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Rear wheel howling and skipping? Very strange tire wear

A

az5oh

CEG'er
Joined
Aug 14, 2007
Messages
98
Location
Ann Arbor/EL, MI
I jacked up my CSVT today, ready to install new hub/wheel bearing assemblies and found that everything appears to be tight (I pushed and pulled on the tire and tried to wobble from side to side).

I did, however, find the strangest looking right rear tire wear that I've ever seen.

Any ideas what could be causing this? The inner side of the tire is worn bald in spots every few inches around circumference of the tire. It's as if the tire is rolling, then dragging (or skipping), then repeating this practice throughout a rotation.
 

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Rear toe is screwed up, the tire should be pointing (for the most part...) straight forward, but it's not, likely it's toed out. I would look for a bent rear lateral link (control arm or toe arm).

When you take these cars to a tire shop, you're at the mercy of the half-wit jack-wielding thugs who will put a jack under the rear control arms to lift the car, and this bends the **** out of the arms, as they're just stamped steel, and the toe gets severely messed up. I've taken these arms off and straightened them in a big vise using a long straight edge to gauge them. Look in the FS classifieds here, there are usually some rear toe arms for sale. If you get stuck, PM me, I have a good straight set. Then take the car to a good alignment shop.

BTW, the tire is toast, you'll have to replace it.

Edit: Here's one of the factory toe arms (top) with a Massive aftermarket replacement shown for comparison.
P4100009.jpg
 
Stance nation maybe????? Just kidding, I second what gromell said above.. I've seen stupid ppl lift a car in the worse way possible. Such as lifting by a floor pan and watching the jack punch clean through... or lifting by the toe arm and watching the car go form normal ride to STANCE NATION HELLAFLUSH!! that sad part is it wasnt intentional. I watched a friend lift a WRX the other day by the axle itself.... I just walked away from him and the stupidness pouring out everywhere..

A secong though although I am assuming you would have checked this first.. THose tires appear to be directional and I can't tell you HOW many times I've seen tires wear like that from being installed the wrong way such as after a tire rotaion when the tech isn't paying attention
 
az5oh said:
Thank you both! Looks like rockauto has them: http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=5792124&cc=1303940&jnid=524&jpid=7

How much would this have to be bent in order to cause the tire cupping pictured?
Click to expand...

It's not a matter of degree that determs how bad the tire will get.. basically this is a prime example of why I hate the whole "Stance" stupid ness. Tires are designed to ride straight up and down as well as inline relative to the vehicle they are mounted on.

Part of the job of your suspension components is to keep these things "inline" regardless how much the suspension is traveling. Now there will be some obvious deflection if the suspension is fully compressed vs fully unloaded. Hence why most of the tie a alignment is required after lowering a car to ensure everything is squared away. but 90% of the time your tires ride straight up and down, unless obviosuly something is out of line or broken in the suspension..

All it takes is the tire to be ridden on say .07 degrees or so off of it's "true" axis and this CAN be the end result.

Honestly they look like snow tires, meaning they have steel belts inside the tire that help them retain their shape from being beat to hell on the roads/bumps.. Once these belts break they will also cause the same affect to the tire, making the tires warp

Add these two problems together and you are now compounding the issue ontop of itself.. Basically this will KILL tires VERY quickly, just like the morons who "stance" their cars. Sorry for those that do the whole "stance scene" but your stupid, and have ZERO knowledge of how/why your stupid and I basically explained why, see above sentences :)

Back to the task at hand.. So lets recap shall we?? Broken/bent suspension components put extra stress on the tires (and everything else mind you) and the tires themselves being belt radials have certain steel belts the run the circumference of the tire.. When these break or are out of line they will cause the tire to dis form and do what you are experiencing here.. not ALL the time.. but most of the time.

Again I can't help but stress this. Make sure the tires IF DIRECTIONAL (which they appear to be) are mounted so they roll the CORRECT direction.. <---This will ALSO kill a tire VERY quickly.
 
az5oh said:
How much would this have to be bent in order to cause the tire cupping pictured?
Click to expand...

It's hard to say on the bent part, but I've seen toe arms with a 1/2" of bow, relative to a straightedge, that will cause 3/16" of toe change from neutral toe, and 3/16" of toe-in or toe-out on one side will damage a tire quickly and irreparably. And "quickly" is just a few thousand miles. You've been hearing this tire go bad; unless you're deaf or you play the stereo very loudly, this tire has been making a loud thrumming noise that tracks vehicle speed.
 
So I took a look under the car and it appears that the toe arm that is on the opposite side of the car is bent and not the toe arm to the wheel/tire that is cupping, is that possible?

The tire/wheel on bent toe arm appears to be in relatively decent shape, at least I comparison to the cupped tire.

Also, the alignment shop told me that the toe arm bolts that mount to the subframe are too rusted and need to be replaced. Does anyone know what size they are or where I can order some new ones?

Thx!
 
So I took a look under the car and it appears that the toe arm that is on the opposite side of the car is bent and not the toe arm to the wheel/tire that is cupping, is that possible?

The tire/wheel on bent toe arm appears to be in relatively decent shape, at least I comparison to the cupped tire.

Also, the alignment shop told me that the toe arm bolts that mount to the subframe are too rusted and need to be replaced. Does anyone know what size they are or where I can order some new ones?

Thx!
 
So I took a look under the car and it appears that the toe arm that is on the opposite side of the car is bent and not the toe arm to the wheel/tire that is cupping, is that possible?

The tire/wheel on bent toe arm appears to be in relatively decent shape, at least I comparison to the cupped tire.

Also, the alignment shop told me that the toe arm bolts that mount to the subframe are too rusted and need to be replaced. Does anyone know what size they are or where I can order some new ones?

Thx!
 
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