Help me figure out this A/C issue (video inside)

[Slow5.0hh]

Hello all,
My dad is having problems with his ’99 Contour LX, to be more precise with his A/C. It goes back to last summer when he was low on freon, so I used 2 of those bottles from Autozone to fill it, and it was blowing cold air for almost 2 weeks, and then every day less and less. We checked few things here and there (including A/C Cycle Switch) and finally gave up which helped in a bit since summer was pretty much gone.

Now this year we were thinking of trading his car for something newer and better but prices on these newer cars are enormous, even worse than last years, at least in our area, so he decided to change few minor parts and try to fix his A/C and keep it for atleast 1 to 2 more years.

I Bought 12oz High Mileage 134A freon from Walmart with 4oz Stop Leak with dye by ID 2 weeks ago, added it to the system, and no leaks at all, but still not blowing colr air like it should. Extended cycle time for a few seconds but that’s about it.
So this morning he took it to Firestone store to have them take a look at it, and they added 1/2lb of freon so they could check it & told him that he was low on Freon and cooling fan wasn’t working. Charged him $31.79 (saved 10 bucks with their coupon) for it and he was on his way.

After work I checked all fuses/relays and everything seems to be in order, even fan is kicking in, compressor as well, it’s blowing cold air a little bit, but not enough.
I recorded it with my digital camera with 320x240 resolution, since it only shoots up to 30 secs in higher resolution (640x480), and had no time to charge battery on my real camera, so hopefully you guys don’t mind crappy video.

http://www.erietuners.com/videos/MVI_2179.AVI

So let’s see what’s your opinion/suggestion…

Thanks in advance.

 

[BrApple]

its not working because the system was not filled correctly.

if you had to add R-134A then there is a leak in the system. I do hope that you check the pressures before you went and added any refridgerant?

now there could be a clutch air gap issue but since you haven't indicated that you have used the propper tools to work on the system I don't have an idea of what the issue might be.

 

[Tony2005]

...clutch air gap issue ....

This was what went through my mind when I saw the compressor stop when the radiator fan kicked on. When it was too hot, the a/c compressor clutch gave out.

clutchgap, airgap, clutchairgap,

http://www.contour.org/ceg-vb/showthread.php?t=16296&highlight=clutchgap

Edit. Some help from the web. This is for a Mustang. The Contour is similar.

Ford Mustang A/C Compressor Clutch
Q. Hello: I have a 1995 Ford Mustang, 3.8 liter V-6 and manual transmission that recently had an A/C clutch assembly that has stopped working per the mechanic, in his words, the magnetic portion that engages the A/C had actually fallen off. The compressor works and when it did kick on, the A/C blew cold.

Question I have is if I get the A/C clutch assembly myself, is it easy enough for a do-it-yourselfer to replace that A/C clutch?
Daniel
A. I don't really know what you level of expertise is, but I will give you the procedure and you can decide if you're up to the task. You'll need a special tool, but I think you may be able to substitute something else to do the job.

Compressor Clutch Holding Tool T94P-19703-AH REMOVAL:

1. Hold A/C clutch with Compressor Clutch Holding Tool T94P-19703-AH and remove the A/C clutch hub retaining bolt.

1. Pull A/C clutch and A/C clutch hub spacers from A/C compressor shaft.

1. If A/C clutch cannot be pulled from A/C compressor shaft, screw an 8 mm x 1.25 mm bolt into the shaft hole of the A/C clutch to force it from the shaft.

1. Remove A/C clutch pulley retaining snap ring.
2. Pull the A/C clutch pulley from the A/C compressor.

INSTALLATION:

1. Clean pulley bearing surface of A/C compressor head to remove any dirt or corrosion.
2. Install A/C clutch pulley on A/C compressor. The bearing is a slip-fit on the A/C compressor head and, if properly aligned, should slip on easily.
3. Install A/C clutch pulley retaining snap ring with bevel side of snap ring out.
4. Place one medium thickness A/C clutch hub spacer inside the A/C clutch hub spline opening and slide the A/C clutch on the end of the compressor shaft.
5. Thread a new 6 mm A/C clutch hub retaining bolt into end of A/C compressor shaft. Hold A/C clutch with Compressor Clutch Holding Tool T94P-19703-AH and tighten A/C clutch hub retaining bolt to 11-14 N.m (9-10 Lb-Ft) .
6. Check and adjust air gap.
7. When installing a new A/C clutch, cycle it 10 times at idle to burnish it and prevent slippage.

A/C Clutch Air Gap :

1. Measure air gap between A/C clutch and A/C clutch pulley mating surfaces at three equally spaced locations with Feeler Gauge D81L-4201-A or equivalent. Record the measurements.
2. If each of the three measurements taken is not within 0.35-0.85 mm (0.014-0.033 inch) , remove the A/C clutch.
3. Remove and measure the A/C clutch hub spacer. Select the appropriate thickness A/C clutch hub spacer to place the air gap within specified limits.
4. Install A/C clutch hub spacer and A/C clutch. Recheck air gap measurement.

 

[Slow5.0hh]

Today I used feeler gauge to check clutch gap and it was .39 inches or .591 mm (had to use 2 sets .19 & .20 inches or should I say .483 & .508 mm)

Now my question is do I really have to take a/c clutch out? Can I just try tightening hub retaining bolt a bit to get it down within specs which should be according to Tony's posted link .35-.75mm?

Tony you said I shouldn't have to remove compressor, so try to do it underneath or from the top?


thanks

 

[Tony2005]

1. Measure air gap between A/C clutch and A/C clutch pulley mating surfaces at three equally spaced locations with Feeler Gauge D81L-4201-A or equivalent. Record the measurements.
2. If each of the three measurements taken is not within 0.35-0.85 mm (0.014-0.033 inch) , remove the A/C clutch"

Did you measure at 3 equally spaced locations?

I would not suggest tightening the bolts (unless it is obviously loose).

If you have ramps, I would suggest driving up the ramp first. Then you can reach from the top or bottom (go with whichever gives you more room). If you don't have ramps, then go from the top.

 

[Slow5.0hh]

OK I went to the garage as soon as you posted that, and I checked 3 different spots, with different combinations, so forget my previous post since I used new combination to get .40 inches (.12, .13 & .15 inches)

So 2 spots had same gap .40 inches (1.016 mm) and 3rd spot was .42 inches (1.169 mm)

I couldn't find combination of .41 inch, and I didn't need one, so Tony what do you say, can I keep this clutch or do I have to buy a new one?

 

[Tony2005]

I took it apart and grind that shim down from 1mm to .55mm, and now there is real short cycle, ever 1-2 seconds, I set that hose with the gauge from AZ and it goes up and down all the time, from 20-50 psi (with this gauge set on low port side) and that's when my switch was set to Max AC.

Now I have two questions for you,

1. Does that mean it's low on freon?

2. If I leave AC Gauge on low port side and turn of the switch from Max AC to Off setting, why does that gauge shows arrow in red spot (warning)? Or maybe that's how it's suppost to be if it's not turned on?



thanks

Might need to "shim" it down a little more. And you may want to borrow an A/C gauge with numbers instead of just the colors. That way, the pressure reading will be more accurate. And yes, it does show much higher when it is not on.

And from a previous threads. Pressure from the low side port should range from 25 to 55 PSI. I would get it past 45 PSI.

... Low side will stay pretty close to the same, range from 25 to 55 lbs. .......

....

Check the charge level (static pressure) first. You need at least 45 psi static in order to permit the system to operate. If you don't have the minimum charge in the system, it will never cycle on its own.

You can momentarily jumper the cycling switch connector to see if the clutch engages. If so, either the charge is too low or the switch is bad (if the charge is adequate).

Steve