Contour Enthusiasts Group Archives Forums General General help defend SVT tours!

Thats funny..(but true).

i know at least one MMM(MaxMotorMeltdown).

resale...check the KBB or Edmonds true value of any SVT competitor from say 1999 vs SVT (I did this and posted the results months ago). Even assume you paid full sticker (I got 5 grand off new which helps alot). you may be surprised..

Woohoo! Thanks everyone, great material here, and should be enough to silence the punks over there

well if they want to keep bashing about our cars beeing slow, Car&Driver tested a Grand am GT which took 23.7 seconds to reach 100 from 0. As for our svt's which took 19.1.........hhhmmmmm they can whoop us huh? Plus our handling, .86 on the g-pad versus .82... man that's killer. They only thing I do praise about the car is that it was alot more room inside than we do...

Oh please. It's a pontiac. It's a GM product. Don't even get me started on that one. You couldn't pay me to take one....oh wait! I take that back! You could pay me. And pay me CASH! Lots of money! Then I would take that car to the bank, deposit my cash....and leave it there!!!!

Defend 'tiques? Here is the deal. People like him are good at one thing. Steaming up mirrors when they talk to themselves. Cause guess what! I ain't listening!

Nuff Said and there are my tail lights
Buh Byyyyeeee
Rich

I always gotta defend my 'tour. If I talk to someone long enuff, I can usually get them to understand the whole contour love affair, and that these cars have a lot of potential. When your done making a contour into a show car, you'll have something to be very proud of because you know how much work it takes,,,but with a civic all you have to do is go to APC and say hey, give me all that civic crap and bam you're like every1 else. Once I get my contour lookin' good and modded, it will be the only zetec tour where i live that is really cool and only one other modded tour is here. So you always know you have something very few other people have, and it makes you proud.

Oh, I'm still here...just been so busy at work and with remodeling projects at home that I haven't spent as much time on the boards as in the past.

However, it's the moments of raw idiocy such as those demonstrated by our newest simpleton over at CollegeClub that really make my butt chew a hole in the seat cushion.

Show that clown this link:

http://vista.pca.org//mav/Autocross/2002_results/20020630.htm

Many Contours, SVT and otherwise, putting in times that beat many Porsches at their event.

Of course you have to live with some Porsches beating Contours as well, but such is life.

It is more about the driver than the car in many cases.

TB

I'll also post the times of a V6 Grand-Am that ran at our AutoX yesterday.

It wasn't pretty for the Grand-Am

And for what it is worth, in the above times in Texas, I got the second fastest Contour time, and I'm a novice AutoX'er.

And now for yesterday's results:

For the not so ugly truth: http://wcsllc.net/stlsolo/E8TROPHY.TXT

And the indexed results: http://wcsllc.net/stlsolo/E8INDEX.TXT

TB

True to my promise, I won't post at College Club. But for those GAGT owners so inclined, comments (factual and well thought out) are welcome here:

Year? Model? Engine? Transmission? Do tell, my dear, because this is an awfully ignorant statement.

Year? Model? Engine? Transmission? Do tell, my dear, because this is an awfully ignorant statement.

Elaborate, please? Stock for stock?

In the interim, perhaps I'll proceed with a dose of The Discerning Auto Enthusiast's Reality Check.

Car and Driver tested a '99 SVT Contour and a '99 Grand Am GT two months apart back in late 1998. How convenient...a source of information and test numbers gathered by the same folks during a short period of time. Let's listen to the music:

[data_dump]

1999 Ford SVT Contour, C&D 11/98 What's That? You say you'd prefer something lighter by $10,000?, following up to comparison between BMW 328i and Audi A4 2.8Q:

0-60mph: 6.9 sec (clutch dump)
5-60mph: 7.5 sec (street start)
0-100mph: 19.2 sec
0-120mph: 33.7 sec
0-130mph: 33.1 (C&D test 4/99 "Little Big Fun")
1/4 mile: 15.4 sec @ 91 mph
Braking 70-0: 175'
Top Speed: 143mph (drag limited)
300' skidpad: .83g

1999 Pontiac Grand Am GT, C&D 9/98, Road Test:

0-60mph: 7.7 sec (brake torque)
5-60mph: 8.0 sec (street start)
0-100mph: 23.7 sec
0-120mph: 43.7 sec
0-130mph: Hmmmm?
1/4 mile: 16.0 sec @ 86mph
Braking 70-0: 179'
300' skidpad: .82g

[/data_dump]

Okyday. Now all it takes is the application of, what, 2nd grade mathematics to determine 'greater than' or 'less than', and which car will have the pleasure of viewing twin 2.5" polished stainless exhaust tips emitting the antithesis of GM's boy-racer exhaust blat.

So...which, stock for stock, Grand Am GT1 would take a dump on the SVT Contour in performance, pray tell?

Let's show a little fairness here, and include some of the road test editors' comments on each of the aforementioned vehicles:

C&D, on '99 Grand Am GT:

...Viewed from any angle, the styling of this latest Pontiac appears-to our eyes, at least-overwrought and exaggerated...

...The gauges reside in what looks like the inside of Jayne Mansfield's brassiere...

...The front bucket seats seem hard in the wrong places and induce back discomfort and a sleepy keester after a short trip...

...But what really disappoints us about this hyper styled sedan is its tendency to over promise and under deliver...

...The Grand Am GT's performance is impressive in this class, although the sound and feel of its pushrod engine lag behind DOHC-equipped competitors like the Contour SE and Camry CE...

...Our GT's J.C. Whitney-style rear spoiler and bulky side cladding look tacked on, and I could not get comfortable in the dreadful front seats...

...The tachometer promises a 6200-rpm redline, but the fuel shuts off at about 5900 revs, and the standard automatic transmission upshifts well before that. Badging on the GT's high-output 3.4-liter V-6 engine proclaims "Ram Air" induction, but a large hole in the airbox vents any possible ram effect pressurization that might occur..

High praise, indeed.

Now, C&D, on the '99 SVT Contour:

...We brought the SVT Contour along to the Waterford Hills Road Race Course to be a chase car for our comparison of the BMW and the Audi, and the little Ford ended up taking as many laps as the two Germans. Test drivers typically returned to the pits grinning. Although the Ford felt nowhere near as rigid and buttoned down as the Audi and the BMW, it still went like stink, lap after lap, and is plenty docile and accommodating as daily transportation...

...Balance is excellent. Light braking, or easing the power a little, plants the front tires for a sure turn-in. Then pick up the power. The SVT will understeer predictably. Adjust the line with steering and throttle...

...The SVT Contour brings three bags full of hurry-up at the lowest as-tested price of the group. You have to love its verve. But could you live with it? The steering tugs side to side under power, the instruments turn invisible at dusk, the appointments are budget-class Detroit, and like a bad dog, the growling never stops... (Tested against A4, 323i, 9-3, Jetta GLX, G20t, Four Door Party Animals C&D 3/97)

To be fair, I included a few of the SVT Contour's faults in the above quotes.

Poignant observation: Where was the Grand Am GT during C&D's test of the best-handling cars under $30k a few years back? Why wasn't C&D's article from 11/98 re-titled: What's That? You say you'd prefer something lighter by $12,000? to use the the Grand Am GT instead of the SVT Contour as a chase car? How many times has the Grand Am GT been mentioned in the same sentence as, or tested directly against, the Audi A4, Acura Integra, or BMW 3-series sedans?

Where is the 3rd pedal on the floorboard of the current Grand Am GT?

Shall anyone bother to resurrect C&D's road test of the '95 Contour SE with its 7.4sec 0-60 time?

Ding ding ding!!! We have a winner! The Rose Nylund Medal of Intellectual Ineptitude Through Internet Comparisons Based on Lack of Facts, Experience, and/or Ownership goes to...

Hmm. Since there wasn't much excitement oozing from Pontiac in the early 90's (still true today?), I didn't pay terribly close attention to their offerings, except to remember that the old STE carried the 200hp 3.1 Litre Turbo (McLaren?) with a Getrag 5-speed gearbox, and the GTP later showed up with a 3.4 Litre Twin-Dual-Cam V6 (IIRC, a manual gearbox was available on either it or its stablemate, the Lumina Z34). Pardon my lack of memory in this area, as I do not have my stash of literature from that era here at work. I do recall that the Lumina Z34 with the 5-speed gearbox posted 0-60mph somewhere around 7.xx seconds...could you fill us in with your particular ('93 or '94?) model and its factory stock performance credentials?

Wow. I have just wasted what little effort I have put forth. How can you expect us to put any credence to your claims if you don't even know the history of your own make?

Care to tell us (without searching the internet high and low?) the V-angle of the 2.8? 3.1L/3100? 3.4L/3400? 3.4 Twin Dual Cam? 3.3L/3300? 3.8L/3800? "Fireball" V6...and where it came from?

Should I share with you a listing of the vehicles that carried the General's 3300 V6?

Or is this all just too much for you to handle until you study up on GM V6 history and grow a little 'culture' into your aspirations to be an auto enthusiast?

That "Twin dual cam" engine was one of GM's worst, it had the same paper thin reliability as the Olds Diesels, the Vega 'Potato Chip' Four, and Caddy V-8-6-4's.

It was dropped in favor of the 3800 in 97 or so. And to beat a Duratech, they need a Supercharger. Most Lumina Z34's are either beat up ghetto cruisers or in junk yards. :p