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V6 timing question

G

gorman

Hard-core CEG'er
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Messages
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Hey guys i need some clarification;

i'm in the middle of a cam swap. I set the engine to TDC. The haynes manual said rotate crank to 3 o'clock and remove bank 1 timing stuff and cams ....i did.

The manual then said; rotate crank 1 3/4 turns to 11 o'clock and remove bank 2 stuff ... i did that too. I didn't move anything and just swapped the new cams on bank 2 straight in.

The manual then said rotate crank to 3 o'clock and install bank 1 stuff. I've now down that but looking at the photo's in the manual the bank 1 cam's positions are not quite the same as their photo's.

I marked the chain links for the cam's timing marks and crank keyway and everything is where it should be on that score.

What i am finding confusing is the reference to 3 o'clock and 11 o'clock etc.. because it seems with the crank it seems to be in relation to the sump pan and when refering to the cam's ... it seems to be in relation to the head orientation...

has anyone else found the photo's misleading ?
can someone who's done this please confirm as long as the chain markings line up, everything else will be ok ... just worried about putting everything back only to have to do it again ...thanks G.
 
11 o clock and put on bank 1, line up the marks on chain and cams and crank pulley, then install bank 2, same way. rotate motor and make sure nothing hits. this is all i did and it worked flawless. all i did was make sure all the marks lined up
 
pre98zetec said:
11 o clock and put on bank 1, line up the marks on chain and cams and crank pulley, then install bank 2, same way.
Click to expand...
Hi pre98zetec; thanks for that run thru. Can i ask if you rotated the crank at all when installing bank 1 ... cos when i tried installing bank 1 the first time, the bank 1 inlet cam was pressing down on a valve spring until i rotated the crank to 3 o'clock as per manual.
Anyone with other install tips would appreciated as i'm zipping it all up today ... thanks ...G.
 
ok thanks .. i think i'm stuck between two installation methods. I think i'll have to see if i can get the RFF and arrow markings on the back of the cam's to all line up .... they did before i started. Thanks ...G.
 
the way I read as long as the marks all line up on cams/chain/gears everything will be fine. This was my first time timing a V6 and I found it to be retarded easy, I think most of the how-to's and directions make it sound more difficult than it actually is.
 
well i'm glad to know i've graduated the retard club lol.

I've re-timed the engine and the bank 1 RFF timing marks are again half a tooth out of alignment when everything else is lined up. I swear all the RFF marks lined up perfectly before.... but the motor does turn without binding. I vaguely remember other guys asking about this and being re-assured as you said. The cam timing marks are 11 links apart and the crank timing mark is 23 links from the second cam timing link. Can anyone confirm that this is what they know to be right ?.... G.
 
ok mystery solved.
Bank 1 exhaust cam had slipped half a link and was chucking everything out of true.
All 8 RFF flags now line up at TDC as well as the chain links and timing marks.
I found the link spacings to be 11 between cam timing marks (that is, the 11th link is on the second cam timing mark in the sequence) and 23 between 2nd cams' timing mark and the crank timing mark (again 23rd link is on the crank timing mark ) .... if anyone disagrees with this, please let me know asap thanks.. G..
 
agreed. 10 links between cam's timing marks and 23 on bank 1 crank. I n fact i just counted the links between copper links on my chains.
I didn't remove the bank 1 crank cog so i can't say where the timing mark is on bank 2 crank cog... so that's good you posted 25 links. This is good info. that i haven't seen posted anywhere and it's not in my haynes book.

I understood your use of the word retarded ... that's why i posted lol. I didn't find it hard either... i just didn't see the chain slip each time i installed the guide and tensioner. I guess i should have checked more carefully the first time. Anyway, thanks for replying... having someone to think aloud to, made all the difference ....G.
 
No problem! I searched forever before i timed my 3l cause i was scared and could never find a to-the-point tutorial and then I found that link I sent, even though there's no real instructions, just knowing the number of links between cams/crank was all I really needed.
 
does anyone know if all or just some SVT/ST200 camshafts have the mis-stamped flags ? Is there a batch number ?
Mine are from an ST200 with the larger chains ( i have the narrow too).
The ST24 cam's i just removed definately lined up properly (front and back) before removal and i've managed to get the new ones to do the same.... G.
 
are you talking about the markings on the back of the cams? I've read numerous times to ignore those and just pay attention to the markings on the front, as the back markings are sometimes spot on but other times completely of.
 
pre98zetec said:
are you talking about the markings on the back of the cams?.
Click to expand...
yes. If you look, they are timing marks for Ford and Jaguar engines. My ST24 cam's i just took out lined up front and back.... this leads me to wonder if this was a problem with early camshafts.
pre98zetec said:
I've read numerous times to ignore those and just pay attention to the markings on the front, as the back markings are sometimes spot on but other times completely of.
Click to expand...
I did time the engine with the front markings and it just followed the rear lined up too. Did your 3.0L build line up front and rear ? ...G.
 
Any chance you still have the tension out? We RE-DID the timing (pulled the engine AGAIN). After everything was back in (and marks this time lined up as shown in the manuals and described above), and engine installed, connected, etc., I found a small piece clinging to a screw driver, which I recognized as a part from the back of the tensioner. See my post here:

http://www.contour.org/ceg-vb/showt...issig-part-Duratec-engine&p=810879#post810879

If you still have it out, or another laying around: could you take pics of the backside showing the piece, and then a few more pics with the 1 and both pieces off to see what is underneath. Or describe from your observation what the function is. And consequently what might happen WITHOUT the darn piece. Hat to destroy the engine, but also hat to take the engine out a 3rd time.
 
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