I think I've decided that I want to keep the price below $300 so that kind of limits it now. So now it is basically the 20gb iPod ($270), 20gb Zen Touch ($~250), 40gb Zen Xtra ($~250), and 20gb Karma ($~250). Too many decisions for an indecisive person like me. I've spent the past hour or so reading horror stories for all the different players.. haha. I guess its now between which has better features, doesn't break as often, and looks better.