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on the truck issue, japan didn't build a truck until 04. until then they were pretend trucks and toyota has decided to build a heavy duty line. ford has had the benefit of having the best selling trucks and chevy makes outstanding trucks as well but they will have to adopt a toyota like dedication to quality if they intended to remain at the top of the game. ford particularly needs to realize that the build it right build it once philosophy is the better way to increase the bottom line.
00 black/tan svt, #2052 of 2150, born 2/1/00
formerly known as my csvt
"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than a sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." -Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Originally posted by realslimshaver:
can u Evan call the big 3 the big 3 anymore? i think the number 1 issue is the quality of the product regardless of the company. Just look at how many recalls there are on the 1995 contour alone, last time I looked it was 10. Look at what ford did with the taurus sho (96-99) in 1997 it was brought to fords attention that the engines were faulty causing the timing belt to brake and the piston to hit the valve and what did they do in 1997? They kept using them for 2 more years with no regrets. Look at how may recalls there are for the focus like 7 I believe for the 2002. and looking back at the contours the v6 in particular the plastic impellers in the water pump... the water pump is the only thing that keeps the engine from over heating when those plastic impellers brake the engine will only receive cooling from the oil (which won�t do much at all) if this problem happens in the summer you wouldn't even know until your engine stops working one day and u will never see it happening because with no coolant moving around in your system your temp gauge will reed that it is normal. And there wasn't a recall on this issue give me a brake. When ford learns to commit its self to quality control I will go back to them but Intel that time it will be only Honda and Toyota for me. Also look at the brand new 2.3 engine in the focus and Mazda 3. The water pump seals are braking. THIS IS A BRAND NEW ENGINE AND AFTER BEING IN USE FOR 6 MONTHS MANY ARE FAULTY. Who wants to drive a crap bucket that u have to pour in thousands of dollars every year to keep it on the road. If u want to look at quality look at Honda and Toyota. By brothers old 1991 4 door civic should of fallen apart years ago. It had 270000km when he got it. He had the same oil in it for over 3 years which buy the way there wasn't Evan enough to register on the dipstick. The cooling system was semi plugged due to the extremely old coolant in it. And yet the power train still kept going After taking this much abus. my gf's mom has a 98 corolla that hasen t had a problem ever. It has now 200 000km and has only ever had the fluids/brakes /filters/tires and plugs replaced. Its a 7 year old car and nothing has gone wrong. show me a ford that has done that.
Well, the 2.3 is entirely a Mazda design with no Ford input from what I know. And water pump seals dont' sound that bad as I haven't heard anything bad about the engine.
And as for Honda, Honda/Acura is losing their QC lately as their products have not been up to snuff. Ask on some TL/Accord boards and you'll see lots of tranny implosion threads. Early 90's Honda's seem to be indestructible though.
When I'm looking for a next car, I'm probably not going to be buying domestic unless they have a car that is really, really enticing. Most likely a TDI or Mazda6 2.3 will be in the cards.
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Originally posted by realslimshaver:
After taking this much abus. my gf's mom has a 98 corolla that hasen t had a problem ever. It has now 200 000km and has only ever had the fluids/brakes /filters/tires and plugs replaced. Its a 7 year old car and nothing has gone wrong. show me a ford that has done that.
1) My Dad's '88 CrownVictoria Wagon sold at 310,000km
Problems other than maintenance: Talegate wouldn't open to the side
2) Uncles '95 Explorer Eddie Bauer current milage: 250,000km
Problems other than maintenance: none
3) The Mistique. Current milage: 290,000km
Problems other than maintenance: waterpump, bearings (one wheel)
4) Grandpa's 1980 F-150. Don't remember milage. was still running when we got rid of it last year due to rust. Still ran better than his '95 chevy
My Cars
1999 Silver Frost SVT - 80,000km #2603/2760 Aug. 10, 1999.
1996 Mercury Mystique LS V6 MTX - retired @ 323,151km.
1995 Ford Contour V6 MTX-sold @ 214,000km
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i think another issiue is gas mileage.(all of this info was taken out of the 2005 energuide which is produced with by canadian government in association with the automoible manifactures of canada)
lets look at the sub compact and compact classes mpg. when i was searching for a new car i learned of some amasing figures. all of these are and inline 4 with a 5speed gear box.
ford focus 5speed 31/46
chevy aveo 5speed 32/46
chevy cavalear 5speed 30/47
dodge sx 2.0 5speed 35/48
honda civic 5speed 38/50
hyundai accent 5speed 35/43
kia rio 5speed 30/41
mazda 3 5speed 33/46
nissan sentra 5speed 33/46
toyota carolla 5speed 40/53
toyota echo 42/54
vw golf tdi 5speed 46/61
with riseing gas prices there are only 3 companies that have cars rated at 50+ for highway. honda toyota and vw. only toyota and vw broke the 40+ mark for city driveing. fearther more where are these hybrid viechales that gm and ford are working on. honda has the insite hybrid the civic hybryd and accord. toyota has the pirous. and what does ford have the escape hybrid. WHY NOT A FOCUS HYBRID. WHY NOT A CAVILEAR. thow gm is working on there results where is chrysler in this? there is only one way gas will go...up.
RIP Frank Foreman. March 15 2005. died in a tragic car crash at the age of 18.<Drive Safe>
1995 Contour gl Zetec auto.
178000km
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Posts: 174
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I don't mind recalls. It's when companies ignore widespread problems reported by their consumers(plastic water pump impeller eh?)....and/or when you have to prove to the dealer that there is actually a recall (what wiring harness recall?)....and/or your engine blows up, because the on-ramp is a little to long, right angled that I start to get a little disenchanted.
R.I.P. 05/06/2004 106K
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Originally posted by realslimshaver:
i think another issiue is gas mileage.(all of this info was taken out of the 2005 energuide which is produced with by canadian government in association with the automoible manifactures of canada)
lets look at the sub compact and compact classes mpg. when i was searching for a new car i learned of some amasing figures. all of these are and inline 4 with a 5speed gear box.
ford focus 5speed 31/46
chevy aveo 5speed 32/46
chevy cavalear 5speed 30/47
dodge sx 2.0 5speed 35/48
honda civic 5speed 38/50
hyundai accent 5speed 35/43
kia rio 5speed 30/41
mazda 3 5speed 33/46
nissan sentra 5speed 33/46
toyota carolla 5speed 40/53
toyota echo 42/54
vw golf tdi 5speed 46/61
with riseing gas prices there are only 3 companies that have cars rated at 50+ for highway. honda toyota and vw. only toyota and vw broke the 40+ mark for city driveing. fearther more where are these hybrid viechales that gm and ford are working on. honda has the insite hybrid the civic hybryd and accord. toyota has the pirous. and what does ford have the escape hybrid. WHY NOT A FOCUS HYBRID. WHY NOT A CAVILEAR. thow gm is working on there results where is chrysler in this? there is only one way gas will go...up.
I agree.
In North America, there's a paradigm shift that's occuring, albeit slowly, to a European mentality wrt cars. GM and ford just have their heads up their asses and can't see it.
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Originally posted by sigma:
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Infiniti G35: 51... AGE: 0
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Honda Accord (V6): 40... AGE: 0
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Nissan Altima (V6): 40... AGE: 1
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Mazda6s: 22... AGE: 0
(Note this car is produced at a Ford facility in Michigan)
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Ford Taurus: 20... AGE: 3
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Ford Focus: 10... AGE: 3
I picked those purely at random. Surprising results?
Not surprising at all! Older models SHOULD have less recalls than BRAND NEW models
(note: "age" defined as # of years BEFORE 2003 that particular iteration was produced... eg, new taurus was first built in 2000, G35 was all new in 03)
edit: minirant: For the Taurus to have TWENTY issues THREE full years after its redesign (i don't even think it was an all new model, just a facelift, though I could be mistaken) is ridiculous. And the Focus is Ford's posterchild of "improvement in reliability" and it still has 10 issues 3 years after release.
And wtf is with the automakers turning into software makers all of the sudden? Cars are not meant to be beta tested. Software is released, then all the problems fixed later. That's easy: download a patch, install, fixed. CARS SHOULD NOT BE THE SAME!!! It involves taking your car into the dealer, leaving it for some length of time, and being at the mercy of the tech.
[napoleon]GOSH[/napoleon]
/minirant
Last edited by mbTDI; 03/02/05 11:58 PM.
Diesel owns you
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Posts: 197
CEG\'er
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Originally posted by ODC:
Originally posted by realslimshaver:
i think another issiue is gas mileage.(all of this info was taken out of the 2005 energuide which is produced with by canadian government in association with the automoible manifactures of canada)
lets look at the sub compact and compact classes mpg. when i was searching for a new car i learned of some amasing figures. all of these are and inline 4 with a 5speed gear box.
ford focus 5speed 31/46
chevy aveo 5speed 32/46
chevy cavalear 5speed 30/47
dodge sx 2.0 5speed 35/48
honda civic 5speed 38/50
hyundai accent 5speed 35/43
kia rio 5speed 30/41
mazda 3 5speed 33/46
nissan sentra 5speed 33/46
toyota carolla 5speed 40/53
toyota echo 42/54
vw golf tdi 5speed 46/61
with riseing gas prices there are only 3 companies that have cars rated at 50+ for highway. honda toyota and vw. only toyota and vw broke the 40+ mark for city driveing. fearther more where are these hybrid viechales that gm and ford are working on. honda has the insite hybrid the civic hybryd and accord. toyota has the pirous. and what does ford have the escape hybrid. WHY NOT A FOCUS HYBRID. WHY NOT A CAVILEAR. thow gm is working on there results where is chrysler in this? there is only one way gas will go...up.
I agree.
In North America, there's a paradigm shift that's occuring, albeit slowly, to a European mentality wrt cars. GM and ford just have their heads up their asses and can't see it.
is chrysler even doing anything at all to help shift climate change. at least ford and gm are working on hybrid stuff. all chrysler seams to be doing is makeing there new gas guzzleing HEMIs.
RIP Frank Foreman. March 15 2005. died in a tragic car crash at the age of 18.<Drive Safe>
1995 Contour gl Zetec auto.
178000km
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Hard-core CEG\'er
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Originally posted by mbTDI:
Originally posted by sigma:
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Infiniti G35: 51... AGE: 0
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Honda Accord (V6): 40... AGE: 0
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Nissan Altima (V6): 40... AGE: 1
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Mazda6s: 22... AGE: 0
(Note this car is produced at a Ford facility in Michigan)
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Ford Taurus: 20... AGE: 3
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2003 Ford Focus: 10... AGE: 3
I picked those purely at random. Surprising results?
Not surprising at all! Older models SHOULD have less recalls than BRAND NEW models
(note: "age" defined as # of years BEFORE 2003 that particular iteration was produced... eg, new taurus was first built in 2000, G35 was all new in 03)
Fair enough. Good observation.
So, one could assume that if the 2003s were new designs that the previous model years should have less because they were the pinnacle of the previous design and had the bugs worked out, right?
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2002 Honda Accord EX (V6): 28
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2002 Nissan Altima (V6): 70
And since I obviously can't use the 2002 G35 since it didn't exist, how about the 2002 I35, which I believe was an old model:
Number of Recalls, TSBs, etc on the 2002 Infiniti I35: 37
Quote:
For the Taurus to have TWENTY issues THREE full years after its redesign (i don't even think it was an all new model, just a facelift, though I could be mistaken) is ridiculous. And the Focus is Ford's posterchild of "improvement in reliability" and it still has 10 issues 3 years after release.
In the grand scheme of things 20 issues ain't bad, and 10 is incredibly good. Very few cars have less than 10 reported issues. Even the venerable Civic has over 20 for most every model year and over 70 in some years.
2003 Mazda6s 3.0L MTX
Webpage
2004 Mazda3s 2.3L ATX
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Originally posted by realslimshaver:
is chrysler even doing anything at all to help shift climate change. at least ford and gm are working on hybrid stuff. all chrysler seams to be doing is makeing there new gas guzzleing HEMIs.
Not really. But aside the fact, they're moving their cars.
My issue is that Ford and GM are not excelling at anything. Reliable commuters, or hi-po cars.
You guys should read some of the [censored] that goes on GMinsidenews
http://forums.gminsidenews.com/showthread.php?t=11057
Quote:
This is sad. Look import buyers, you are putting AMERICANS out of business because of your ignorance towards AMERICAN-built vehicles.
And now the rest of the thread they're arguing why one guy would possibly want a TSX MTX over a G6 GT ATX 
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