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To quote Steve Forbes:
"Flat Tax"
Why?
1) Fair
2) Easy
3) Fair
4) Easy
Did I forget to mention that it would be FAIR and EASY?
Think of the BILLIONS the US would save not having a bazillion tax codes for business and citizens?
Past that, if we are stuck with the current system, then let's talk about AMT. I've been watching that b*st*rd piece of legislation creep up and I want it killed NOW. It's about the most unfair POS tax-code that was ever enacted. I've managed to dodge it, but it's going to SUCK royally the longer they leave it alone in it's current form...
JaTo
e-Tough Guy
Missouri City, TX
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Hard-core CEG\'er
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He's complaining because people are unwilling or unable to give a real opinion, one supported by reason and thought.
Personally, I think there is a great deal of truth to the trailer, and this is far cry from Michael Moore. This is a true show of Libertarianism, and a show of how government has exceeded the powers delegated to them under the Constitution.
I agree the AMT is wrong, but no more so than every deduction and exemption that exists in the tax code.
Brad "Diva": 2004 Mazda 6s 5-door, Volcanic Red
Rex: 1988 Mazda RX-7 Vert, Harbor Blue.
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Hard-core CEG'er
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Originally posted by Icefury:
While it's easy to dismiss him, not sharing his political views, his last movie Farenheight 9/11 was a documentary based on hard facts. True, It has his political sentiment as a backdrop but that does not change the fact that everything he brought up in Farenheight 9/11 is based is fact.
His assumptions are based on certain facts. It was then skewed FAR to the left, and the facts were sensationalized.
Fakenhype 9/11 was torn apart here quite sufficiently.
1998 SVT Contour Silver Frost for sale in Classifieds.
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CEG\'er
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CEG\'er
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One the first things we discussed in graduate school was the misconception that taxing wages is unconstitutional and that filing taxes returns is voluntary. The 16th ammendment gives Congress the right to lay and collect taxes on income from whatever sources derived. There are numerous case studies where people have to tried to get away from paying tax based on the whole "unconstitutional theory" but everyone of them has lost.
Joey
2006 MazdaSpeed 6 Black Cherry
2004 Jeep Renegade Black
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Dad always thought laughter was the best medicine, which I guess is why several of us died of tuberculosis.
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Originally posted by RT and his SE:
Yeah because unless it's spoon feed to us by some Republican shill we can't go see it and make up our own minds. 
Choose your spoon-feeder.
Function before fashion.
'96 Contour SE
"Toss the Contour into a corner, and it's as easy to catch as a softball thrown by a preschooler." -Edmunds, 1998
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Originally posted by Icefury:
I have yet to hear a single strong argument in objection to any part of the movie itself.
Walking around with your ears covered and your eyes closed doesn't count.
Fifty Nine Deceits (again)
Function before fashion.
'96 Contour SE
"Toss the Contour into a corner, and it's as easy to catch as a softball thrown by a preschooler." -Edmunds, 1998
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OK. Opinions?
Having now seen the trailer...
Title sucks. Turns people off. If people don't watch it, the message won't get out.
Trailer seems to try to link a lot of disparate ideas into some kind of big conspiracy theory, and quite frankly I was lost about halfway through. Somehow we got from the start of the income tax to Mussolini and corporate control of America and privacy invasion. Obviously, that's the point of this piece, based on the title, but I'm not convinced that watching the full-length movie will enlighten me any further.
There. A real opinion. Happy?
Function before fashion.
'96 Contour SE
"Toss the Contour into a corner, and it's as easy to catch as a softball thrown by a preschooler." -Edmunds, 1998
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Hard-core CEG'er
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Originally posted by Joey:
One the first things we discussed in graduate school was the misconception that taxing wages is unconstitutional and that filing taxes returns is voluntary. The 16th ammendment gives Congress the right to lay and collect taxes on income from whatever sources derived. There are numerous case studies where people have to tried to get away from paying tax based on the whole "unconstitutional theory" but everyone of them has lost.
I think the bulk of the aggrivation is that the 16th Amendment was supposedly never "legally" or "properly" ratified by a 3/4 majority of US states at the time the Amendment was introduced...
I'm a complete dumb-a$$ on Constitutional law and history, but that is one sticking-point I do remember being brought up.
JaTo
e-Tough Guy
Missouri City, TX
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#143/2760
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OP
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Originally posted by Joey:
One the first things we discussed in graduate school was the misconception that taxing wages is unconstitutional and that filing taxes returns is voluntary. The 16th ammendment gives Congress the right to lay and collect taxes on income from whatever sources derived. There are numerous case studies where people have to tried to get away from paying tax based on the whole "unconstitutional theory" but everyone of them has lost.
Nice try, but it would seem you forgot to factor into your discussion the Constitution. Specifically ..
Article 1, Section 2, Clause 3 states: "Representative and direct taxes shall be apportioned among the several states which may be included within this union, according to their respective numbers," and Article 1, Section 9, Clause 4 states: "No capitation or other direct tax shall be laid, unless in apportionment to the Census or enumeration herein before directed to be taken."
Article 1, Section 10, Clause 1 states: "No State shall enter into any treaty, alliance, or confederation; grant letters of marquee and reprisal; coin money; emit bills of credit; make anything but gold and silver coin a tender in payment of debts; pass any bill of attainder, ex post facto law, or law impairing the obligation of contracts, or grant any title of nobility."
These basic sections of the Constitution have never been repealed or amended! The Constitution STILL forbids the direct taxation of individuals, their property, and their rights, unless the tax is apportioned to the State governments for collection.
Furthermore the Supreme Court ruled (Brushaber vs Union Pacific R.R. Co.) and also in (Stanton vs Baltic Mining Co.) is that since the provisions of Article I, requiring that direct taxes be apportioned, were not repealed, they are still in full force and effect.
Article 1 cannot prohibit direct taxation unless apportioned, while the 16th Amendment grants the power to lay direct taxes without apportionment, because then the Constitution would inherently contradict itself and could no longer serve as a valid foundation for our Law. So, to specifically prevent the Constitution from contradicting itself, the Supreme Court ruled that since the 16th Amendment provides for an income tax without apportionment, that the income tax cannot be a direct tax.
Income Tax on wages paid for labor is *illegal* and it's illegally enforced by the IRS with unilateral support by our goverment.
2000 CSVT Frost Silver 3.0 Hybrid
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Wow...way more information than I expected. 
The graduate class was for taxation...thus the Constitution was never brought in detail. Since I'm not a politician, I'll assume that what you have written is correct and relevant; however, I think the important part of my statement was that 'there were numerous case studies where people have to tried to get away from paying tax based on the whole "unconstitutional theory" but everyone of them has lost.'
So it sounds to me like unless you get the Supreme Courts to agree with this...it's a dead issue.
If you want, feel free not to pay your taxes and fight it to the top...I'll bet money in Vegas on the outcome 
Last edited by Joey; 04/25/06 08:28 PM.
Joey
2006 MazdaSpeed 6 Black Cherry
2004 Jeep Renegade Black
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#1811 of 2150
Dad always thought laughter was the best medicine, which I guess is why several of us died of tuberculosis.
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