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How much is the CP-E mod? So if I add an Injen intake and do a CPU reflash to change A/F ratios then I will accomplish the same thing,
You can, and you get decent results. In fact CP-E (which is the name of the company) initially did this for the Injen. But they went ahead and designed their own, larger intake pipe and got another 7whp out of it.
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And thank you for proving my point, that even after doing the CP-E mod, you're dyno'ing less than a stock SE 5-speed model Altima does.
Well I never said it would be even -- just much more comparable. Particularly in the low-end which the Mazda6 sucks at stock.
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I'd state that any engine has potential if you know what you're doing. The biggest advantage the VQ series folks have is that the potential has already been proven by the manufacturer in higher end model cars and extracting this potential is relatively easy in the Alty series cars as a result. That is a considerable advantage IMHO.
Very true. But I believe you're forgetting that the 3.0L Duratec is itself "proven by the manufacturer in higher end model cars". Jaguar, Aston-Martin, and Noble all use 3.0L Duratecs, with Aston-Martin and Noble pushing the engine way beyond what Nissan does with their VQ.
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You can buy a similarly equipped Alty for 21k OTD if you know how to negotiate and given the Alty currently has a 1500 rebate, all the easier, though I'm not sure if the Mazda 6 also has rebates available right now?
I still question how one gets a price $3,000 lower than the Edmunds TMV. It might happen at a particular dealer trying to sell a lot of cars, but that's certainly not a common deal. I question how any negotiator can get the $6,000 under invoice that getting the Altima for $21K OTD would require you do. With the Mazda6 having $3,750 rebates right now, that kind of deal under invoice still isn't posible. With a $1,500 rebate you'd have to negotiate the Altima to $4,500 under invoice yourself to get that kind of deal.
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Understood and agreed, and to each his own. I lease my cars and the lease payment on my SE-R wasn't much different than the 6s lease payments so it wasn't a hard decision for me.
And you got yourself a great car, there's no doubt. And for a lease (which you can't do that much to in regards to Mods) you certainly went a route I would have considered a lot more.
2003 Mazda6s 3.0L MTX
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Originally posted by sigma:
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My buddy paid 21k for a 6s 5-door (no leather, etc.) OTD. You can buy a similarly equipped Altima SE for the same price with the current rebates/financing available.
I'd like to see how one does that. The TMV for an '04 Altima equipped similarly to the 6s 5-Door is $24,276. There is a $1500 rebate for a total of $22,776. And TTL and you're up to $24,000 -- a difference of $3,000.
I'll grant that a good negotiator can get lower than TMV, but nowhere near $3,000 lower. Hell, the invoice on a similarly equipped Altima is more than the sticker on the Mazda6.
The Mazda 6s sedan invoices at 21486.00. The Altima SE invoices at 21410.00. Both have similar equipment in the base models with no options added and similar option pricing. Seems pretty close to me???
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And according to the manufacturer it is a 1.6" difference. For those who don't know, anything over 1" is a BIG difference, that's why the Alty "feels" roomier inside IMHO, because it simply is, especially the rear seats.
Yeah, but manufacturers like to do things like Slide the seat back, take front legroom measurements, slide the seat forward, take rear measurements, and slide the seat around to find the peak headroom, etc, etc.
I'll trust a long-proven organization that has standardized methods and tested both cars themselves.
I rent Altimas all the time and there's no appreciable difference in interior space.
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I'll grant for a same lease price... the SE-R becomes VERY attractive. Unfortunately, my driving patterns won't allow for leasing a car 
I'm not saying the Altima is a bad car... it's one of the better ones in the market... I used to recommend them before the 6 came out... it just didn't have the extra points the 6 has for me.
Brad "Diva": 2004 Mazda 6s 5-door, Volcanic Red
Rex: 1988 Mazda RX-7 Vert, Harbor Blue.
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Originally posted by svtcarboy:
I'll grant for a same lease price... the SE-R becomes VERY attractive. Unfortunately, my driving patterns won't allow for leasing a car
I'm not saying the Altima is a bad car... it's one of the better ones in the market... I used to recommend them before the 6 came out... it just didn't have the extra points the 6 has for me.
Understood on the driving patterns thing. Used to be in the same boat when I was driving 45 miles each direction to/from work when I had the SVT. Now, I drive 7 miles to/from the train station, so it didn't make sense for me to take on a 600/month buy payment verses a 330/month lease payment and drive a new car every few years. 
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Originally posted by sigma:
I still question how one gets a price $3,000 lower than the Edmunds TMV. It might happen at a particular dealer trying to sell a lot of cars, but that's certainly not a common deal. I question how any negotiator can get the $6,000 under invoice that getting the Altima for $21K OTD would require you do. With the Mazda6 having $3,750 rebates right now, that kind of deal under invoice still isn't posible. With a $1,500 rebate you'd have to negotiate the Altima to $4,500 under invoice yourself to get that kind of deal.
Wow 3750 rebate that's pretty good! Alty's sell very well so Nissan doesn't really need to rebate them very much as a result.
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And you got yourself a great car, there's no doubt. And for a lease (which you can't do that much to in regards to Mods) you certainly went a route I would have considered a lot more.
Yes the SE-R Alty isn't bad for what it is. I like limited production cars though next time I can see myself grabbing up a G35 sedan/coupe instead as the G35c has REALLY grown on me since I've gotten the SE-R Alty, and it's right wheel drive... 
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Originally posted by cjbaldw:
Understood on the driving patterns thing. Used to be in the same boat when I was driving 45 miles each direction to/from work when I had the SVT. Now, I drive 7 miles to/from the train station, so it didn't make sense for me to take on a 600/month buy payment verses a 330/month lease payment and drive a new car every few years.
Speaking of driving patterns... I have to get going on a 300 mile trip... Merry Christmas to all!
Brad "Diva": 2004 Mazda 6s 5-door, Volcanic Red
Rex: 1988 Mazda RX-7 Vert, Harbor Blue.
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Quote:
The Mazda 6s sedan invoices at 21486.00. The Altima SE invoices at 21410.00. Both have similar equipment in the base models with no options added and similar option pricing. Seems pretty close to me???
Invoices are very close -- but the chances of negotiating down that low are not. And Mazdas rebates are $2,250 more than Nissans are for the '04s.
And there is one big difference in equipment -- ABS and SABs which are standard on the Mazda6 but a $800 option on the Altima. And then there's the other smaller standard things on the Mazda6 you can't easily get on the Altima (without buying the $3,000 sport package) like heated mirrors, automatic climate control, and traction control (which I don't think you can even get on the Altima SE)
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Very true. But I believe you're forgetting that the 3.0L Duratec is itself "proven by the manufacturer in higher end model cars". Jaguar, Aston-Martin, and Noble all use 3.0L Duratecs, with Aston-Martin and Noble pushing the engine way beyond what Nissan does with their VQ.
Ehh not really.
Jaguar... 240hp... far from 300.
Aston Martin... v12 is a distant cousin. Completely reworked and engineered. Like comparing stock engine to racing engine. + the car costs $200,000
Noble... again a very limited production car, has a totally reworked engine + turbos.
The point is the VQ is already putting out 300hp NA. The Altima engine is nearly identical to what the G35 is running. Slight changes in breathing and programming. There are guys in the maxima forums running similar numbers to 350z with very little changed.
The Nissan and Mazda are very close in many respects but Nissan def has the better engine/straight line performance and potential. If/when the 6 gets the new duratec 3.5 Im sure we will revisit this comparison... Just as long as Nissan doesn't throw another 30hp into the Altima.
05 Legacy GT Turbo 5speed
99 SVT GRN/TAN (sold)
06 Ford Explorer EBv8
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Originally posted by sigma:
Invoices are very close -- but the chances of negotiating down that low are not. And Mazdas rebates are $2,250 more than Nissans are for the '04s.
Buying a car at invoice is not that hard. I bought the SE-R for 28.3k which is at invoice...
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And there is one big difference in equipment -- ABS and SABs which are standard on the Mazda6 but a $800 option on the Altima. And then there's the other smaller standard things on the Mazda6 you can't easily get on the Altima (without buying the $3,000 sport package) like heated mirrors, automatic climate control, and traction control (which I don't think you can even get on the Altima SE)
Good points! If those are all standard features that's a pretty good deal. TCS (traction control) is available on the SE-R, not sure about the SE though.
Well, I'm off to celebrate Christmas eve! Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to everyone!
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