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Tim,

I've been pouring through material on the history of Islam, the Crusades an their impact on the Muslim mindset, a comparitive piece on Judaism vs. Christianity vs. Islam, the Koran itself and a few other works for well over 3 years now. For what it's worth, I also did a few semester's worth of work on Egypt back in my college days plowing through it's history and politics from a religious standpoint. Finally, I'm lightly traveled in the Middle-East, as I've been in Morocco and UAE, but since I'm not the type to stick to the typical "tourist" routine, I've probably seen a thing two that are usually missed by Westerners. I know more than just a few Muslims and two of my good friends that I used to routinely play racquetball in KC with are Muslims.

I'm definitely no expert on Islam, but neither am I entirely alien to it, the various interpretations that people hold of it or it's history. Let's just say since 9/11, terrorism and it's various facets have been an obsession of mine in terms of reading.

Throughout everything I have read, heard and seen, none of it pushes me to believe that Islam in and of itself promotes wholesale terrorism and violence. Now, due to a number of other influencers such as poverty, systematic repression by totalitarian regimes, the ongoing Israel/Palestine issue and Western political policy since the British Empire days, have certain segments of Islam taken on a harsher edge and have created an atmosphere where violent religious extremism is more rampant within that religion over most other popular religions of today? ABSOLUTELY.

My opinion is that it's just not as cut and dried as you see it.

When boiled down to it's very essence, religion in it's various flavors is yet another tool for mankind to use. The wielder of it's message is no different that the wielder of any other tool; in sane, educated and careful hands, it can nurture and assist a society. In the wrong hands, it can do horrors beyond description.

To draw somewhat of a parallel: when someone uses a shotgun or a pistol to commit a crime, IMHO it is NOT the gun's fault, regardless of the particular type used. It's the fault of the person that used it.

The same goes for the religions we are talking about here since Islam BY ITSELF does not advocate violent extremism or the slaughter of innocents at it's core and the Koran IS NOT a work that pushes for a policy of "coversion or extermination" from cover to cover.

Those of an uneducated, easily-manipulated nature will ALWAYS be succeptable to the particulars of religious extremism; some more than others due to their upbringing and situation in life. Then you have highly-educated nutcases that have managed to fixate on certain particulars within religion to the exception of all else; they can easily marginalize or entirely dismiss reams of any contrary doctrine to the particular cause they have tied themselves to. Islam is not alone in this, though given that it's the most popular religion in the most poverty-stricken and uneducated regions on the planet, it becomes the "scapegoat" and demonized as it is the most easily identifiable and most readily available label for one to fasten to the populations in Africa and the Middle-East.

There's a LOT more to terrorism in it's current incarnation today than pegging Islam as being the core problem...

Jato, well I see where you are coming from and I have agreed previously that Islam is not the sole reason these terrorists are killing innocent people, but it is one of the reasons. My point however, was that even though the Koran does not teach to kill from cover to cover, it does specifically say to kill those who will not convert, and that is not out of context. That's the only point I have been focussing on in this thread.

this is just amazing. reading your posts are like watching a 20 car pile up in progress. anyone looking through this thread has to be completely flabbergasted at what you've said through out. i was actually at a loss for words for a sec. it's so outrageously extremist that i thought you were just being devil's advocate or funny at first. but the longer it went on the more i realized you really believe that hot pile of garbage you're spewing.

have you really thought about your pov or is it knee jerk reactionism? take a look at what you've posted.

Originally posted by Corbett:

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The Koran does says that if someone will not convert to Islam, they should be killed because they are an infadel. And that is why Islam is responsible for this terrorism.

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Originally posted by Corbett:

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But they DO represent Islam because all Muslims read the Koran which teaches them to all do what these extremists do. Why do you keep ignoring this point?

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Originally posted by Corbett:

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They hate America because they hate Christians or anyone that will not convert.

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Originally posted by Corbett:

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Yes in fact I have read the sections of the Koran pertaining to the terrorism acts. It specifically says that if a person does not believe or will not convert they should be killed. You should read it too, then maybe you would understand rather then play he said she said.

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Originally posted by Corbett:

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Didn't I already say that these terrorists do what they do because their Koran tells them to?

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Originally posted by Corbett:

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...Islam is a terrorist religion.

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Originally posted by Corbett:

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In fact, as previously stated, a large protion of the Christian community share the same beliefs.

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Originally posted by Corbett:

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my belief that Islam sponsors terrorism.

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Originally posted by Corbett:

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You sugested I am one of only a few who believe the same way I do and you are sadly mistaken. You were the one who said you could prove the leaders of Christianity do not think Islam is a religion that teaches terrorism, so prove it.

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and when presented with even more proof that what you've said above is wrong. you come back with..

Originally posted by Corbett:

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My point however, was that even though the Koran does not teach to kill from cover to cover, it does specifically say to kill those who will not convert, and that is not out of context. That's the only point I have been focussing on in this thread.

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smh @ 20 car pile ups.

Sounds pretty consistent to me. Thanks. WOuld you rather I start the namecalling like you have? Again, pot calling the kettle black.

DIE THREAD DIE!

Honestly now..

I don't really seea point, other than dragging this out further. You can look them up though.

You don't understand what context has to do with these passages? My point was that you are taking the phrase to fit what you want it to say, without factoring in what context they are in and how it proves my point about each verse.