|
|
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,517
Hard-core CEG'er
|
Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,517 |
WTF Brian, you think you know something about Cobras or something? 
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15
New CEG\'er
|
|
New CEG\'er
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15 |
Only said the Calipers were aluminium, no mention of brackets.
Also said I had to have the 13" 1.1 Cobra Brembro Rotors cut down to 12" Which meant modification to the Mounting Bracket, like moving a hole.
Original set up I had was a Baer Hub, Caliper and .810 Corvette 12" rotor. Re Drilled for the 4 1/2'" Ford pattern. This is what I'm getting away from.
Calipers are Identical to the Cobra except the Cobra are wider to accept the 1.1 Rotor.
If you want a picture of the Cobra Caliper which by the way is the earlier 38.0 mm dual piston, and says Cobra on it I would be more than glad to send a photo, or better yet I'm on the west side of Detroit would be glad to show you, send me a PM and well get together. or post it in this thread if there is a way to post a picture. After the Fox Body Cars, Mustang Body styles were referred to SN94/96 (Ford Engineering) Some of these parts are interchangable with the Fox Mustangs. Again the changes that are being made.
SCCA National License 303439
ASedan Mustang # 76 Cen Div
"Yes It's Fast, No You Can't Drive It!"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 196
CEG\'er
|
|
CEG\'er
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 196 |
Originally posted by koscieldrk:
After the Fox Body Cars, Mustang Body styles were referred to SN94/96 (Ford Engineering)
BZZZZZZZ! Oh, thanks for playing, try again.
The the current gen mustang (1994-2004) is designated the SN95 by Ford engineering. Trust me, as both Rara and I were at one time assigned to the program. Its program code has always been SN95. The new 2005+ program is designated as S197....again, a project to which I worked on during my time at Ford and which Rara still works on (in the brake department...go figure).
Very few of life's problems can not be solved with the reasonable application of more horsepower!
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 337
CEG\'er
|
|
CEG\'er
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 337 |
Having been shop manager for Bondurant for about four years I was around the SN95 projects for a while.....
And when I started doing brake kits Baer was using Vette (and perhps later Cobra) rotors from day one. Some cut to smaller diameter.
Having made kits to compete with them on the SHO my rotor was often .81 to accomodate the full size four piston caliper. A non-issue on the PBR. Wider rotors are great if you have room on a fixed design. I don't believe that Baer has ever offered a .81 FRONT set up for any Ford product, I could be wrong however, just don't know of it.
The info on the PBRs in enlightening. The very late parts (43mm I belive stated) are going to be way too much for the Contour. The mid size acceptable and the smaller ones ok also if you can find a real brake pad for that caliper. Meaning one of substantial Cf to boost torque lost in piston area. And leg will go up too.
There's nothing wrong with the PBRs for light track use. Like all products they have their drawbacks too. Extended high pressue use of some of these has also resulted in a bent or flexed bridge area, witness by the scrap bin we had behind the shop full of PBRs. Scary that some people advocate the grinding of the "cooling fins" on the bridge for better fit! Doh! Another issue on some of these kits is the hub (as stated on the Mustang, we later did steel hubs from WW for this reason- might be able to still get them for you) and the rotor being heavy and non serviceable. Very pricey replacements at say 12.5" had me make two part replacements for others who bought these kits. Pad choices are also an issue given many companies don't make 'real' (forgive me here but show me the data) race pads AND the simple fact that the pads are thin in nature thus don't last as long and transfer more heat to the caliper body.
Just some food for thought from the other side.
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 383
CEG\'er
|
|
CEG\'er
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 383 |
Originally posted by koscieldrk:
No parking lot racing here!
Well look out folks, we're in the midst of a Real Racer! Real Racers can confuse issues 15 ways from Sunday because they're Real Racers and You're Not so What do You Know Anyway. Quote:
The whole point is to get away from the Baer Stuff. Can't find a Baer Hub on a Sunday, but the local auto parts will have a Hub at 3/4 the price to finish off a weekend.
That has more to do with the fact that your ASedan setup is designed to work with Fox-style spindles and not with SN95 style hubs than it does with any notion that Cobra rotors are wider than "Baer" rotors...you jumped in here chest-a-puffing and have confused the issue with apples and oranges. Your current setup has not a goddamned thing to do with any "Cobra" setup nor does it have anything to do with what most people (e.g., the unwashed, non-Real Racers) would associate with a "Baer" kit because most people couldn't give a rat's ass about trying to meet ASedan rules. The Bser kit most people are aware of (that would be the 13-inch "track" kit) is virtually interchangeable with Cobra front brakes. Period. And FWIW the brakes are good enough to help keep my Non-Real_Racing self within 6 seconds of the ASedan pace at Heartland Park, in a street-driven car with less than ASedan power, on Kumho MX's.
Quote:
As far as Pads I run the Hawk Blues front and rear. Think I'd take my life in my hands with OTS Pads. Later I'm done.
I hadn't noticed you were a Real Racer when I wrote that but I am aware that more people than you are reading this thread even if you can't get it through your head that my input here has more to do with other victims---I mean readers of your misinformation and bombast than it does with you. But when I said OTS I had Carbotech brakes in mind, the rear Carbotechs I installed on my Baer rear setup would not fit and it was only after I went on a search-and-measure mission that I found the requirements of those pads were rather unique and that Hawk makes a pad specifically for this application.
Pacific Green '96 Contour LX V6
â??98 GTP, light mods, 14.66/94
Calypso Green '92 Mustang LX coupe, 13.56/101
Crown Autocross Club 1999 Street Tire Champion, 2000/2001/2002 Street Modified Champion
KCR SCCA 2002 Solo II Street Modified Champion
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15
New CEG\'er
|
|
New CEG\'er
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15 |
Todd, The kit that I got from Baer was what they call an early A/Sedan Kit for Fox Body Mustangs. Kit included the 5 lug aluminium hubs, PBR 38mm Calipers and Brackets. .810 12" Rotors drilled to the 4 1/2 Ford Bolt Pattern. They now offer a package that will accomodate the 94 and up Mustangs including 12" rotors with modified brackets and 38mm Calipers. You can do this on a Fox if you update the spindles to 94/96. Also enables increased negative camber. These are to Accomodate the SCCA Rules in A/Sedan. Even the guys running the 94 to 2003 Mustangs have to convert over to the 12" rotor set up and 38mm calipers whether it be the .810 or the 1.1's. Part of the problem also is we are not allowed to run slotted or drilled rotors but we can run the two piece rotor and hat as long as they are not slotted or drilled.
What everone has been doing is buying the Brembro rotors and turning them down to 12". Don't really know how Baer is doing it but they do offer a 12" rotor.
SCCA National License 303439
ASedan Mustang # 76 Cen Div
"Yes It's Fast, No You Can't Drive It!"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15
New CEG\'er
|
|
New CEG\'er
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 15 |
SN95 1994 / 2004 No big Deal. Didn't refer to a 93 as SN. If I want to call a 94 or a 96 an SN my choice. Its still a SN no matter how you look at it.
SCCA National License 303439
ASedan Mustang # 76 Cen Div
"Yes It's Fast, No You Can't Drive It!"
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 383
CEG\'er
|
|
CEG\'er
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 383 |
Originally posted by koscieldrk:
SN95 1994 / 2004 No big Deal. Didn't refer to a 93 as SN. If I want to call a 94 or a 96 an SN my choice. Its still a SN no matter how you look at it.
What you're not grasping is that the SN95 is a platform designation that applies to all '94-current models of mustang just as Fox applied to '79-93. The "95" portion of it has nothing to do with model year.
Pacific Green '96 Contour LX V6
â??98 GTP, light mods, 14.66/94
Calypso Green '92 Mustang LX coupe, 13.56/101
Crown Autocross Club 1999 Street Tire Champion, 2000/2001/2002 Street Modified Champion
KCR SCCA 2002 Solo II Street Modified Champion
|
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 12
New CEG\'er
|
|
New CEG\'er
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 12 |
Todd:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I have one of the very first Baer 13" kits offered from the SHO Shop for the early Ford Taurus SHO (1990 in my case). My understanding from Vadim is that the mounting adapter brackets and 13" rotors were sourced directly from Baer and the SHO Shop supplied the 2-piston PBR aluminum calipers from another source. The rotors are true Corvette pieces spec'ed for the ZR-1 Vette (1.1" thick, I checked). I forget the offset but I know it is significantly less than that of the later Mustang Cobra 13" rotors. Maybe you can clarify this.
FWIW, and for the enlightenment of the readers of this forum, my 1990 SHO has 325 dyno verified, normally aspirated horsepower (redline @ 8350 rmp) and has seen over 20 trips to southeast region race courses. Equipped with race grade pads and with the caliper piston dust boot seals removed (less they vaporize at race speeds), I have never experienced ANY brake fade at full race speeds (I saw 158 mph on the radar gun on the back staight at Road Atlanta). But I must admit I've never been a big believer in trail throttle braking. As a result, we won't discuss tire life in this topic!
NOTE: For anyone who is contemplating doing business with TCE Performance, I cannot more highly recommend them as a source of performance FORD parts. Todd will NOT steer you wrong (and NO, I do not get any compensation for these comments).
|
|
|
|
|
