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Originally posted by Jerry J:
Originally posted by Beowulf:
But way to go. You used your right to free speech to show how much of a moron you are.
He knows what his rights are, and what he might be saying is that he would rather give up certain rights to privacy if it means catching some bad guys. No need for name calling.
"They that can give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty or safety."
Benjamin Franklin
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Originally posted by Beowulf:
"They that can give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty or safety."
Benjamin Franklin
Were there international terrorists in the 1700s? I don't think so... The world today is FAR different. Different times call for different measures.
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Originally posted by Slack Master Doug:
Originally posted by Beowulf:
Move to Canada, you don't deserve to be an American with that attitude.
But way to go. You used your right to free speech to show how much of a moron you are.
Do you realize it is not a matter of "nothing to hide"?
You know what? Shut the [censored] [censored]. You have absolutly no right to tell me that I don't deserve to be an american. I will probably get banned, but who really cares. Yes, I am obviously a moron because I agree with the goverment. They don't go and spy on everyone, nor do they just go and spy on random people. The people that they spy on probably have a good reason to be watched. I am using my freedom of speech to say you are an idiot. Btw, I am pretty sure personal attacks are against the rules, clown.
This is very much like the argument at the raped girl gets from rape apologists that she "deserved it" because her skirt was too short.
What a crock. You and people like yourself that are so willing to give up the freedoms that were paid for in blood disgust me and I hate every one of you. And I am not a person that hates without reason. You don't deserve freedom. You don't deserve to live in a free society. People like you have idly stood by and let facism and dictorships come to power.
You are forgetting some vital cornerstones of a free society.
#1 - Innocent until proven guilty.
#2 - Right to trial by jury.
#3 - Right to face your accusers and speak in your own defense.
#4 - Freedom from illegal search and seizure. This applies to your private conversations as well. Your private life is your own business and no government entity can violate that privacy without a judge agreeing that there is a justifiable reason for that invasion.
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That's a pretty convincing arguement, Beowulf.
We brought it upon ourselves with the patriot act, though.
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have to agree with that. Some people have already pointed out the way the bush govt is heading is the start of lots of dictatorships.
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Originally posted by Jerry J:
Originally posted by Beowulf:
"They that can give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty or safety."
Benjamin Franklin
Were there international terrorists in the 1700s? I don't think so... The world today is FAR different. Different times call for different measures.
There was something worse. Divine right of Kings. One man or woman had absolute control. His or her government could imprison, torure, confiscate and otherwise violate any person they wished.
Fighting terrorism is a poor excuse. Terrorists did not pull off the worst attack in history because the government did not have free reign to violate your protected rights, they pulled it off because they had the will to perpetrate that terrible act at the cost of their own lives and the lives of anyone that got in their way.
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Originally posted by Beowulf:
Originally posted by Slack Master Doug:
Originally posted by Beowulf:
Move to Canada, you don't deserve to be an American with that attitude.
But way to go. You used your right to free speech to show how much of a moron you are.
Do you realize it is not a matter of "nothing to hide"?
You know what? Shut the [censored] [censored]. You have absolutly no right to tell me that I don't deserve to be an american. I will probably get banned, but who really cares. Yes, I am obviously a moron because I agree with the goverment. They don't go and spy on everyone, nor do they just go and spy on random people. The people that they spy on probably have a good reason to be watched. I am using my freedom of speech to say you are an idiot. Btw, I am pretty sure personal attacks are against the rules, clown.
This is very much like the argument at the raped girl gets from rape apologists that she "deserved it" because her skirt was too short.
What a crock. You and people like yourself that are so willing to give up the freedoms that were paid for in blood disgust me and I hate every one of you. And I am not a person that hates without reason. You don't deserve freedom. You don't deserve to live in a free society. People like you have idly stood by and let facism and dictorships come to power.
You are forgetting some vital cornerstones of a free society.
#1 - Innocent until proven guilty.
#2 - Right to trial by jury.
#3 - Right to face your accusers and speak in your own defense.
#4 - Freedom from illegal search and seizure. This applies to your private conversations as well. Your private life is your own business and no government entity can violate that privacy without a judge agreeing that there is a justifiable reason for that invasion.
Aww, you hate me? I can live with that. After all those harsh words against me, I can honestly say that I hate you too. [censored] off. Wouldn't it be funny if somebody you knew was killed by a sleeper cell? Wonder if you'd change your view then.
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Originally posted by Jerry J:
That's a pretty convincing arguement, Beowulf.
We brought it upon ourselves with the patriot act, though.
No, our supposed "public servants" failed in discharging their sworn duty to protect the Constitution of the United States.
The Patriot Act was opposed by far too few in the House and Senante.
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Originally posted by Beowulf:
You are forgetting some vital cornerstones of a free society.
#1 - Innocent until proven guilty.
#2 - Right to trial by jury.
#3 - Right to face your accusers and speak in your own defense.
#4 - Freedom from illegal search and seizure. This applies to your private conversations as well. Your private life is your own business and no government entity can violate that privacy without a judge agreeing that there is a justifiable reason for that invasion.
#5 Right to bear arms.
#6 Right to worship.
#7 Right to free speech
#8 Right to have a nativity display.
#9 Right to have a government that activively seeks out threats.
Not necessarily in that order.
Black 1998.5
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Originally posted by Slack Master Doug:
Aww, you hate me? I can live with that. After all those harsh words against me, I can honestly say that I hate you too. [censored] off. Wouldn't it be funny if somebody you knew was killed by a sleeper cell? Wonder if you'd change your view then.
No. I would not. Because in the long run, the freedoms we have are more valuable than my life or the lives of people I do care about.
Do you know why? Because if we let the freedoms that made this country what it is die, the lives future generations lead will be worthless.
Unlike you, I can see the picture that is bigger than you or I. I don't ask the government to protect me from every harm. I know that my life today is more relaxed and unthreatened than the lives of any of my ancestors. We have it easier than anyone in history. One of the reason for that easy living is the freedoms that you obviously do not value nearly enough.
Y'know what. Canada doesn't want you either. Try Cuba. Live with the Communists for a while and maybe you will learn to appreicate the country you are from.
Last edited by Beowulf; 12/19/05 12:38 AM.
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Originator of the Beowulf Headlight Mod and the Beowulf CAI
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