Water in Gas - what should get replaced / done?

[PaulMN]

Monday my usually trusty Mystique would crank but not start. Occasionally it would start at idle, but it would die in a couple seconds. If I touched the throttle it would die instantly. I couldn't find an obvious problem. No MIL, no codes pending. Checked sensors- all looked OK. I came here and searched, maybe IAC, probably not MAF, then found that one post! Could it be? I asked my wife "Did you get gas?" "Yes, right before I came home Sunday. I remember they were having some trouble with the pumps." Saturday we had 4 inches of rain, tornadoes in the area.

I found the cause of the problem: water in the gas. My wife put in 5 gallons to top off, because we had to get relatives to the airport first thing Monday morning. I disconnected the fuel line after the filter and attached a hose to the filter. I pulled the fuel pump relay and jumpered the two wide terminals to power the fuel pump. I emptied the tank (in stages, using a mix of gas cans and plastic jugs) of about 14.5 gals. After decanting what came out, I have roughly 6 gallons of what settled, and 9 gals of gas. The junk that settled looks like dark beer. I do not plan to use the decanted gas, it looks greenish - yellow, and is somewhat cloudy.

I hooked the gas line up and put 2 gals of the decanted gas in the tank. Then I hooked up a drain at the Schrader fuel pressure test port using a test gage, and ran a gallon out to flush the gas line. With the pump running I closed the test gage valve to flush the return line (got 40PSI), then opened the valve and ran the rest out. (When I saw more bubbles than gas in the line I stopped. ) I got a bit of water both times, less than a cup, I'm assuming that's what was in the lines.

I put in 2 bottles of gas treatment, and 5 gals of fresh gas. Car started up, and is now running great. I plan to replace the fuel filter. I have 180,000 miles on this car.

The gas station owner readily admitted the problem, and gave me their insurance company's contact info. I will file a claim. The insurance company told me to bill whatever is customary for this work, plus any parts costs.

My questions for the experts:
1) Do I need to replace the fuel pump strainer (sock)?
2) Is there a need to drop the tank to clean / empty it completely?
3) What would a repair shop charge to do what I've done (how much should I bill), including any further work you recommend?
Thanks!

 

[Cloudx]

Go get a new fuel pump installed and bill 'em!

 

[DuratecDave]

As far as I know, the pump strainer (sock) isn't available by itself - comes with a new pump. When I recently swapped out mine, it didn't look like the strainer (two legs of it) was easily removable, if at all. At 180K on a metal gas tank, I'd say drop and clean it, but with our plastic tank, I see no reason myself. Your best bet might be to get written estimates from shops for the work you've already done since you are dealing with insurance. I am thinking $4-500 neighborhood repair bill, plus the cost of gas, filter, treatment, etc. Water is heavier than gas, so if there is any left, it should settle to the bottom of the tank, above the pickup. If you remove the rear seat bottom, you can access the fuel pump, remove it, and pump out the gas (and potential remaining water) from above without dropping the tank. Park the car uphill or downhill if possible. I don't think I'd use an electric shop vac .... maybe a pneumatic vacuum (suction gun) or a air powered drill and a pump (Flotec @ Lowes $5.00) with a section of old garden hose. Or an old sump pump out of a boat? Then again, since you've drained the bad gas and its running good on fresh gas, it sounds like problem solved? Take a picture or two of the gas you have bottled and save the new gas receipts. Atleast my dealing with insurance has been like pulling teeth, document everything, be patient but firm.

 

[PaulMN]

Rockauto has the strainers, less than $20. From the photo, it looks like they snap on.

I'd love to stick the ins co with a fuel pump, but I don't think it would fly. It's the gas station's insurance, not mine. I snapped a few photos of the process and the gas. There's no argument from them at all of fault, at least they're decent about it so far.

I pulled the rear seat to see how big a pita pulling the pump might be, lots of rust on the top of the pump, retaining ring and tank flange. At least you don't have to drop the tank on this car to do it, and the '97 pump should go thru the hole without enlarging it. Pulling the pump and reinstalling it might end badly:nonono:..... lately the road salts have been extremely aggressive corrosive agents. Last year I had to replace the trans cooler lines and PS cooler lines they corroded thru and leaked. I'm reluctant to pull the pump just for a look.

I stopped at the gas station and asked if they used a filter, the guy there went and grabbed a replacement. It is a cartridge like an oil filter, and said on it 75% efficient @ 10 microns. I'm thinking I'll open up the old fuel filter to see what the crud looks like since I strained the whole tank through it. If it's not horrible, the screen probably isn't too bad either.

I haven't put any more gas in the tank, and have put 100 miles on the first 5 gals, so there should be less than 2 left. It still runs great, so I'm thinking I'll dump in 2 more bottles of Zecol gas treatment and fill the tank tonight.

Further comments and thoughts are appreciated, thanks guys!

 

[PaulMN]

Update:
I put in 2 more bottles of Zecol gas treatment and filled the tank. Next day I changed the fuel filter. The fuel in the filter had an ounce of water in it and a small amount of crud. I opened the old fuel filter to asses how much crud got sucked thru when I drained the tank, there wasn't much, so I don't think there is any need to pull the fuel pump.
The car is running better than it has in a long time. I suspect that I had a small amount of water in the tank all along. I think that dumping the fuel filter to check for water is worthwhile if there is any reason to suspect bad gas.

Anyone know what would a repair shop would charge to do the work I've done (how much should I bill the insurance co?)

 

[PaulMN]

Followup on the Insurance:
I billed about $525 materials and labor, and had to argue with them that $50/ hr is a very low labor rate, and that yes, this did take about 8 hours. I learned that my bill was about median for the claims they got from this indecent. The ignorant claims adjuster told me of one shop that "dropped the tank" on a customers vehicle, thinking that they let the tank fall to the ground! Ultimately they paid my claim, but refused to pay for the tank of gas! I ended up getting about $475. Magic words when dealing with insurance companies "you are not negotiating in good faith" and "let me speak with your supervisor".