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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,197
I have no life
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I have no life
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 21,197 |
FYI 80% of the air in your tires consists of nitrogen. It does not change pressure as much with temperature changes.
It's also moisture free. There would be ZERO MPG or performance benefits. Military & commerical aircraft use 100% nitrogen for the first 2 reasons.
-'96 SE MTX 3L
-'98 SVT 1,173 of 6,535
-'05 Mazda 6s, loaded, g/f's ride
-Need a 96-00 manual on CD? PM or email me
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 979
Veteran CEG\'er
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Veteran CEG\'er
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 979 |
I read an article about a company producing an air-less tire design, I don't remember much about the company, but the tire itself wasn't very good but it was only a prototype. Who knows, maybe tires will be obsolete after hovercars are invented.  But I'm getting ahead of myself. -KJ
My ride(Cardomain link) :
'95 Contour 16V Zetec DOHC, Teal , ATX
Born on Sep. 4, 1995
86+ miles
*LEDs mods are on their way!*
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,194
Hard-core CEG\'er
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Hard-core CEG\'er
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 1,194 |
At the last tracday I went to, alot guys were using nitrogen because the temp didn't change. The owner of MTI Racing Atlanta ended up running a 1:32 at Road Atlanta in his Z06 that day. Let's just say he had a few more mods than nitrogen-filled tires. 
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 136
CEG\'er
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CEG\'er
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 136 |
Originally posted by todras:
There would be ZERO MPG or performance benefits.
Actually I have a customer at my shop who has recorded a 1 to 2% increase in fuel mileage over a six month period. He traveled approx. 30k miles in that time and the only difference between that six months and the prior six months was Nitrogen.
I myself have Nitrogen in my tires and I noticed a difference in road feel immediately. FYI there are 76 turns in my 27 mile commute everyday. I tested it...at 34 psi compressed air I painted a white line on the edge of the tire where the tread shoulder and the sidewall come together after arriving at work the painted line was just about gone. Next day 34 psi Nitrogen same road same commute time of 32 min door to door half the white line remained. Less sidewall flex = better road feel and better grip.
Also if you have chrome wheels, use Nitrogen, its dry and won't corrode your wheels from the inside out.
If the place you buy your tires fills them with Nitrogen for free have them do it. Is it worth paying 5 bucks a tire to fill your old tires most likely not.
Last edited by SVTGT350; 01/04/06 04:11 AM.
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 3,816
Hard-core CEG\'er
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Hard-core CEG\'er
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 3,816 |
Ya know, I was checking the air pressure in one of our duallies Monday...
Both outer rear rims had 2 valve stems each. I didn't pay attention to the fronts... only noticed it on the rear since I had to reach in there for the inner rim.
And I just thought of something my Voc Auto instructor in HS told us. He said when he was a teen and working at the service station, he would ask the hot women if they changed the winter/summer air in their tires. Most didn't know anything about cars, so he told them he'd do it for free! All just so he could check them out longer...
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 751
Veteran CEG\'er
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Originally posted by JCSVT:
At the last tracday I went to, alot guys were using nitrogen because the temp didn't change.
Of course the temperature changed. Have you ever even felt a tire after a track session? Why do you think that racers use pyrometers?
Nitrogen gives a predictable temperature change because it's dry and isn't influenced by water.
Whirling dervish of FFOG.
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 316
CEG\'er
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CEG\'er
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 316 |
Originally posted by weargle:
Originally posted by JCSVT:
At the last tracday I went to, alot guys were using nitrogen because the temp didn't change.
Of course the temperature changed. Have you ever even felt a tire after a track session? Why do you think that racers use pyrometers?
Nitrogen gives a predictable temperature change because it's dry and isn't influenced by water.
Yeah, it's a much smaller change. This is a huge deal with race tires. You get them too hot and they will start chunking.
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,517
Hard-core CEG'er
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Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Mar 2001
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Originally posted by gotapex:
Originally posted by weargle:
Originally posted by JCSVT:
At the last tracday I went to, alot guys were using nitrogen because the temp didn't change.
Of course the temperature changed. Have you ever even felt a tire after a track session? Why do you think that racers use pyrometers?
Nitrogen gives a predictable temperature change because it's dry and isn't influenced by water.
Yeah, it's a much smaller change. This is a huge deal with race tires. You get them too hot and they will start chunking.
I thought that was more for maintaining a proper tire contact patch? The rubber is going to heat up regardless as it's the main friction point between the track and car. I also use a digital pyrometer when I go to the track and the purpose of that is to gauge how flat the tire is going around the track. If the center is a lot higher than the edges then that generally means the tires have too much air (or the air has heated up more than anticipated which is where N2 comes in handy) and then I let some air out until the temps are about equal. You can tell a lot by tire temps.
I have never read nor seen anything pointing to the N2 keeping the rubber temperature down. I will have to look into that. I know Carroll Smith talks about using N2 in race tires in his books but I haven't actually picked up his books yet. They're definitely on my 'must read' list, though.
My two cents...
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 316
CEG\'er
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CEG\'er
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 316 |
Originally posted by m�¶bius:
Originally posted by gotapex:
Originally posted by weargle:
Originally posted by JCSVT:
At the last tracday I went to, alot guys were using nitrogen because the temp didn't change.
Of course the temperature changed. Have you ever even felt a tire after a track session? Why do you think that racers use pyrometers?
Nitrogen gives a predictable temperature change because it's dry and isn't influenced by water.
Yeah, it's a much smaller change. This is a huge deal with race tires. You get them too hot and they will start chunking.
I thought that was more for maintaining a proper tire contact patch? The rubber is going to heat up regardless as it's the main friction point between the track and car. I also use a digital pyrometer when I go to the track and the purpose of that is to gauge how flat the tire is going around the track. If the center is a lot higher than the edges then that generally means the tires have too much air (or the air has heated up more than anticipated which is where N2 comes in handy) and then I let some air out until the temps are about equal. You can tell a lot by tire temps.
I have never read nor seen anything pointing to the N2 keeping the rubber temperature down. I will have to look into that. I know Carroll Smith talks about using N2 in race tires in his books but I haven't actually picked up his books yet. They're definitely on my 'must read' list, though.
My two cents...
Contact patch is definitely part of it, but so is temperature itself. Most are made to operate very very well within a set range. You should hear those Ferrari F360 Challenge Stradale guys complain when they fail to check temp and it goes over 36 psi on the track. LOL.
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 3,223
"Absolut Rara."
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"Absolut Rara."
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 3,223 |
Nitrogen in race tires has zero to do with maintaining a particular tire temp.
Nitrogen is used very simply because it is more consistant than air (mostly due to the lack of moisture) in the expansion rate as the tire heats up. This means that a racer will get a more consistant hot tire pressure, which helps in keeping the car handling consistantly.
Tire temps are taken, partly to ensure that the tires aren't overheating (which is a gross error state) but the real value, is measuring temps across the tire, and determining how the tire is being used. Tire temperature profiles are key in setting up a race car properly. Tire temps can teach you all sorts of things about where to set camber, toe, shock settings, etc.
And fwiw, I'm posting this from my hotel in Daytona, where me and the rest of my team are for a testing session this weekend for our three Grand Am Cup Mustangs.
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