it just died - CEG Archives

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this is my first ford and my first post. i just bought a 95 contour on monday from a used dealer and all has been well until this morning. as i was driving to work the car just died while i was on the thruway . it just quit with no sign of a problem before it quit. it would turn over fine but wouldn't fire as if there was no spark. i had the car towed home and when i tried to start it, it started right up??!! it ran for about 3 minutes and quit again!! now it wont start again. fuel pump is starting when the key is turned but i don't know where i can check the line to see if there is pressure in the line, as i said this is my first ford and i am unfamiliar with the way things are set up(always had gm)i pulled the plugs and the electrodes were so worn as i have never seen before and open to around .075 which i know is not normal, they actually looked like they may have been OE. i was going to change fuel filter and plugs tommorow and go from there. any other suggestions on what i may be able to look at as i would like to fix this on my own. thanks and sorry for the long post. scott

Welcome to CEG!!!

a few more details would help.

a 95.. okay.. V6 or I4? miles? manual/auto? any known maintenance history at ALL? CEL light on?

You might consider placing your year/make/model/engine/mileage in your sig. It certainly speeds the help process.

Also.. where are you from? check out the forums with your state in them (regional forums) and perhaps someone close would help you out.. that's how CEG is!

Ray

sorry about the details. it's a v6 , automatic with 115,000 and the service light comes on after about 10 minutes of drive time but has no noticable effect on the cars performance. scott

Cool.. well, being a 95, you have an OBD-I equipped car (you can read codes on your own, without a code reader)

Link to how-to Read up on that, or buy a code reader for around $50(and up) and report the code.. even if the light is off, the code will be in memory.

Give us the code number, and we'll be able to VASTLY narrow down your problem.

Do the basic maintenance:
Using the Duratec Maintenance FAQ you can find how-tos for:

plugs(OEM or Autolite APP764 Double plats)
air filter
clean the MAF
Fuel filter wires (Motorcraft recommended)
another plug/wire post

Also, you will NO DOUBT benefit from a complete UIM/LIM teardown

Get back to us with that code, however you decide to retrieve it.

If you can, get the code read for the Check engine light (CEL). Autozone will read codes for free, bring the code back here and just search troubleshooting for the code and that should give you a good idea. Also post here so we can help you out as well.

EDIT: Scratch that, didn't realize it was a 95. I didn't know you could read the codes on a 95 w/no special tools, thats cool!

FWIW: Autozone will not read OBD-I codes.. 99.9999999% of the time.

Ray

Interesting article about how to read OBD-1 codes. I never knew you could do that so easily... I guess you do learn something new every day...

i read the post for reading the codes and am not sure if i understand. i have a test light but what is the proceedure? i have to do it myself as the car won't allow me to take it to get it done. (damn fords)

A) Jump the single pigtail connector to pin 2 of the main connector.
B) Turn key to on (not start) and count the CEL flashes.

Welcome Scott.

Stop by the Northeast forum, there probably is a person or two in your area that could possibly help you out.

i checked the codes and i came up with a 332 2 times , 123 and 211, if i did this correctly. now today after the car sat overnight it again started right up and ran till it got to operating temp i would guess and then quit again and wouldn't start back up.i changed the plugs and it runs much smoother. tell me what you think as i will also try to make a trip to the parts store in the morn to get it scanned. thanks , scott

Welcome.

332 EGR (do the suck test and clean EGR). 123 TPS (clean the TB to see if it will help). 211 PCM signal (erratic or faulty, check wiring and connection).

Edit.
Ray's detailed suck test.

0401
EGR Flow insufficient

The EGR is the "UFO looking device on the top of the engine's UIM (silver round device at the back driver's side of the top of the engine. The EGR passages flow from the EGR, in to the side of the Throttle body.

I would suggest the following:
Remove (and reinstall) the negative cable of your battery (or pull fuses 4 & 11 for the PCM's KAM (memory)

TEST YOUR EGR:
(remove the green vacuum hose from the top, being careful as it is brittle, and applying a vacuum (suck on it! lol) to see if the car stumbles while running. this indicates a properly operating EGR.

Does it work properly?

NO:
Replace the EGR

YES
Purchase a TB gasket, and remove the air plenum (rubber accordion tube) then remove the TB. Clean the EGR passage (small cut-out in the outer edge of the TB's mating surface) really well, install a new gasket and re-attach the TB.

If the passages are not dirty, or crud-filled, then look at replacing the DPFE(Differential Pressure Feedback for the EGR)

thanks for the quick post. what is the suck test? and where do i find the egr.

Above as edited for EGR suck test. Below is from the Duratec Maintenance FAQ UIM/LIM rebuilding. You will see a picture of the fore finger next to the UFO silver lookng thing (EGR). In addition, it will also have the TB at the picture below it. You do need new gaskets for both of them. Good luck.

http://www.contour.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=v6maint&Number=931756&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=186&fpart=1

Edit.
TB cleaning
http://www.contour.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=v6maint&Number=337774&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1

And gap the spark plugs to 0.054 inch.

i will check this in the morning as the car runs well when it's cold. where will i find these fuses? thanx, scott

I don't know what the failure rate of Hall effects sensors on Contours is, but if my motorcycle did this, that's what I'd be looking at. Heat will cause the sensor to expand, open the crack, fail the sensor and kill the ignition. When it cools down, the crack closes up and the sensor works again. It can be checked by measuring resistance while heating it up. If the resistance changes, it's a bad sensor.

just an update on this problem.i pulled the #5 6 plugs and have no spark. can the egr cause this or should i be looking at something else such as the coil pack or something else ignition related? thanx again for all the info given, scott

Originally posted by scotta68:
just an update on this problem.i pulled the #5 6 plugs and have no spark. can the egr cause this or should i be looking at something else such as the coil pack or something else ignition related? thanx again for all the info given, scott

Replace the crank sensor. That 211 code indicates the computer has lost the PIP (Profile Ignition Pickup) signal from it. That's why the engine is dying and currently has no spark. The EGR system won't cause this.

Steve

sorry to keep posting,but i am trying to exhaust all possible solutions. so far no one has mentioned anything about the control module . i checked the coil pack from info that i got from autozone site for the ohms and all was well. a mechanic friend told me to change the control module but this is an expensive part and dont want to part with the cash if i don't need to. when i went to get a crank position sensor, they have to order and i was told i need a special driver, is this correct and is there anywhere on the site with a how to for this? thanks for all, again, scott

Regular old bolt to remove.

From Ford CD.
Crankshaft Position Sensor
Removal
1. Disconnect battery ground cable.
2. Raise vehicle on a hoist (or jack up and put on jack stands).
3. On 2.5L engine-equipped vehicles, remove splash shield from RH front fender apron.
4. Disconnect the fuel charging wiring or engine control sensor wiring (depending upon application) from the crankshaft position sensor (CKP sensor).
5. Remove crankshaft position sensor retaining bolt and remove crankshaft position sensor.

Installation
1. Make sure crankshaft position sensor mounting surface is clean. If equipped, make sure that the crankshaft position sensor O-ring is in proper location on crankshaft position sensor.
2. CAUTION: Do not overtighten crankshaft position sensor retaining bolt or damage to the crankshaft position sensor may occur.
Position crankshaft position sensor and install retaining bolt. On 2.0L engine-equipped vehicles, tighten retaining bolt to 6-9 N-m (53-80 lb-in). On 2.5L engine-equipped vehicles, tighten retaining bolt to 8-12 N-m (71-106 lb-in).
3. Properly route fuel charging wiring or engine control sensor wiring (depending upon application) and connect electrical connector to crankshaft position sensor.
4. On 2.5L engine-equipped vehicles, install splash shield. Tighten retaining screws securely.
5. Lower vehicle.
6. Connect battery ground cable.

Edit. Picture compliments of Chongo.

Originally posted by chongo:

See if the wires harness is lose. Tough to test it as the PID's on the service cd need the car running.
Autozone sells them for $13.99
CRANKSHAFT POSITION SENSOR
1998 FORD CONTOUR WELLS SU292 3 MO $13.99

i just made an attemt to take the sensor out and i believe i broke it with the sensor in the block... what now? it is still in 1 piece but is very loose as a whole part.

replaced the crank sensor and got the same result, ran for about 30 seconds and died again. again pulled a plug and no spark. where to go now? scott

1. Check wiring going to pcm on upper firewall on passenger side. Is the insulation brittle, are any wires exposed and touching another? If so separate the wires and try to start.

2. Test or replace camshaft position sensor...about 10 bucks. You already replaced crankshaft position sensor.

3. When you were on the highway and the car died, did it die while you had the gas pedal pressed or did you let up on the gas pedal and it just died? When you start the car up and it ran for 30 seconds, was it at idle or while you were giving it gas?

If the problem only occurs at idle or when your foot is off the gas, I would replace IAC.

Are your battery connections clean and tight?

Bob

when it died while driving i had the cruise on and there was no hard acceleration at the time and when i had it running today i was giving it a little gas and when i let it off it died. thanks, scott

changed the cam sensor, still nothing... ignition control module next or something else??!! starting to get aggrevated