGS the question of people's perception on what "screwing" really is.
You are absolutely right; COST STRUCTURE does play a HUGE role in margins and therefore profits. What kills me is that these companies are building equipment to find oil (no mean feat in of itself) and once it's found, they build equipment that plows MILES through rock, mud and sand to suck up oil, pipe it or transport it sometimes thousands of miles away which after getting piped through refractionating towers and "crackers", then makes it's way through yet another form of transportation to the gas station where the consumer fills up.
It takes a s**tload of investment to do the above and the fact that it's still only $2-3/gallon amazes me.
JaTo
e-Tough Guy
Missouri City, TX
99 Contour SVT
#143/2760
00 Corvette Coupe
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 735
Veteran CEG\'er
|
|
Veteran CEG\'er
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 735 |
Gotta jump in here..... Let's see....Exxon makes 8 cents per dollar on gasoline and with that 8 cents they make sure we actually HAVE gasoline. Other "big bad oil companies" do the same at similar profit margins. Now, the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT on the other hand makes 15 cents on every gallon of gasoline sold through taxes. And they do NOTHING to ensure our supply of gasoline. In fact, they are the ones who put in place the very rules which PREVENT us from having adequate supplies to keep the price down. Now tell me again who's screwing the consumer??????  
'99 Sport TropicGreen,Duratec, SVT exhaust, Brembo rotors, Ceramic pads, K&N filters(oil & air), Alpine CDM7874, Polk DB570 speakers front and rear. Fog light mod. 50% Formula One tint.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,066
Hard-core CEG\'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG\'er
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,066 |
Originally posted by Pete D:
Originally posted by ODC:
Exxon's profit margins are slightly above 10%. That means they sold about 80bn worth of gasoline.
That's pretty low margins for any industry. For comparo's sake, Microsoft makes 30%-40% profit margins off it's software.
Comparing Microsoft with Exxon (or any petrol company) is absurd, they aren't in the same industry, have totally different cost structures and don't have similiar products just to start. Not to mention that the demand for gas is largely inelastic and that gas is a commodity....
Elasticity has nothing to do with this, and neither is the product. Both corporations are in the business of selling a product.
Corporations work the same way, they sell products at a margin. I'm just illlustrating that although the final value is big, the percentage of profit:revenue is quite small.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 3,496
Hard-core CEG\'er
|
|
Hard-core CEG\'er
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 3,496 |
Originally posted by JaTo:
Originally posted by jerseycat10:
Good thing JaTo came in here to talk us down, otherwise, this thread would be less than perfect.
Shame on me; it's so much more fun to knee-jerk hypothesize and fantisize about getting anal-banged by oil execs out of ignorance than going through dreary math and basic macro-econ...
My bad; carry on.
Preach on JaTo. Simple economics proves all of your points in this thread. No idea why people are so ignorant to the actual reasons gas prices are rising.
Simple economics people
Money doesn't always bring happiness. People with ten million dollars are no happier than people with nine million dollars ~ Hobart Brown
|
|
|
|
|
