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bnoon
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Any interest in tubular adj. rear control arms?
#513562 - 01/27/04 01:12 PM
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As the title says... Adjustable rear control arms... Any interest? Polished aluminum most likely, with rod ends in varying grades/expenses for racing.
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"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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Yes
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Zip-Zap-Pow!
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I would not recommend aluminum. Cro-moly steel would be better. This would include all the hardware to space the heim joint correctly in the rear subframe correct? What ballpark price are you talking about?
I've already boxed in the forward arms in preperation of making adjustable rear arms. 
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Long time CEG'er back again.
Fast 95 SE
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bnoon
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Originally posted by Zip-Zap-Pow!:
I would not recommend aluminum. Cro-moly steel would be better. This would include all the hardware to space the heim joint correctly in the rear subframe correct? What ballpark price are you talking about?
I've already boxed in the forward arms in preperation of making adjustable rear arms.
The aluminum has a tensile pullout strength constant of over 19,000 pounds and a compression strength of over 80,000. A huge pothole has 4 times the load bearing strength for each wheel. 4,000 pound car = 1,000 pounds per wheel times 4 = 4,000 load = less than 4.5 times the constant... That's also good to over 4 lateral G's. Granted, your car will handle better, but not that much better! You wish!  The only reason to go with steel over aluminum is if you're planning on an off road rally event! 
Circle track racers use aluminum, drag cars use aluminum, many street cars use aluminum. It's mostly a matter of keeping 1" minimum threads entered on the rod ends...
The target price is around $150 per pair for the entry level ones and around $250 or so for the ones with heavy duty rod ends (last up to ten times longer). This will include all bolts/spacers/etc needed for installation. Powder coating will most likely be an upgrade option too through Buckshot Motorsports (he's here in town).
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"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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mr_froge
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Will they fit on the 99-00 Cougars??
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- Rich
LBC Performance Motorsports Group/AMSOIL
'98 Cougar V6 ATX aka 'Candy Striper'
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Stevers
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Brad, any way you could come up with some front control arms (horizonal style bushings)? I know TH was working on them at one point.
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-06 GTO Torrid Red/M6
-98 LS with BPU
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bnoon
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Originally posted by mr_froge:
Will they fit on the 99-00 Cougars??
My guess is yes, they would work. I know the Cougars share most, if not all, of their suspension with the tours.
Originally posted by Trogdor Burninator:
Brad, any way you could come up with some front control arms (horizonal style bushings)? I know TH was working on them at one point.
Nope. Front suspension is much harder to fabricate and prone to failure because it involves welding. The rear bars I'm making are easier to failsafe because they're already tested for strength and will be unaltered from initial design (straight rod, no welding). If I made front arms, I would have to test those welds to make sure I wouldn't kill someone.
<Possability> I will be having spherical adjustable links for the sway bars too though, which *should* work on all four corners. </Possability>
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"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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I would buy a set.
I installed poly bushings in the stock ones and IMO it made no difference. Well other then the fact the bushings will never rot away.
The stock control arms are just too structurally weak to notice any difference in bushing material. I even added a few more insulators to help to no avail.
I was already planning to remove them (when it's warmer ) and fill them with 94A urethane casting compound (I.E. soft rock  ) like I did the front control arms & roll resistors.
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2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
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bnoon
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Good. All I have to do is get some measurements and these will be started... Stock arm center to center is what I need in case someone can get it quicker than I can. I have to find time to go over to Buckshot's house to measure his since my test mule is long gone...
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"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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RogerB
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Originally posted by bnoon:
Good. All I have to do is get some measurements and these will be started... Stock arm center to center is what I need in case someone can get it quicker than I can. I have to find time to go over to Buckshot's house to measure his since my test mule is long gone...
What, you mean you don't need 30 confirmed buyers with cash up front? What are you, a real entrepreneur?
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Function before fashion.
'96 Contour SE
"Toss the Contour into a corner, and it's as easy to catch as a softball thrown by a preschooler." -Edmunds, 1998
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http://www.spmotorsports.com/ATCcontour_susp_controlarms.html
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Chris G.
~ 98 Mystique LS ATX
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Thinkmoto
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What kind of Aluminum are you using? T6061 or 7075..Just curious that's all.
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
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Originally posted by Antiramie:
http://www.spmotorsports.com/ATCcontour_susp_controlarms.html
I hope the ones that are made are stronger than the spmotorsport ones.
BUT, I'd be in, I need to get my rear taken care of this summer, box in the aussie bar, add these on. . .
$250 + yellow powdercoating for me!!
Suneil
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New Ride
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Originally posted by Antiramie:
http://www.spmotorsports.com/ATCcontour_susp_controlarms.html
Very bad fit and finish from the SHOShop set.
I know a few people who could not even get them to fit and of course SHOShop acting as usual did not even help or refund the product.
I'd buy from Brad & Rick over SHOShop any day of the week!
Besides Aluminum is much lighter then steel and in unsprung weight that means a lot to every aspect of performance. 
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2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
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bnoon
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Originally posted by Antiramie:
http://www.spmotorsports.com/ATCcontour_susp_controlarms.html
Rubber bushings and made of steel... Two ways mine are better. Rubber bushings cost less than 1/4 what the rod ends do for a third reason. Tell me who's is a better value?
Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
What kind of Aluminum are you using? T6061 or 7075..Just curious that's all.
The supplier hasn't actually told me that one yet. They only gave me the specs I asked for. I'm not into metalergy (SP?), so a number wouldn't mean much to me... EDIT: Just got that info, it's 6061-T6511.
Originally posted by RogerB:
What, you mean you don't need 30 confirmed buyers with cash up front? What are you, a real entrepreneur?
Nope, not as long as the customer understands I'll be doing these on a "per order" basis which makes it a week or so minimum before I can make them and ship them out. That way, I can keep a minimum of "extras" on hand so that I don't get burned if sales are minimal.
I'll have pics of my trailing arms for the T.A., which will be made the exact same way as the control arms for the tours/coogs. Just FYI, the strength of this aluminum used in a trailing arm is good for up to .6 second 60 foot times. Don't I wish!!!
EDIT: I got a pic of what the actual rods ends, aluminum bars, rubber rod end boots, and spacers will look like from someone who had done it before.
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
Edited by bnoon (01/28/04 09:10 AM)
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bnoon
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Thanks for the sticky suspension moderators!!!
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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RogerB
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OK, this might be a silly question...
Is there a bushing, or is this a solid metal on metal connection (Is that the definition of "rod end")? If there's a bushing, is it poly or rubber?
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Function before fashion.
'96 Contour SE
"Toss the Contour into a corner, and it's as easy to catch as a softball thrown by a preschooler." -Edmunds, 1998
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Buckshot77
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Learned patience the hard way
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The bushing most likely will be a bronze piece so it's a full metal connection if these are done the same way I made mine. If my car weren't covered in snow right now I'd try to snap a pic of my setup.
Rick
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Owner of 00 #1611 Silver (Totalled) 98.5 T-Red SVT #6180
Buckshot77@msn.com
Misc 3L parts for sale
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bnoon
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There is no need for a bushing if the hardware size can match the rod end hole size. There are 3 sizes available in the 3/4" rod ends, so we'll see. It will still be a full metal on metal connection, either way.
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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DemonSVT
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Originally posted by bnoon:
There is no need for a bushing if the hardware size can match the rod end hole size. There are 3 sizes available in the 3/4" rod ends, so we'll see. It will still be a full metal on metal connection, either way.
In layman's terms that means NO DEFLECTION! Just accurate and consistent movement and stable suspension geometry.
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2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
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Buckshot77
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The bushing I had to use was to get the hole size through the rod end equal to the bolt size where it connects to the subframe.
Rick
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Owner of 00 #1611 Silver (Totalled) 98.5 T-Red SVT #6180
Buckshot77@msn.com
Misc 3L parts for sale
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bnoon
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Originally posted by Buckshot77:
The bushing I had to use was to get the hole size through the rod end equal to the bolt size where it connects to the subframe.
Rick
Exactly. The 3/4" rod ends can come with 3/4" hole, 5/8" hole, or 1/2" hole. If we can use one of those sizes of hardware, we won't need any bushings. If we're forced to use other sizes of hardware, then we'll need the bushings.
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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Kremithefrog
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Is this something that a normal (street) contour would benefit from? Is it easy to install? Or should I just leave this one to the fast contours?
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98.5 SVT
91 Escort GT (almost sold)
96 ATX Zetec (i brake to watch you swerve)
FS: SVT rear sway bar
WTB: Very cheap beater
CEG Dragon Run - October 13-15
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Buckshot77
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Since I was using the stock cammed bolts I had to use a reducing bushing so I don't think we'll be able to get away from that, plus there's an issue with the thickness of the rod ends versus the thickness of the original bushing that's being replaced that also comes into play to make the bushing a good idea.
Come crawl under my car this weekend Brad ! LOL it's only got 6" of snow around it.
Rick
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Owner of 00 #1611 Silver (Totalled) 98.5 T-Red SVT #6180
Buckshot77@msn.com
Misc 3L parts for sale
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bnoon
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Originally posted by Buckshot77:
Since I was using the stock cammed bolts I had to use a reducing bushing so I don't think we'll be able to get away from that, plus there's an issue with the thickness of the rod ends versus the thickness of the original bushing that's being replaced that also comes into play to make the bushing a good idea.
Come crawl under my car this weekend Brad ! LOL it's only got 6" of snow around it.
Rick
Yeah, we'll need a spacer for the width (as shown in the pic above), but I'll still try to order the rod ends so that we wouldn't need a bushing since there's no cost difference. Otherwise the price goes up for the aluminum bushing stock.
I'll be over... What time are you going to be out there tomorrow??? I need to clean up those TPI parts...
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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bnoon
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Originally posted by Kremithefrog:
Is this something that a normal (street) contour would benefit from? Is it easy to install? Or should I just leave this one to the fast contours?
Pretty much for only autocross cars and above. A street tour shouldn't even be worried about adjusting the rear arms... Unless you view offramps as the last corner of the Indy 500, then a street car owner may want to buy some.
Fairly easy to install, but you would need a 4 wheel alignment after installation to make sure you didn't add 10 degrees of camber to the rear tires.
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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Kremithefrog
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Originally posted by bnoon:
you view offramps as the last corner of the Indy 500, then a street car owner may want to buy some.
Hehe, I gotta have some fun sometime. Most of my exits all involve me turning toward the right,, guess how my tires' wear pattern looks. If these get done soon enough and prices are within my small budget, I might would be in for this,, I realize my car won't be fast (or even not slow) w/o a buncha money put into it, but it sure can handle good.
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98.5 SVT
91 Escort GT (almost sold)
96 ATX Zetec (i brake to watch you swerve)
FS: SVT rear sway bar
WTB: Very cheap beater
CEG Dragon Run - October 13-15
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RogerB
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Originally posted by DemonSVT:
Originally posted by bnoon:
There is no need for a bushing if the hardware size can match the rod end hole size. There are 3 sizes available in the 3/4" rod ends, so we'll see. It will still be a full metal on metal connection, either way.
In layman's terms that means NO DEFLECTION! Just accurate and consistent movement and stable suspension geometry.
It also means extra care to lubrication. Not a bad thing, necessarily, but it certainly is not as mindless as driving an OEM "appliance."
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Function before fashion.
'96 Contour SE
"Toss the Contour into a corner, and it's as easy to catch as a softball thrown by a preschooler." -Edmunds, 1998
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Are they going to be the greaseable heim joints? I am interested either way.....
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2005 Ford F150 SuperCab FX4
1964 Chevrolet Impala SS
1998 CSVT: 354HP/328TQ @ 10 psi, now gone 
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ExDelayed
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Ooh, I like this idea.
How are you planning on connecting the sway bar? I have heim joints right now and would like to keep them.
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· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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bnoon
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Originally posted by ExDelayed:
Ooh, I like this idea.
How are you planning on connecting the sway bar? I have heim joints right now and would like to keep them.
They make crimp style brackets with threaded holes for heim joints or end links to sway bars. I couldn't remember without looking if the rear bars even connected directly to the bar... I guess they do. 
I'll be measuring Rick's car up this weekend hopefully. If we're unable to measure it up, I may have to offer a free set to someone to drive up here to measure them up and install them or something... Interested??? Demon??? 
Originally posted by Swazo:
Are they going to be the greaseable heim joints? I am interested either way.....
I think I'm pretty much going to offer about any kind of heim joint from greaseable entry level ones up to the nylon impregnated kind that don't need any more lube. They will all feature the rubber boot seals to keep dirt out of the joint for much improved life though, so that they will last at least a couple of years before needing replacement.
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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DemonSVT
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Originally posted by bnoon:
I'll be measuring Rick's car up this weekend hopefully. If we're unable to measure it up, I may have to offer a free set to someone to drive up here to measure them up and install them or something... Interested??? Demon???
ME ME ME!!!
I know how to measure things really well man... 
I'll at least help test fit the first or second set.
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2000 SVT #674
13.47 @ 102 - All Motor!
It was not broke; Yet I fixed it anyway.
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bnoon
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LOL! I'll let you know how it goes this weekend then. If nothing else, I'll offer you some sort of discount on the first production set.
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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weargle
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So am I correct in assuming that these would be illegal in STS/STX?
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Whirling dervish of FFOG.
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bnoon
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I've ordered the first set of bars and rod ends. I'm having trouble finding a sway bar bracket to clamp to the bar though. 1.125" bar if anyone knows of anything that will work or has any ideas... I thought I had it figured out by using a balast bracket from a roundy round race car site, but they only go down to 1.25" sizes...
Illegal in STS/STX? Are those SCCA classes or something???
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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ExDelayed
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Let me examine the sway bar mounts on my truck. The bar mounts to the strut rods by means of close to what you are talking about. If its two piece, the bottom could be used to wrap around the control arm and then bolt a heim joint (or similar) to the top of the swaybar.
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· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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FlechaAutoSports
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definately interested
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ExDelayed
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The sway bar mounting bracket that is on the truck could possibly work in this situation. I dont have any measurements, other then just visual (I was looking through a small gap between the snow and the bumper). It is using two metal straps (for lack of a better word) that bolt together around the strut rod creating a loop. The rubber bushing goes inside of that. Right now the other end holds the normal sandwich style sway bar end link, but it could probably be easily removed and tapped to accept a heim joint. It also looks like it is the same height as our factory setup, if not just a tad bit shorter, which would be better for lowered cars.
The Dodge dealer could probably give you exact measurements, just make sure you have them look it up for a 2wd, the 4wd bracket is completely different.
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· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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ExDelayed
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Here is what I am talking about. This pic is 1280x960 so you will have plenty of detail. Clicky!
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· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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Thinkmoto
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Originally posted by bnoon:
I've ordered the first set of bars and rod ends. I'm having trouble finding a sway bar bracket to clamp to the bar though. 1.125" bar if anyone knows of anything that will work or has any ideas... I thought I had it figured out by using a balast bracket from a roundy round race car site, but they only go down to 1.25" sizes...
Illegal in STS/STX? Are those SCCA classes or something???
Any word on these yet? About that sway bar attachment. What about a 2 piece aluminum clamp? You could very easily make one yourself. Bore the clamp to the O.D. of the control arm tube, drill 2 holes and tap for pinch bolts, saw the block in half(so it can squeeze down on the control arm)and drill and tap a mounting hole for a heim joint/threaded rod etc to connect the sway bar end link. Just an idea...basically just like proir posts pic, but aluminum.
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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ExDelayed
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Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
basically just like proir posts pic, but aluminum.
Plus it could be made slightly smaller so we wouldnt have that insanely large rubber bushing.
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· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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FlechaAutoSports
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I REALLY want some of these!!!!
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bnoon
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I've been working on the Trans Am to get it ready for a midwestern F-body meet. Once I'm done playing with that, then I can get back to the Contour parts. I've got most of the Contour suspension parts purchsed, or the stock to machine the parts from at least, sitting on my front bench. They will come out soon, I promise you that.
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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Thinkmoto
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Have you came up with an idea on how to mount the sway bar end links to the control arms? I'm probably going to make set myself for the rear arms. But I'm not sure about the fronts yet...probably gonna fab up something at work.
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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dpa43
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I would be interested in buying a set. Just let me know.
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Originally posted by Davo:
Good work, Dave. You're definitely the #1 interior guy around these parts; always innovating.
Redline Goods ShifterBoots:5% Discount
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Blackcoog
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Did these ever pan out?
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1999 3.0L Cougar: 220fwhp and 200tq
2003 VW Passat W8 with 4 Motion AWD
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/300644
PM for intrest in 3L SVT Contours, 3L swaps into your current car, Prepped 3L engines, or anything 3L related.
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Lee
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Since I just found out mine are bent on the project car, I'd rather pay Brad then Ford. Definitely interested.
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Lee Cox
No Contours to speak of...
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99cougar
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?????
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1999 Cougar V6 MTX
SVT UIM/LIM/65mm TB, I/H/E, Fidanza/SPEC III/Torsen, Koni/GC's, 19" Icon wheels w/ Pirelli rubber, NX Wet Kit
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NVSVT
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Brad,
Please don't let this project die!
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The Original Owner of 1998 SVT Contour #3384 of 6535,
Toreador Red/Midnight Blue, Assembled September 3rd, 1997
Also the Original Owner of a 1998.5 Contour SE Sport V6 5-speed,
Vibrant White/Greystone Sport Cloth, Assembled August 6th, 1998
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Aspire
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New guy here, would these control arms affect the need to reinforce (box in) the subframe when going to a larger rear swaybar.
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'00 CSVT Koni/B&G (New), SCA intake, 18 inch Falken Circuit Spec (gunmetal), CF hood, Headlights by Dan, Mirko, deleted front license plate/painted chrome ring. Headers/y pipe installed - TruBendz Borla system no Res and optimized TB. Getting there!
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NVSVT
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When you install a larger sway bar on your car you should reinforce the sub-frame, whether you install new control arms or not.
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The Original Owner of 1998 SVT Contour #3384 of 6535,
Toreador Red/Midnight Blue, Assembled September 3rd, 1997
Also the Original Owner of a 1998.5 Contour SE Sport V6 5-speed,
Vibrant White/Greystone Sport Cloth, Assembled August 6th, 1998
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ExDelayed
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*sigh* I thought there was an update.
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· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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So I'm guessing these will be better than the others offered in the group buy for the tubular control arms. What advantages will these have. I have the koni's with rousch lowering springs right now. Will this help at getting my car aligned. This is just my street car but I drive it everyday like I'm in the Indy 500..lol..  ...I went through 2 engines in 2 months. If that gives you an idea...lol.Also I own a 2000 v6 mtx cougar...I'm guessing these will work for me also. Let me know. Thanks alot!
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Hey...Can you make a set of front tubular control arms too?...  .Hate the wheel hop...n it will just get worse when I drop in that big 3.0 with the turbo  . That would be great...been wanting a set but Gforce said they won't be making them till later this year..
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99cougar
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a 3L turbo ain't gonna hop its gonna spin! foreverrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr......................
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1999 Cougar V6 MTX
SVT UIM/LIM/65mm TB, I/H/E, Fidanza/SPEC III/Torsen, Koni/GC's, 19" Icon wheels w/ Pirelli rubber, NX Wet Kit
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Bradness
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These are different, not better or worse, than the "toe control arms". Look at your rr suspension and you'll see 3 arms per side, 2 lateral arms and 1 logitudinal. The arms Brad Noon is contemplating making are the forward rear control arms (Ford-speak). They take the majority of the rear suspension loads and the sway bar is attached to them.
Once you've lowered your car the camber setting is likely way outside the factory tolerance. My 95 at stock ride height was outside factory tolerance for camber! To date, there is no way of adjusting rear camber.
Even if Brad could build enough adjustment in to the main control arms you'll still need a set of adjustable toe control arms to match, otherwise your toe settings will be out of whack. My (rough) calculations show that you'll need and extra .25" for .5 degree of camber change.
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Redcoat Raceworks. Performance parts and custom fabricating for Contours, Mystiques and Cougars. Specializing in chassis and suspension parts. Custom end links, control arms, strut tower bars, engine torque braces, etc.
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NVSVT
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CEG'er
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I checked with Brad Noon and he indicated that his intention is to make both the forward control arms AND the trailing arms. The forward and trailing arms will both be fabricated out of aluminum and he will also be making custom CNCd, billet aluminum sway bar mounts. However, before he can go any further he needs to have someone loan him a car so he can take the required measurements. If I recall correctly, DemonSVT was supposed to be providing his car for the measurements.
I would loan him one of my cars, but Las Vegas is a loooooong way away.
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The Original Owner of 1998 SVT Contour #3384 of 6535,
Toreador Red/Midnight Blue, Assembled September 3rd, 1997
Also the Original Owner of a 1998.5 Contour SE Sport V6 5-speed,
Vibrant White/Greystone Sport Cloth, Assembled August 6th, 1998
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Bradness
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Fabricating the trailing arms won't make a speck of difference to the toe settings. He needs to make both lateral arms for the rr suspension. The trailing arms are longitudinal.
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Redcoat Raceworks. Performance parts and custom fabricating for Contours, Mystiques and Cougars. Specializing in chassis and suspension parts. Custom end links, control arms, strut tower bars, engine torque braces, etc.
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NVSVT
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Originally posted by Bradness:
Fabricating the trailing arms won't make a speck of difference to the toe settings. He needs to make both lateral arms for the rear suspension. The trailing arms are longitudinal.
You’re correct. The Contour has (4) transverse lower control arms and (2) longitudinal links; NO trailing arms at all. I used the wrong term to describe the REAR transverse lower control arms.
Months ago Brad indicated to me that he was going to make all (4) transverse lower control arms, but I haven't seen anything here for a very long time and I'm beginning to think this is dead!
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The Original Owner of 1998 SVT Contour #3384 of 6535,
Toreador Red/Midnight Blue, Assembled September 3rd, 1997
Also the Original Owner of a 1998.5 Contour SE Sport V6 5-speed,
Vibrant White/Greystone Sport Cloth, Assembled August 6th, 1998
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Bradness
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Now we're getting in to semantics.... Trailing or leading arms, their long axis is frt to rr.
Now I looked into doing tubular forward rr control arms 2-3 years ago. I spoke in depth to a stock car builder and he assured me that simply boxing in the existing stockers would be just as strong as custom built tubular ones. Then on our cars you have the problem of somehow connecting the sway bar via end link to a round tube. Basically, you will have to make a custom end link also.
I simply boxed the stockers and replaced the rubber bushings with machined solid alloy ones (or I coulda' used polyurethane). IMO, aluminum at the rr of the car is overkill as the heavy end is the front and that's where you should be looking for weight savings.
Can the stockers be made adjustable too? Quite possibly-I'm looking into it via a set of offset bushings. The problem is the factory tolerance on our cars is terrible. Add in dropped rr suspensions and it becomes a real nightmare!
The other problem here is that replacing the forward rr control arms entails dropping the subframe. It can be done, but not really a job for the unitiated.
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Redcoat Raceworks. Performance parts and custom fabricating for Contours, Mystiques and Cougars. Specializing in chassis and suspension parts. Custom end links, control arms, strut tower bars, engine torque braces, etc.
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Buckshot77
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Learned patience the hard way
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Brad has access to my car and I actually fabbed up the original set of the rearmost lca's a couple years back. With both our hectic schedules, it's been tough getting much new fab work done. I attempted boxing a set of front's but got carried away with the welding and melted the original rubber bushings from the heat so I gave up on it for the time being, but that again was a couple years ago.
Rick
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Owner of 00 #1611 Silver (Totalled) 98.5 T-Red SVT #6180
Buckshot77@msn.com
Misc 3L parts for sale
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Thinkmoto
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Someone needs to get me a set of the front/rear control arms so I can box them in with the old TIG
Now about not being able to connect the sway bar to a round tube front control arm....what if you used bigger rod ends that would actually have the eyelet be the same as the control arm O.D. ? A couple of clampable stops and the sway bar mount pivots turns yet stays still.....I might just get creative one of these days and do my rear control arms and maybe try the fronts while I'm at it. I have a pile of rod ends lying around and I can always swipe some from work
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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ExDelayed
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Originally posted by Bradness:
Then on our cars you have the problem of somehow connecting the sway bar via end link to a round tube.
A heim joint conversion for the sway bar helps in not trashing the urethane bushings that my Aussie Bar so happily did, a few times. The drawback is that there isnt much room for two heim joints and still keeping the sway bar flat at ride height.
What about using a larger heim joint, installed onto the bar before assembly, so that the smaller heim joint could screw into it from above? You would need some kind of stopper to keep the joints, and the sway bar, from moving from side to side.
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· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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bnoon
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Redneck Troll
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Originally posted by NVSVT:
Brad,
Please don't let this project die!
It's not totally dead yet. I still need a car to prototype on... perhaps it's time for a new post...
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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Buckshot77
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Learned patience the hard way
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Reged: 11/24/00
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Got one sitting in the trailer here any time you need it.
Rick
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Owner of 00 #1611 Silver (Totalled) 98.5 T-Red SVT #6180
Buckshot77@msn.com
Misc 3L parts for sale
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Thinkmoto
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Originally posted by Buckshot77:
Got one sitting in the trailer here any time you need it.
Rick
You got a spare control arm? I'd box it in for you.....once I get rid of this damn pneumonia
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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bnoon
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Redneck Troll
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Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
Originally posted by Buckshot77:
Got one sitting in the trailer here any time you need it.
Rick
You got a spare control arm? I'd box it in for you.....once I get rid of this damn pneumonia
He's got a "spare" car since it sits all winter. Must be nice to have a race car and a daily driver!
Rick, does it move under it's own power yet? Ala alternator problem...
--------------------
http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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Thinkmoto
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Originally posted by bnoon:
Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
Originally posted by Buckshot77:
Got one sitting in the trailer here any time you need it.
Rick
You got a spare control arm? I'd box it in for you.....once I get rid of this damn pneumonia
He's got a "spare" car since it sits all winter. Must be nice to have a race car and a daily driver!
Rick, does it move under it's own power yet? Ala alternator problem...
I have 2 csvts also  one runs....well the battery is dead, the other is sitting behind my dads garage with no motor in it.
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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Buckshot77
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Learned patience the hard way
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The battery is up, but I haven't changed the alternator yet. I at least got the trailer opened up this weekend though.
Rick
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Owner of 00 #1611 Silver (Totalled) 98.5 T-Red SVT #6180
Buckshot77@msn.com
Misc 3L parts for sale
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Thinkmoto
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I put a good battery in my car. But, I need a front alignment badly...I'm out 2 parada spec 2's On a side note I dug up some rear control arms, found my spare rod ends,and found some hydraulic tubing that should work quite nicely for my run of control arms. I'm still trying to think of a good way to attach the sway bar to them though. I'm waiting on a response from Mumm for any inside info he can give
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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bnoon
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Redneck Troll
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Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
I put a good battery in my car. But, I need a front alignment badly...I'm out 2 parada spec 2's On a side note I dug up some rear control arms, found my spare rod ends,and found some hydraulic tubing that should work quite nicely for my run of control arms. I'm still trying to think of a good way to attach the sway bar to them though. I'm waiting on a response from Mumm for any inside info he can give
This is what I've come up with so far:
The offset hole will be milled for a 1.125" bar, then the smaller end will be cut off as a cap and clearanced for some amount of compression to grip the bar. The two smaller holes will be drilled and tapped for 3/8" hardware and the other end with the single hole will be drilled/tapped for a 3/4" rod end to attach to the sway bar as an end link type of thing. I still have to measure to make sure I've got the length correct and that the hardware I want to use will fit, but this is the general idea. It's a bit big right now at 2" thick and 5" long, so I will imagine that it will shrink before production happens.
--------------------
http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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DanCanuck
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CEG'er
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I'm interested. I've already gone thru 2 of these factory POS.
dan
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2000 Black SVT #2639/2760; w/18 OZ Superleggera's, Pirelli Pzero Nero.
MSDS Headers,Quaife LSD, CF DF, Borla,,chipped,DMD,Baer Track rotors.
Lowered/HR and Koni's; HPP & OMP
3L Valves w/ P&P Heads (thanks Kinger!)
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Thinkmoto
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Hard-core CEG'er
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Bnoon
You read my mind!!!!!  I too am thinking about making a block/mount that'll hold just like that. Heres the deal I'm going to be ordering some new rod ends today and some lefthanded taps. I'm using some 25mm hydraulic tubing from work on my prototypes. I wanted 1" but of course we had none.  so I'm gonna see how it'll hold up with the 25mm oh its 3mm wall,should more then strong enough. I'm gonna be dropping the subframe out of one of my cars to take measurements and box in the sway bar mounts. I'm also going to be measuring my current aussie bar setup on my EO car to see where it sits right now on the ground. And from there I'll make my bracket. My plan is to have the arms made by the end of the week and hopefully the mounts too. I'll keep you informed.
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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Thinkmoto
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Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
Originally posted by bnoon:
I've ordered the first set of bars and rod ends. I'm having trouble finding a sway bar bracket to clamp to the bar though. 1.125" bar if anyone knows of anything that will work or has any ideas... I thought I had it figured out by using a balast bracket from a roundy round race car site, but they only go down to 1.25" sizes...
Illegal in STS/STX? Are those SCCA classes or something???
Any word on these yet? About that sway bar attachment. What about a 2 piece aluminum clamp? You could very easily make one yourself. Bore the clamp to the O.D. of the control arm tube, drill 2 holes and tap for pinch bolts, saw the block in half(so it can squeeze down on the control arm)and drill and tap a mounting hole for a heim joint/threaded rod etc to connect the sway bar end link. Just an idea...basically just like proir posts pic, but aluminum.
hahahaHey Bnoon I told you to do that almost a year ago  I guess I should have took my own advice and did it.
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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bnoon
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Redneck Troll
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Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
Originally posted by bnoon:
I've ordered the first set of bars and rod ends. I'm having trouble finding a sway bar bracket to clamp to the bar though. 1.125" bar if anyone knows of anything that will work or has any ideas... I thought I had it figured out by using a balast bracket from a roundy round race car site, but they only go down to 1.25" sizes...
Illegal in STS/STX? Are those SCCA classes or something???
Any word on these yet? About that sway bar attachment. What about a 2 piece aluminum clamp? You could very easily make one yourself. Bore the clamp to the O.D. of the control arm tube, drill 2 holes and tap for pinch bolts, saw the block in half(so it can squeeze down on the control arm)and drill and tap a mounting hole for a heim joint/threaded rod etc to connect the sway bar end link. Just an idea...basically just like proir posts pic, but aluminum.
hahahaHey Bnoon I told you to do that almost a year ago I guess I should have took my own advice and did it.
Yeah, I already had this design scetched out... Are you the one that showed me pics of some old truck or something that had something similar on it stock? I remember some rusty parts in the pictures and thinking my design would work... Just haven't had the time or money to put the parts out there into production... plus no prototype mule sitting in my garage for the past two years now. Kinda takes the motivation factor and puts it in slow-mo...
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http://www.bnmotorsports.com
"And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my CEG brothers. And you will know I am the Moderator when I lay my vengeance upon you."
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Thinkmoto
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Originally posted by bnoon:
Yeah, I already had this design scetched out... Are you the one that showed me pics of some old truck or something that had something similar on it stock? I remember some rusty parts in the pictures and thinking my design would work... Just haven't had the time or money to put the parts out there into production... plus no prototype mule sitting in my garage for the past two years now. Kinda takes the motivation factor and puts it in slow-mo...
slow mo I hear yah..I have 2 of these cars and I'm just starting to get my butt in gear. I was at work till midnite machining parts tonight trying to get ahead for once. I don't remember who posted the truck pics but I do remember them. Me+ 6-7 days at work a week+new homeowner+gutted half of house=NO TIME!!!!! and I just got over pneumonia
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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ExDelayed
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Originally posted by bnoon:
Are you the one that showed me pics of some old truck or something that had something similar on it stock? I remember some rusty parts in the pictures and thinking my design would work...
If its the pics that I am thinking of, those would have been from me. I can get you more pics and measurements if you want. Just shoot me a PM.
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· Jon Miconi
· Coming Soon!
· 01 Cougar
· 98 V70R
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Thinkmoto
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I started the forward rear control arms yesterday. Me and another ceger are sorting through ideas on that clamp/sway bar mount. I'm gonna dig up some AL for the clamp and try to mill 2 out this week. I still have to make centering spacers for the rod ends though. Hopefully in a few more weeks I'll be installing this stuff in my car or another cegers car I have a subframe to beef up also I might mock up the whole thing on my bench to see if it'll work or not.
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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hmouta
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so any updates on these? maybe i missed it but these r going to be camber adjustable right?
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Hugo AIM:omegazodiac
95 gl & 99 contour svt #1750/2760
my profile pics stuff for sale
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PaulDaJedi
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hmmm seems likelots of people start to make these then go nowhere with them. I am giving up on waiting and just havint sombdoy box all 4 rear control arms heheh
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99 merc cougar, Auto cross junkie
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Thinkmoto
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Originally posted by PaulDaJedi:
hmmm seems likelots of people start to make these then go nowhere with them. I am giving up on waiting and just havint sombdoy box all 4 rear control arms heheh
I hope they know how to weld. The stock forward arms are very thin and will warp like hell most likely. I haven't had the time to make the forward ones yet. I still need a good way to attach the sway bar to the round tube correctly and solidly.
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06 GMC Sierra 2500HD Dmax/ally
06 Pontiac G6 GT
05 CRF250R
FOR SALE 06 KX65 with riding gear $2700 obo
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NVSVT
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Originally posted by Thinkmoto:
I hope they know how to weld. The stock forward arms are very thin and will warp like hell most likely. I haven't had the time to make the forward ones yet. I still need a good way to attach the sway bar to the round tube correctly and solidly.
I am currently having (3) sets of billet aluminum sway bar mounts CNCed for me along with (3) sets of billet aluminum control arms. I designed the parts for my Contours, but I am also having an extra set made for a friend (providing he will sign a liability waiver).
I considered offering the parts in a “one time only Group Buy”, but because we live in such a litigious society I’m not going to make the control arms for anyone except me and maybe one friend. I may offer the billet aluminum sway bar mounts for sale to those with enough skill and ambition to build their own control arms, but even that would be dependant on whether or not the outside diameter of their control arms matches the inside diameter of my sway bar mounts. In addition, anyone using my sway bar mounts would have to either build their own adjustable sway bar end links or buy a set from me. And you can believe me when I say that none of this has been cheap. I have got to be nuts to be spending this much money on a Ford!
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The Original Owner of 1998 SVT Contour #3384 of 6535,
Toreador Red/Midnight Blue, Assembled September 3rd, 1997
Also the Original Owner of a 1998.5 Contour SE Sport V6 5-speed,
Vibrant White/Greystone Sport Cloth, Assembled August 6th, 1998
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SCSVT
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Well -you might not be that crazy to make a group buy seeming that you would be the only provider at the moment!
Sho Shop- not available!
Ford-back order until who knows when!
BAT- I'm not sure the quality! Can't get a response from anyone.
I'm needing a set or rear control arms(thin one/toe) and am having trouble finding any.
Just a thought, but it mighty benifit you or at least someone.
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Christian
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Ooh ... and there's me just thinking I should do this on my new car. Damned perfect timing to read this possibility!!
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1998.5 T-Red on Midnight Blue SVT
Build Number 5320 of 6535
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NVSVT
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Originally posted by SCSVT:
I need a set or rear control arms (thin one/toe) and am having trouble finding any.
Contact Bradness; he makes those.
As I said, we live in a highly litigious society so I won’t make the (forward) control arms for anyone except me. I am not a mechanical or structural engineer and I don’t have access to the facilities required to test my control arms, so I can’t be sure that they will hold up in every situation and/or condition that a CEGer may throw at them. I’m sure that if someone were injured or killed because one of my control arms failed I would be sued. Being sued is only part of the reason though; I’m not sure I could live with my self if someone were injured or killed because of me.
On the other hand, I’ve never heard of someone crashing because of a broken sway bar mount. For that reason I MAY consider selling my billet aluminum sway bar mounts.
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The Original Owner of 1998 SVT Contour #3384 of 6535,
Toreador Red/Midnight Blue, Assembled September 3rd, 1997
Also the Original Owner of a 1998.5 Contour SE Sport V6 5-speed,
Vibrant White/Greystone Sport Cloth, Assembled August 6th, 1998
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Bradness
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This (litigation) is something that was foremost in my mind when I first considered building rr control arms. The fact that I decided to build toe control arms instead of the main control arms reflects this. The main control arms handle most of the lateral loads at the rear of the car.
The other problem was how to attach an end link to a tube. I've seen tubular Focus arms with end link attachments but they were less than impressive. Plus a Focus weighs a lot less than our cars so suspension loads are less.
Good luck NVSVT. Let us know how they work out.
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Redcoat Raceworks. Performance parts and custom fabricating for Contours, Mystiques and Cougars. Specializing in chassis and suspension parts. Custom end links, control arms, strut tower bars, engine torque braces, etc.
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HaFast
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Ummm i read the whole thing and unfortulately i couldnt view any of the pictures cause im on slow @$$ dialup so it it these?
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1995 Mystique, 2.5 V6, MTX, 2.5 inch Exhaust tubing, Vibrant Highflow CAT, Vibrant 2.5 Resonator, Magnaflow Muffler, SVT cams, Ebay Intake *YAWN*, HELLA 550's.
THE FINAL LAP Is my New Best Friend!
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Nick98CSVT
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I believe those are the ones. The pic look likes a Homer Simpson drawing. 
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98 CSVT Black
Alpine CDA 7995
Memphis 1000D & Alpine MRV T302
2 Orion 12's
HPP Rear Strut Bar
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Auto-X Fil
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That drawing is incomplete. There are two sets of arms that lie in the same plane - you need to specify front or rear control arm. This thread encompasses discussions about all three arms: front transverse arm, rear transverse arm, and the longitudinal arm. The one that does the most work is the front transverse arm. This arm is the U-crosssection piece that provides caber control. An adjustable arm there would provide camber adjustability in the rear, as well as less flex in the rear suspension. The difficulties with this arm are because it bears so much load, and needs to have the swaybar link attatched to it. No one wants to make such a safety critical part. The toe control links, that is, the rear transverse links, run from the wheel to the subframe as well, and are much thinner. The adjustability is lousy, but good enough, I think. Tubular members would compliment tubular arms in the front position to provide a more laterally rigid suspension. The longitudinal arms are plenty stiff enough, but have soft bushings like the other arms. They are also very heavy, and while a tubular fab could be difficult, increasing the control of toe under bump; reducing bind; and losing weight might make it worth adding that member to a complete tubular rear.
But no one is actually offering anything for sale.
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-Philip Maynard
'95 Contour [71 STS | Track Whore]
'97 Miata [71 ES | Boulevard Pimp]
2006 autocross results
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wow that would be mint to replace all of those with stronger units. ya the drawing was like a 2 second thing and sorry i couldn't do a 3d rendition for you but im not an artist, i make pizza thats all.
But anyways i would be interested as well cause im currently driving with a bent one and it causes some crazy stuff in the winter. I bent it by drifting to wide on a corner and tapping a curb, and realy it was just a tap but it folded like paper. Silly stamped steel garbage.
I was actualy thinking about creating my own but i aint no math genious and i work too much so i would never have the time.
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1995 Mystique, 2.5 V6, MTX, 2.5 inch Exhaust tubing, Vibrant Highflow CAT, Vibrant 2.5 Resonator, Magnaflow Muffler, SVT cams, Ebay Intake *YAWN*, HELLA 550's.
THE FINAL LAP Is my New Best Friend!
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