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RogerB
Hard-core CEG'er

Reged: 10/21/00
Posts: 3867
Loc: Wichita, KS
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#725131 (Re: Y2KGreenSE) 09/28/04 05:06 PM

Originally posted by 2000GreenTour:
Originally posted by Kremithefrog:
Originally posted by 2000GreenTour:
Originally posted by RogerB:
Ford 500 =






Many auto writers have said that about the Contour, too. Especially if you got a GL.



Where?




Car and Driver did a comparison test in fall of 1997. Tested a 4 banger GL with ATX, came in last out of like 7 cars, so there.

And the 500 isn't meant to be a "Contour SVT replacement". It's a full line car, not a "cult car" like the C-SVT, (or SVT-C for the anal retentives.) Compare it to the plain Contours/Tauruses, and it is world's better.






I would expect the Zetec GL ATX to come in last in a lot of comparos. But even in the first year it was offered here, the Contour came available with a V-6, MTX, and sport suspension. That is a full-line automobile.

The 500 comes out with only one, weak powerplant (for its class), and the "better" model with AWD comes "only" with a CVT automatic. Enthusiasts need not apply.

OK, so the Taurus SHO took a few years to arrive, and there was no manual at first. I don't know what to tell you. I'm not saying the 500 won't sell. I can't predict such things. But my initial assessment stands. Ford aimed low and hit the mark.

Come on, the lowest output of any competitor is the Camry, at 225 hp. The Accord puts out 240, the Maxima, 265. 203hp is OK for the "economy" offering, but Ford needs to come out swinging with a more powerful option on the check sheet, especially for such a heavy car. What about the big Duratec out of the Freestar?

--------------------
Function before fashion.
'96 Contour SE

"Toss the Contour into a corner, and it's as easy to catch as a softball thrown by a preschooler." -Edmunds, 1998

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svt4stv
Addicted CEG'er

Reged: 08/05/04
Posts: 5882
Loc: at the gas station every other day =o(
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#725148 (Re: RogerB) 09/28/04 05:22 PM

Originally posted by RogerB:
Come on, the lowest output of any competitor is the Camry, at 225 hp. The Accord puts out 240, the Maxima, 265. 203hp is OK for the "economy" offering, but Ford needs to come out swinging with a more powerful option on the check sheet, especially for such a heavy car. What about the big Duratec out of the Freestar?




oh, you better not let the General hear say that! Imapala/Malibu=200hp. SC Impala=Accord non-SC hp.

ps on a slightly different note.
a friend of my friend works for a company that develops the police pursuit vehicles. He brought the next gen around to the local rice spot a few weeks ago. Its still a crown vic (cops love them) but they have stuffed the V10 in it. HP on the first one is just above 300hp but the torque was closer to 400 (going off bad memory here). he said they have recently completed the s/c version but i dont recall the #s. my friend who knows him very well said he saw it recently but i wasnt there when he brought it out
he said they will be selling them to police depts and also to the public as well. when i get better idea of the numbers ill post 'em and maybe a pic if he lets me take one of it.

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Originally posted by Tourgasm:


Sometimes you can mess up a word so bad that spell check doens't know what the hell you're talking about.









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Lee K
CEG'er

Reged: 09/05/03
Posts: 109
Loc: North Carolina
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#725206 (Re: RogerB) 09/28/04 06:04 PM

Quote:

OK, so the Taurus SHO took a few years to arrive, and there was no manual at first.




Small correction. The SHO was available only with a manual transmission when it came out in 1989. Four years later in 1993 an automatic version became available, tripling yearly sales volumes.

Former SHO owner.

--------------------
Lee K

98 SVT Contour, silver (sold after 7 years and 100K miles)
03 Lancer Evolution, red

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ITinker
CEG'er

Reged: 06/12/03
Posts: 136
Loc: MN
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#725208 (Re: svt4stv) 09/28/04 06:05 PM

I love how the thread turned into an argument about steering/braking/traction... Anyways, the 500 seems okay with lots of interior space, the constantly variable trans, and the volvo style chasis, however, I honestly doubt it will sell to a lot of people outside the Ford spectrum, but repeat Ford buyers will be happy. It's too underpowered, and the styling is definitely lacking--looking like an updated old style(late 80's) Taurus with some VW undertones. Every review I've looked at has said the ride is incredibly smooth, and the engine--though underpowered--is responsive. This isn't an enthusiast or tuner car (curb weight is almost 2 tons), but there will be a lot of hockey/soccer moms thinking twice about getting an suv(trunk space).
~Just my 2 cents~


--------------------
I think, I tinker, I play around, I build.

'99 Contour
W Ztc, ATX, HID Fog, mesh, A6, B LED, Big 3, Alpine cda-9827, Memphis lvs12 1200w, Alpine 1241, 4xInf K 6x8, Xfire 400/4, 7.2 LCD, glv box "xbox jack" mod, interior horn alarm mod

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Jeb Hoge
Hard-core CEG'er

Reged: 07/23/01
Posts: 3037
Loc: Midlothian, VA
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#725227 (Re: Lee K) 09/28/04 06:15 PM

Originally posted by Lee K:
Quote:

OK, so the Taurus SHO took a few years to arrive, and there was no manual at first.




Small correction. The SHO was available only with a manual transmission when it came out in 1989. Four years later in 1993 an automatic version became available, tripling yearly sales volumes.

Former SHO owner.




IIRC, the auto SHO was also slightly retuned in the suspension to give a little bit more compliance than the hard-edged 5-speed. I was subscribed to Automobile and C&D at the time, and I remember both rags talking about how much they liked the ATX.

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"Think of it, if you like, as a librarian with a G-string under the tweed." Clarkson on the Mondeo.

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Phil Rohtla
Hard-core CEG'er

Reged: 03/26/02
Posts: 1399
Loc: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#725975 (Re: ITinker) 09/29/04 02:00 PM

Yeah, I am not big on the styling, but when I read that the trunk holds 8 sets of golf clubs....lot's o' junk in the trunk

--------------------
98 Silver Frost SVT
97 BMW 540I Sport, six speed

"Blue is for sky, black is for soil, and white is for simplicity, purity and hope for the future"

"A coveted car should never stunt your life, but should make it more rich and interesting."

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Majisto
CEG'er

Reged: 06/18/03
Posts: 389
Loc: Austin, Texas
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#726034 (Re: RogerB) 09/29/04 03:19 PM

Ford doesn't really care about the sports sedan enthusiasts right now. They have the Mustang. Why should they spend more money developing a manual trans for a car that has such a low profit margin already? Ford does own half of Mazda, and Mazda has the sport sedan market with the 3/6. Asking the 500 to be sporty just isn't going to happen. Yes, it's a pig, but those Japanese sedans aren't light-weight anymore either.

The 3rd Gen SHO helped doom sports sedan in Ford's eyes for a while. Yes, no manual trans option could have hurt it to the eyes of a real enthusiast, but how many enthusiasts compared to SUV/Minivan soccer mom buyers are there? Very few. Ford is looking out for the bottom line, because competition is bigger, and profits are slimmer. I would not dare call the Camry sporty. It's got quite a bit of body roll, and the Maxima is over-priced. Who buys a Maxima when they can get it in rear-drive with a more powerful engine at nearly the same price? I think Lincoln should make a RWD version of the 500 with the 3.5 Duratec. That is what will most likely happen IF anything does.

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2000 Contour SE

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April Thompson
New CEG'er

Reged: 11/02/01
Posts: 48
Loc: Moline, IL
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#726063 (Re: Majisto) 09/29/04 04:03 PM

Lincoln is getting the Zephyr next year, and it's FWD/AWD... unless they change things around at the 11th hour. Oh, I agree how boring the FiveHundred's "style" is: it's a Blue Oval Audi! But... look where J Mays came from: VW. Ultraconservative stodgemobiles with a few niche cars once in a while. Timeless, they say. They want a style that isn't out of date three years from now... regardless of the fact most people don't keep cars that long, choosing to lease them for three years on average and then getting the next flavor of the year.

I wonder what exactly has gone wrong with Ford. Look at the Focus: the edgy styling has been watered down, a slab pretending to be a dashboard is sulking behind the windshield, and they don't even try to keep the Getrag 6-speed, even though it's the most modern MTX design (yes, I know it was in the SVT, but it still fits the engine formerly known as the Zetec). What travesty will the real 2nd gen Focus suffer? Then there's the Freestar: looks just like a Windstar, doesn't it? Same unibody, too. So... what's with the name change? And doesn't it sound so much like Freestyle? (Ooh, that's gonna be fun at the dealer!) I think Ford's going for alliteration: Focus, FiveHundred, Freestyle, Freestar, Fusion, yada-yada-yada. .

--------------------
Black/tan early '98 Contour SE Sport; dead-dead-deadsky (gone, split, outta here, afterlife kids)
'05 Pontiac Sunfire; 2.2L Ecotec, ATX, well-equipped
Mom also has black/tan '98 Mystique LS; V6, ATX, Alpine CD deck

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Andy W.
b0x @dm1n

Reged: 07/19/00
Posts: 4397
Loc: Columbia, MD
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#726089 (Re: April Thompson) 09/29/04 04:24 PM

The 500 is built on the same ideals and technology as the Focus, but they are so late to the market with it because the Taurus continued to sell and they are still raping people on SUV prices. They realized with increase gas prices people are starting to move back to cars and they missed the boat on the mid to large end of the market!

-Andy

--------------------
Andy W.
The problem with America is stupidity.
I'm not saying there should be a capital punishment
for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety
labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?


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RogerB
Hard-core CEG'er

Reged: 10/21/00
Posts: 3867
Loc: Wichita, KS
Re: Ford Five Hundred new
#726110 (Re: April Thompson) 09/29/04 04:40 PM

So, in other words, Ford is becoming the Chevy division of GM, but instead of a Corvette, we get a pony car and a rich man's toy.

I'll take my next sedan in a different flavor, thank you. Hmmmm. Bavarian Creme, anyone?

--------------------
Function before fashion.
'96 Contour SE

"Toss the Contour into a corner, and it's as easy to catch as a softball thrown by a preschooler." -Edmunds, 1998

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