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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 2,091
Hard-core CEG'er
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Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Mar 2001
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I do believe contours are somewhat of a throwaway car in the sense that in 15-20 years can you imagine somebody saying..."Hey, I think I'm gonna buy a 96 Contour GL and restore it from the ground up!!!" I don't think it's gonna happen. There will be some cars that are desirable in 15 years and there will be some that aren't. The contour will be one that isn't, therefore most will be "thrown-away".
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 463
CEG\'er
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CEG\'er
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 463 |
Quote:
I have to disagree. The biggest mistake many people make is not treating a car like an investment. For most people the purchase of a car is a significant investment - probably the second or third biggest investment they will make (behind a house and a college education).
Look up the definition of ā??investmentā? you will see that a car is defiantly not an investment since it will depreciate in value over time, it will always be a loss. Now this is not to say that my old 1968 Cougar XR7 that I paid $500 for in 1975 would be worth $10,000 today if I had of hung on to it. But, if I added up how much it would have cost me over 28 years to maintain the car in pristine condition it would add up to way more then $10,000. So again, not an investment. Also, like I said, for any object (this includes cars) to go up in value there must be a market and demand.
Someday, 30 years from now your fully restored mint condition contour my get a fair price at a car auction (one of us could be the buyer). When you add up what you originally paid for the car and how much you spent keeping it pristine, you will have lost money. Cars are a necessity and a hobby and never an investment.
With tax interest I paid about 20,000 for the mystique in 1997, excluding maintenance (gas, oil, breaks and tires) I have spent about 1,000 more in repairs. If I had of taken the 18,000 (purchase price) I spent on the car in 1997, and purchased shares of Harmon International, (if I remember @ 13.00 share) I would have had 1384 shares. Today a share of Harmon is worth $90. I would have had $124,560. Now that is an investment. My car could sell today for around $3500, not an investment.
jeff
have you fixed your ford lately?
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Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 81
CEG\'er
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CEG\'er
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 81 |
Originally posted by mercman:
Look up the definition of ā??investmentā?...
Ok, I did just that. Went to Websters.com and the definition of investment is as follows (with irrelevant definitions removed)
inĀ·vestĀ·ment n.
1. Property or another possession acquired for future financial return or benefit.
2. A commitment, as of time or support.
The first definition is a little loosely termed for me. You can take that several different ways although I am sure which way it will be taken. However, stocks are termed as investments with the knowledge that they can be win, lose, or draw.
But what I found the most intruguing and the most relevant to the point was the second definition which states that it can be a commitment as of time or support. A car is definitely a commitment. You must look after it to keep it running right. You have to change the oil, the tires, put gas in the tank when it runs low. Notice it or not, when you buy a car you commit to it for at least a short period of time. There is time taken out of the day to take it to the shop, time taken to wash and clean it, and of course time taken to make the money to have the funds to maintain the vehicle. Restoration projects are a great example of a commitment of time.
I thought I would throw this in there. Personally, I don't care what people call it because to each person a car is a different thing but since there was a challenge to look up the definition, I did so that people could see for themselves what it meant. To some, a car is a hunk of metal. To people like me, it's a whole lot more than that.
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Joined: May 2000
Posts: 2,127
Hard-core CEG'er
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Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: May 2000
Posts: 2,127 |
I drive a lot of miles, so I look at it more as minimizing the cost/mile.
So while it may cost more to fix a car than it's current value in the market place, what is the cost to replace that car?
If the car is in good condition and well maintained, I don't see a problem with spending $1500-$2000 on a rebuilt tranny if you can drive it another 6-12 months.
I think the argument about not repairing the car once the cost of a repair exceeds the value of the car.
One thing in favor of that argument is that is a fixed, non-ambigous strategy that requires little prediction.
However, I think it is more costly, especially when buying new cars.
I've done pretty well buying used TRANSPORTATION (certainly not enthusiast vehicles) for under $3K and driving them for about 3 years and about 75K miles and then putting them up for sale.
The old 87 LeSabre I purchased for $1K was $0.142/mile to drive for ALL costs, purchase, insurance, fuel, maintenance and repair.
To buy somethink like a Mazda Protege5 for $15K and drive it twice as long 150K miles, my purchase cost for the vehicle is $0.10/mile before I buy gas, tires, insurance, etc.
So while the value of the car in the marketplace is not high, there is a value as a transportation appliance, and putting a few grand into a paid-for car is almost always cheaper than buying a new one.
Heck, even my 1994 Geo Prizm that I purchased on 4/12/03 for $2500 is down to $0.363/mile after almost 5 months and about 9000 miles. But that includes the $2500 to purchase, another nearly $200 for license, tax and title, and maybe $150 in maintenance to get started (new fluids, plug wires,cap, rotor, plugs, fuel and air filters, etc.)
By the one year anny. this thing should also be around $0.14/mile give or take a bit.
TB
"Seems like our society is more interested in turning each successive generation into cookie-cutter wankers than anything else." -- Jato 8/24/2004
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,676
Hard-core CEG'er
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Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,676 |
Originally posted by mercman:
If I had of taken the 18,000 (purchase price) I spent on the car in 1997, and purchased shares of Harmon International, (if I remember @ 13.00 share) I would have had 1384 shares. Today a share of Harmon is worth $90. I would have had $124,560. Now that is an investment. My car could sell today for around $3500, not an investment.
jeff
I'm assuming you didn't finance the 18k?
Very interesting way to look at it. . .I think I've put 10k already into my car on top of the 22k pair for, EXLUDING the repairs, which come up to about 4k. So that's like 36k. I could've had a bimmer.
At least I can out accelerate, handle, and brake a 330i.
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 7,117
Hard-core CEG'er
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Hard-core CEG'er
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 7,117 |
Originally posted by Bozack:
Originally posted by mbb41:
Every one is entitled to their opinion. Given there low resale value I still say they represent a great value for the buck.
While I like my 2000 SVT for what it is, I do realize that it is a low budget car and in the grand scheme of things it isn't and most likely will never be a "keeper" if there is such a thing.
Let me know when you're done with your low budget SVT. I'd love to have one of those to add to my low budget family fleet.
1999 Escort ZX-2
1999 Contour SE V-6
2000 Contour SVT Oooooo, yeah!
Must be that jumbly-wumbly thing happening again.
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Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 678
Veteran CEG\'er
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Veteran CEG\'er
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 678 |
Originally posted by mercman:
Look up the definition of ā??investmentā? you will see that a car is defiantly not an investment since it will depreciate in value over time, it will always be a loss...
jeff
I think we're just arguing semantics here, but
according to my Webster's Universal Unabridged Dictionary, "investment" is variously defined as "the laying out of money in the purchase of some species of property" and "[t]he property in which one invests".
"Invest" is defined as "[t]o lay out, as money in the purchase of some kind of property, usually of a permanent nature".
So I would most definitely consider a car to be an "investment." Definitions aside, I think that for most people, the purchase of a car is an extremely important decision involving the allocation of limited resources. For most people, the purchase of a sensible economical and reliable car is just about the best financial decision they will ever make. I deal a lot with bankrutpcy and cannot even begin to count the number of people driven into bankruptcy by buying a car that they cannot afford to pay for, maintain or drive. (SUV's are particularly popular among people scraping by living paycheck to paycheck).
Me: "Your rent is only $350.00 a month and you barely make enough to cover that. Why would you want to be locked into paying upwards of $500 a month for a new car?"
Them: I need an SUV. I sometimes have to drive to work when its snowing. Plus I like to sit up high and minivans don't suit my image.
Me: What kind of SUV are you thinking about getting?
Them: A green one.
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 8
Newbie
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Newbie
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 8 |
I just bought my 99SVT and I don't know what people are complaining about. If had drivin some of the cars that I have in the past you would love anything that ran under it's own power and had A/C. Plus you beat it up, and you are going to have to fix it. (what do you mean I had to have the oil changed?).
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